4 ms·
Java was never simple. Scheme is simple, Smalltalk is simple, Java was always a beast.
by gnaritas 17y ago
Java was never simple. Scheme is simple, Smalltalk is simple, Java was always a beast.
- Tichy 17y agoProbably, but they still managed to make it far worse (generics, annotations, ...).
- AlisdairO 17y agoI see that the poor implementation of generics is an issue, but what's so bad about annotations?
- Tichy 17y agoMy main issue is that they add more complexity to the language, making it harder to learn and to understand. They also encourage even more verbosity in an already verbose language. Furthermore, the uses I have seen all seemed a bit borderline - they used to say that configuration should stay out of the code, but now it sneaked in again.
- nradov 17y agoHow else would you propose to make meta-information about code available at run time? Before annotations we had to put that information in separate configuration files. That ended up being more complex, and harder to learn and understand.
- Tichy 17y agoI only know it in the context of Hibernate, and there are ORM frameworks in languages that don't have annotations. The separate config files had something going for them, because it keeps the concerns distinct.
- modoc 17y agoI'm much happier with jdk 1.5 than I was with 1.4 or 1.3 or 1.2 etc.... Not sure why you don't like the new additions. In general you don't have to use them if you don't want to.
- gloob 17y agoNot sure why you don't like the new additions. In general you don't have to use them if you don't want to. I don't really disagree with you. That said, it's a little bit of an opt-out, in the same sense that arguing that C++ is just as clean as C because "you can avoid all the ugly weird parts if you really try" is something of an opt-out. (I'm not trying to comment on the relative merits of C++ and C (edit: or, for that matter, on Java <1.5 vs. Java >=1.5), so much as on the relative levels of simplicity of the two languages, just to make certain that's clear).
- lsd5you 17y agoNeah. Generics are useful. Not perfect, but useful. They also happen to be optional. The language evolution has been good, but too slow. Even the platform evolution has been good, they have (and perhaps still) set the standard for many types of libraries. My main issue is the growth of the platform (to what, 200mb?). I would like a much tighter standard library. In an ideal world, Swing, XML parsing ... etc. should be seperate, deprecated items removed and old apis redone.
- nradov 17y ago200MB? The latest JRE is only about 20MB. Those libraries consume very little space.
- Tichy 17y agoNot so much optional - I think in modern Java projects you will be expected to use them. Also, 3rd party code will use them and won't work with your code if you don't use them. Anyway, it is all a matter of taste.