7 ms·

Because his planned attack on the sorority failed. The manifesto is gynocidal.

oh_sigh 12y ago
.....and?
girvo 12y ago
And his videos were specifcally saying he hated everyone. He was a severely mentally ill sick person who is now dead and took innocent people with him. Seriously, misogyny doesn't have all that much to do with it, from my perspective. Yes, he was a misogynist, but the unsaid implication I've seen all over the web is that "All misogynists are just like this guy!", which doesn't follow, as far as I'm concerned. I just write misogynists off as sad people that I won't associate with, not violent murderers waiting for a chance to "show the world".
- MartinCron 12y ago
  Part of the fear that many people have is that you can't always tell the difference between a garden-variety "just angry at chicks" guy and a "one bad day away from taking out a sorority guy" until it is too late.
  - girvo 12y ago
    Yeah, I'll grant that. Serial killers throughout history often hid their broken-ness for years while getting away with it all... but this isn't a common occurrence. This isn't something that should factor into a persons risk-assessment while going about their daily life. This is a sad, messed up situation, but the reason it's so news-worthy is because this doesn't happen that often (thank <insert deity>)
    - gordonguthrie 12y ago
      It's not misogny because 'serial killers' - that is a group who are overwhelmingly men, overwhelming same, overwhelmingky kill women and overwhelmingly use sadistic sexual violence and mutilation. > Its newsworthy because it doesn't happen that often. You are kidding me right? Sexual violence is continuous.
      - girvo 12y ago
        Oh for christ's sake, this is obviously pointless. You win. I give. Uncle. Whatever. Also, you're wrong. And if you think misogyny (or whatever cause du jour we're using today) creates serial killers, and not mental illness then you're more than welcome to believe that. Plenty of psychologists say you're entirely incorrect[0], and I'll defer to them on this, but this "discussion" is utterly pointless, as you cherry pick whichever sentence you feel like pulling apart and ignoring the rest of it -- which are facts for the most part, not my opinion. [0] http://time.com/114354/elliot-rodger-ucsb-misogyny/ http://time.com/114354/elliot-rodger-ucsb-misogyny/ Ps. You know, I'm not even arguing that cultural misogyny isn't a problem. I think it is, and am a big believer that we have a problem in our tech industry that we need to fix. What I'm arguing is that you're currently no better than those who blame video games for shootings, ignoring the real cause, which is broken, sick people. EDIT: Oh and you're wrong. Victims are not "overwhelmingly" women, nor is it "overwhelmingly" because of sadistic motives. See [1]: Characteristics of U.S. Serial Killer Victims Sex N% Male 3,854 44.54% Female 4,799 55.46% [1] http://maamodt.asp.radford.edu/Serial%20Killer%20Information%20Center/Serial%20Killer%20Statistics.pdf http://maamodt.asp.radford.edu/Serial%20Killer%20Information...
        gordonguthrie 12y ago
        You're right I was generalising from Scotland/the UK. The definition of Serial Killer being 2 or more unrelating killings. In Scotland there is somewhere between 1 and 3 multiple murders a year, not all of which are serial killings by the strict definition. http://www.scccj.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/0124207_homicide_scotland_10-11.pdf http://www.scccj.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/0124207_h... In the serial killing figures you show the numbers are overwhelming dominated by the US where the high availability of guns make multiple murders more common - and the number of sexual serial killers much less as a proportion. In Europe, I stand by my statement that serial killers are overwhelmingly, etc, etc...
    - MartinCron 12y ago
      This kind of mass murder isn't a common occurrence. But sexual violence against women absolutely is a common occurrence. The way women feel terrorized about this is a real thing. It brings up both unpleasant memories and legitimate fears. This is scary shit. It is OK to be scared by it.
- king_jester 12y ago
  > Yes, he was a misogynist, but the unsaid implication I've seen all over the web is that "All misogynists are just like this guy!", which doesn't follow, as far as I'm concerned. Not all misogynists will act out in physical violence, but misogyny provides fuel for those that do and it also provides excuses for those actions when they occur. Ultimately misogyny encourages violence against women, period. > I just write misogynists off as sad people that I won't associate with, not violent murderers waiting for a chance to "show the world". Which is a privilege you have since you are not the target of misogyny. Women who suffer direct harassment and violence because of misogyny don't get the chance to be so nonchalant about that behavior and cultural influence.
  - girvo 12y ago
    I'll gladly agree with you. But that is not this case. This was severe mental illness, not misogyny. More to the point, to those who said "he killed men because he couldn't kill the sorority" miss the fact that he stabbed two men to death first. This case was someone who was very very sick, and decided to lash out at the world, and innocent people paid the price. Those who attempt to paint it as "MRA's are dangerous" (which they are, there is a brand new petition on WhiteHouse.gov saying exactly that) or anything other than it actually is confuse the hell out of me.
    - adventured 12y ago
      You're not supposed to talk about the four men he killed, including the three he stabbed to death. It ruins the script.
      - gordonguthrie 12y ago
        ...and what script is that?
thesimpsons1022 12y ago
yeah. at first i kinda had a knee jerk reaction to mpt accept the "misogyny" script, because feminists do this about everything, but after reading about him calling women a virus and wanting to exterminate all of them, I have to agree.

