5 ms·

> reinvented the higher-end headphone marke There's zero high-endness about Beats headphones. They're all right (at least if they were priced around 30% of the

> reinvented the higher-end headphone marke There's zero high-endness about Beats headphones. They're all right (at least if they were priced around 30% of their current price), but really, they don't sound particularly good.

baddox 12y ago
That doesn't mean they're not part of the higher-end headphone market.
- sz4kerto 12y ago
  High-end is a sonic category, not a price category. There are extremely expensive audio systems that are targeted towards concerts, etc..
  - baddox 12y ago
    That's an interesting definition. I think of it as a synonym of "upscale," which refers explicitly to high price but does generally have a connotation of high quality as well.
    - oaktowner 12y ago
      I agree - I think of "high-end" as indicative of price.
  - vinceguidry 12y ago
    Probably better to call them luxury headphones. That doesn't carry the same connotation of quality that "high-end" does.
  - mikeloeb 12y ago
    One thing I've learned over the last 10 years in the tech world vs. the last 25 years in it, is that the mainstream (via its marketing catalyst) will override traditionally-held beliefs about the uses of technology and the words used to describe it. Hence the public talking about "wifi" instead of "wireless ethernet connected to the internet." The public doesn't know and doesn't respect the world as it was before the products became available which they feel express themselves. I am/was with you in believing that high price doesn't mean "high-end," but that association has now become useless for communicating with the rest of the world. The same can be said for the word "decimate." I've given up trying to use it properly and/or correct anyone. It's over. Also using "data" as plural. The world doesn't want a plan, it wants a dream.
apalmer 12y ago
Factually true, but as they created and own pretty much the entire market for $300 headphones, one has to concede they have the title of high end headphones... high end doesnt necessarily mean highest quality.
- jotm 12y ago
  Not really true - Sony and Sennheiser (as well as AKG and other less known companies) had the market covered already.
  - smackfu 12y ago
    I think the idea is that Beats expanded the market for $200-400 headphones. Yes, Sony sold headphones in that range, but they didn't sell them to every high school student who wanted to look cool.
    - dublinben 12y ago
      This just further underlines the point that Beats are not actually high-end headphones, but fashion items. As such, they're incredibly vulnerable to changing tastes. In the areas around me, Beats have already plummeted from prominence or popularity among young people and cool people.
      - jotm 12y ago
        I've seen that happen, as well. People who can't really afford it pay a couple of hundred for a cool red B on their headphones, then they wisen up and realize that a cool S is a better choice.
    - lloeki 12y ago
      No, at that price they sold to professionals and audiophiles who wanted the sound to actually sound properly, not muddy bass overflowing the mids and highs. Apple definitely bought the brand, not the headphone tech. Otherwise with such a cash stash they would have bought any of Beyerdynamic, Grado, Sennheiser, or the newer entries to headphones like Marshall (the Major is so-so but the Monitor is awesome)
taylorlapeyre 12y ago
It doesn't matter if you're paying for sound quality, fashion, or the brand name. They cost $150-$300. That's higher-end.
- jokoon 12y ago
  it's not worth that price
  - jokoon 12y ago
    hello beats audio employees
- skyebook 12y ago
  Even within Beats own line there are the decidedly "lower" and "higher" end models. The interesting thing, to me, about this is that Beats (the headphone, not the streaming music service) has the high price and is currently high-school chic, but similar things have been said about Apple. In Apple's case they're aided by the product's function being on par with the design.. The Beats stuff seems to consistently fall short of the quality of sound offered by Sennheiser and Sony's stuff.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
christoph 12y ago
Surely this could be said about many other high-end fashion type brands. Expensive Nike trainers aren't worth what they sell for, most designer handbags are worth a fraction of what they sell for. These items also don't have any real technical merit to justify the price.
- thinkofnothing 12y ago
  Fashion runs as a top-down economy. Most of the high-end designers are the ones driving innovation, and other designers/large corps soon imitate these styles a few years later for lower prices.
zacinbusiness 12y ago
I agree 100% You get people listening to Beats headphones that pump so much bass that they destroy the mid and high end. It's stupid to pay that much money for a decidedly low-end product. Just because it's loud doesn't mean it's good. And beyond that, the actual physical quality of Beats headphones is absolute rubbish. I unfortunately bought into the hype my first year of college and picked up a pair and returned them a week later as they were falling apart and sounded like dirt. Bowers and Wilkins are far superior in basically every way.
hackinthebochs 12y ago
High end is all about perception as indicated by price. Technical quality means almost nil. But even on technical quality Beats bring something new to the table. They have a built in amp for christ's sake. They lowered the bar for amped audio to something the masses would use. It is a typical story of reducing friction/barrier to entry and reaping rewards. Every conversation I see about beats speaks of them as garbage and pure marketing etc etc. But this is entirely missing the point of what made beats a success. You can choose to bury your head in the sand or you can open your eyes and actually learn something from the beats phenomenon.
- JetSpiegel 12y ago
  > High end is all about perception as indicated by price. Technical quality means almost nil. Sure, perfect match for Apple.
snowwrestler 12y ago
The fundamental mistake that audio geeks make with Beats is to think that the best headphone delivers a flat response. Beats headphones are not designed to deliver music accurately, they are designed to make it sound cooler. Beats is like the Instagram of music. Yeah, you'll get an objectively higher quality from Photoshop, but Instagram is easier to use and makes things look cool. Apparently there are quality issues with Beats, but that is exactly the sort of problem that Apple is well-equipped to solve.

baddox 12y ago

That doesn't mean they're not part of the higher-end headphone market.

sz4kerto 12y ago
High-end is a sonic category, not a price category. There are extremely expensive audio systems that are targeted towards concerts, etc..
- baddox 12y ago
  That's an interesting definition. I think of it as a synonym of "upscale," which refers explicitly to high price but does generally have a connotation of high quality as well.
  - oaktowner 12y ago
    I agree - I think of "high-end" as indicative of price.
- vinceguidry 12y ago
  Probably better to call them luxury headphones. That doesn't carry the same connotation of quality that "high-end" does.
- mikeloeb 12y ago
  One thing I've learned over the last 10 years in the tech world vs. the last 25 years in it, is that the mainstream (via its marketing catalyst) will override traditionally-held beliefs about the uses of technology and the words used to describe it. Hence the public talking about "wifi" instead of "wireless ethernet connected to the internet." The public doesn't know and doesn't respect the world as it was before the products became available which they feel express themselves. I am/was with you in believing that high price doesn't mean "high-end," but that association has now become useless for communicating with the rest of the world. The same can be said for the word "decimate." I've given up trying to use it properly and/or correct anyone. It's over. Also using "data" as plural. The world doesn't want a plan, it wants a dream.

apalmer 12y ago

Factually true, but as they created and own pretty much the entire market for $300 headphones, one has to concede they have the title of high end headphones... high end doesnt necessarily mean highest quality.

jotm 12y ago
Not really true - Sony and Sennheiser (as well as AKG and other less known companies) had the market covered already.
- smackfu 12y ago
  I think the idea is that Beats expanded the market for $200-400 headphones. Yes, Sony sold headphones in that range, but they didn't sell them to every high school student who wanted to look cool.
  - dublinben 12y ago
    This just further underlines the point that Beats are not actually high-end headphones, but fashion items. As such, they're incredibly vulnerable to changing tastes. In the areas around me, Beats have already plummeted from prominence or popularity among young people and cool people.
    - jotm 12y ago
      I've seen that happen, as well. People who can't really afford it pay a couple of hundred for a cool red B on their headphones, then they wisen up and realize that a cool S is a better choice.
  - lloeki 12y ago
    No, at that price they sold to professionals and audiophiles who wanted the sound to actually sound properly, not muddy bass overflowing the mids and highs. Apple definitely bought the brand, not the headphone tech. Otherwise with such a cash stash they would have bought any of Beyerdynamic, Grado, Sennheiser, or the newer entries to headphones like Marshall (the Major is so-so but the Monitor is awesome)

taylorlapeyre 12y ago

It doesn't matter if you're paying for sound quality, fashion, or the brand name. They cost $150-$300. That's higher-end.

jokoon 12y ago
it's not worth that price
- jokoon 12y ago
  hello beats audio employees
skyebook 12y ago
Even within Beats own line there are the decidedly "lower" and "higher" end models. The interesting thing, to me, about this is that Beats (the headphone, not the streaming music service) has the high price and is currently high-school chic, but similar things have been said about Apple. In Apple's case they're aided by the product's function being on par with the design.. The Beats stuff seems to consistently fall short of the quality of sound offered by Sennheiser and Sony's stuff.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

christoph 12y ago

Surely this could be said about many other high-end fashion type brands. Expensive Nike trainers aren't worth what they sell for, most designer handbags are worth a fraction of what they sell for. These items also don't have any real technical merit to justify the price.

thinkofnothing 12y ago
Fashion runs as a top-down economy. Most of the high-end designers are the ones driving innovation, and other designers/large corps soon imitate these styles a few years later for lower prices.

zacinbusiness 12y ago

I agree 100% You get people listening to Beats headphones that pump so much bass that they destroy the mid and high end. It's stupid to pay that much money for a decidedly low-end product. Just because it's loud doesn't mean it's good. And beyond that, the actual physical quality of Beats headphones is absolute rubbish. I unfortunately bought into the hype my first year of college and picked up a pair and returned them a week later as they were falling apart and sounded like dirt. Bowers and Wilkins are far superior in basically every way.

hackinthebochs 12y ago

High end is all about perception as indicated by price. Technical quality means almost nil. But even on technical quality Beats bring something new to the table. They have a built in amp for christ's sake. They lowered the bar for amped audio to something the masses would use. It is a typical story of reducing friction/barrier to entry and reaping rewards. Every conversation I see about beats speaks of them as garbage and pure marketing etc etc. But this is entirely missing the point of what made beats a success. You can choose to bury your head in the sand or you can open your eyes and actually learn something from the beats phenomenon.

JetSpiegel 12y ago
> High end is all about perception as indicated by price. Technical quality means almost nil. Sure, perfect match for Apple.

snowwrestler 12y ago

The fundamental mistake that audio geeks make with Beats is to think that the best headphone delivers a flat response. Beats headphones are not designed to deliver music accurately, they are designed to make it sound cooler. Beats is like the Instagram of music. Yeah, you'll get an objectively higher quality from Photoshop, but Instagram is easier to use and makes things look cool. Apparently there are quality issues with Beats, but that is exactly the sort of problem that Apple is well-equipped to solve.