.....and?

girvo 12y ago

And his videos were specifcally saying he hated everyone. He was a severely mentally ill sick person who is now dead and took innocent people with him. Seriously, misogyny doesn't have all that much to do with it, from my perspective. Yes, he was a misogynist, but the unsaid implication I've seen all over the web is that "All misogynists are just like this guy!", which doesn't follow, as far as I'm concerned. I just write misogynists off as sad people that I won't associate with, not violent murderers waiting for a chance to "show the world".

MartinCron 12y ago
Part of the fear that many people have is that you can't always tell the difference between a garden-variety "just angry at chicks" guy and a "one bad day away from taking out a sorority guy" until it is too late.
- girvo 12y ago
  Yeah, I'll grant that. Serial killers throughout history often hid their broken-ness for years while getting away with it all... but this isn't a common occurrence. This isn't something that should factor into a persons risk-assessment while going about their daily life. This is a sad, messed up situation, but the reason it's so news-worthy is because this doesn't happen that often (thank <insert deity>)
  - gordonguthrie 12y ago
    It's not misogny because 'serial killers' - that is a group who are overwhelmingly men, overwhelming same, overwhelmingky kill women and overwhelmingly use sadistic sexual violence and mutilation. > Its newsworthy because it doesn't happen that often. You are kidding me right? Sexual violence is continuous.
    - girvo 12y ago
      Oh for christ's sake, this is obviously pointless. You win. I give. Uncle. Whatever. Also, you're wrong. And if you think misogyny (or whatever cause du jour we're using today) creates serial killers, and not mental illness then you're more than welcome to believe that. Plenty of psychologists say you're entirely incorrect[0], and I'll defer to them on this, but this "discussion" is utterly pointless, as you cherry pick whichever sentence you feel like pulling apart and ignoring the rest of it -- which are facts for the most part, not my opinion. [0] http://time.com/114354/elliot-rodger-ucsb-misogyny/ http://time.com/114354/elliot-rodger-ucsb-misogyny/ Ps. You know, I'm not even arguing that cultural misogyny isn't a problem. I think it is, and am a big believer that we have a problem in our tech industry that we need to fix. What I'm arguing is that you're currently no better than those who blame video games for shootings, ignoring the real cause, which is broken, sick people. EDIT: Oh and you're wrong. Victims are not "overwhelmingly" women, nor is it "overwhelmingly" because of sadistic motives. See [1]: Characteristics of U.S. Serial Killer Victims Sex N% Male 3,854 44.54% Female 4,799 55.46% [1] http://maamodt.asp.radford.edu/Serial%20Killer%20Information%20Center/Serial%20Killer%20Statistics.pdf http://maamodt.asp.radford.edu/Serial%20Killer%20Information...
      - gordonguthrie 12y ago
        You're right I was generalising from Scotland/the UK. The definition of Serial Killer being 2 or more unrelating killings. In Scotland there is somewhere between 1 and 3 multiple murders a year, not all of which are serial killings by the strict definition. http://www.scccj.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/0124207_homicide_scotland_10-11.pdf http://www.scccj.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/0124207_h... In the serial killing figures you show the numbers are overwhelming dominated by the US where the high availability of guns make multiple murders more common - and the number of sexual serial killers much less as a proportion. In Europe, I stand by my statement that serial killers are overwhelmingly, etc, etc...
  - MartinCron 12y ago
    This kind of mass murder isn't a common occurrence. But sexual violence against women absolutely is a common occurrence. The way women feel terrorized about this is a real thing. It brings up both unpleasant memories and legitimate fears. This is scary shit. It is OK to be scared by it.
king_jester 12y ago
> Yes, he was a misogynist, but the unsaid implication I've seen all over the web is that "All misogynists are just like this guy!", which doesn't follow, as far as I'm concerned. Not all misogynists will act out in physical violence, but misogyny provides fuel for those that do and it also provides excuses for those actions when they occur. Ultimately misogyny encourages violence against women, period. > I just write misogynists off as sad people that I won't associate with, not violent murderers waiting for a chance to "show the world". Which is a privilege you have since you are not the target of misogyny. Women who suffer direct harassment and violence because of misogyny don't get the chance to be so nonchalant about that behavior and cultural influence.
- girvo 12y ago
  I'll gladly agree with you. But that is not this case. This was severe mental illness, not misogyny. More to the point, to those who said "he killed men because he couldn't kill the sorority" miss the fact that he stabbed two men to death first. This case was someone who was very very sick, and decided to lash out at the world, and innocent people paid the price. Those who attempt to paint it as "MRA's are dangerous" (which they are, there is a brand new petition on WhiteHouse.gov saying exactly that) or anything other than it actually is confuse the hell out of me.
  - adventured 12y ago
    You're not supposed to talk about the four men he killed, including the three he stabbed to death. It ruins the script.
    - gordonguthrie 12y ago
      ...and what script is that?

thesimpsons1022 12y ago

yeah. at first i kinda had a knee jerk reaction to mpt accept the "misogyny" script, because feminists do this about everything, but after reading about him calling women a virus and wanting to exterminate all of them, I have to agree.