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Was it though? The NSA's job is to spy on behalf of the country. While keeping the bug a secret put people at risk, there is an argument to be made that it was

Was it though? The NSA's job is to spy on behalf of the country. While keeping the bug a secret put people at risk, there is an argument to be made that it was a useful tool. Law enforcement regularly makes the decision to allow low level criminals to continue to commit crimes in order to catch their leaders even though doing so puts people at risk. There are always tradeoffs.

ihsw 13y ago
Where do we draw the line? When millions die and billions of dollars in irrecoverable damage is done? Who gets to decide whether the risk is acceptable? To whom do we turn to when it's found that their risk assessment was flawed, and we require compensation for their recklessness and negligence?
- onewaystreet 13y ago
  One could make the argument that given the depth of the NSA's capabilities they were in an unique position to know who, if anyone, also knew of the bug.
  - john_b 13y ago
    So we should just blindly trust an agency that has repeatedly been shown to have abused that very trust for self-serving and hypocritical ends?
    - onewaystreet 13y ago
      All governments are hypocritical. We have nukes, but you can't have them; we can spy on you, but don't spy on us; etc. It's the nature of self-interest.
      - nitrogen 13y ago
        Reworded slightly: "Evil is evil. You can't change it. Get over it." I don't buy it.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
warmblood 13y ago
We've all been waiting for that argument for a while. When are you going to finally reveal it to us?
onedev 13y ago
Right, because putting THE ENTIRE NATION AND IT'S CITIZENS at risk EVERY SINGLE DAY is comparable to allowing low level criminals to operate.... Why do we let awful people like this be in charge of our well being? Is power too entrenched that no matter what happens, we can't do anything about it?
adventured 13y ago
It would require the assumption that, for example, the NSA knew about it but other foreign authorities - who no doubt attempt to spy on various Americans and US corporations - did not know about it. I don't like those odds.
diydsp 13y ago
Their job is not to spy on behalf of the country. Their job is to keep us safe. Letting us all run around with humungous holes in our security for years was a risk to our national security. How do you think the Chinese were able to clone our weapons systems so well? Shit like this.
- brennen 13y ago
  POSIWID.
- Steko 13y ago
  Yeah NSA's job is to fix open source bugs, whatever. NSA is a spy agency, expecting them not to use vulnerabilities they find is like sending them into a gunfight with a pocketful of rocks. Ask the Palestinians how that works out in the long run. I think much of the NSA's surveillance is unconstitutional and should be rolled back by at least 2 orders of magnitude. That doesn't have to entail turning the world over to Russian and Chinese hackers.
  - throwaway2048 13y ago
    >That doesn't have to entail turning the world over to Russian and Chinese hackers. That's exactly what they do when they allow bugs like this to continue to exist, rather than working to fix holes, not exploit them.
  - smtddr 13y ago
    >>That doesn't have to entail turning the world over to Russian and Chinese hackers. Boogey man FUD, I'm not worried about any hackers from [Insert_forgein_country_elites_want_you_to_hate]. The USgov, NSA and corrupt law enforcement are the only terrorists I'm worried about.
    - jryle80 13y ago
      Pretty interesting statement. Why? Nations have track records of not killing/spying on each others?
slantedview 13y ago
"The NSA's job is to spy on behalf of the country." Spying on the country and spying on behalf of the country are not really the same thing.
Zigurd 13y ago
I doubt such subtlety entered into the decision. The NSA plays offense, and this was a win from that point of view. The only way to get a different result is to re-allocate resources away from NSA and build an agency from the ground up that is geared toward securing systems.
john_b 13y ago
I think you missed the part where the NSA claimed it prioritized protecting the data of Americans and American companies. Nobody denies that exploiting the bug would be useful for the NSA.

ihsw 13y ago

Where do we draw the line? When millions die and billions of dollars in irrecoverable damage is done? Who gets to decide whether the risk is acceptable? To whom do we turn to when it's found that their risk assessment was flawed, and we require compensation for their recklessness and negligence?

onewaystreet 13y ago
One could make the argument that given the depth of the NSA's capabilities they were in an unique position to know who, if anyone, also knew of the bug.
- john_b 13y ago
  So we should just blindly trust an agency that has repeatedly been shown to have abused that very trust for self-serving and hypocritical ends?
  - onewaystreet 13y ago
    All governments are hypocritical. We have nukes, but you can't have them; we can spy on you, but don't spy on us; etc. It's the nature of self-interest.
    - nitrogen 13y ago
      Reworded slightly: "Evil is evil. You can't change it. Get over it." I don't buy it.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]

warmblood 13y ago

We've all been waiting for that argument for a while. When are you going to finally reveal it to us?

onedev 13y ago

Right, because putting THE ENTIRE NATION AND IT'S CITIZENS at risk EVERY SINGLE DAY is comparable to allowing low level criminals to operate.... Why do we let awful people like this be in charge of our well being? Is power too entrenched that no matter what happens, we can't do anything about it?

adventured 13y ago

It would require the assumption that, for example, the NSA knew about it but other foreign authorities - who no doubt attempt to spy on various Americans and US corporations - did not know about it. I don't like those odds.

diydsp 13y ago

Their job is not to spy on behalf of the country. Their job is to keep us safe. Letting us all run around with humungous holes in our security for years was a risk to our national security. How do you think the Chinese were able to clone our weapons systems so well? Shit like this.

brennen 13y ago
POSIWID.
Steko 13y ago
Yeah NSA's job is to fix open source bugs, whatever. NSA is a spy agency, expecting them not to use vulnerabilities they find is like sending them into a gunfight with a pocketful of rocks. Ask the Palestinians how that works out in the long run. I think much of the NSA's surveillance is unconstitutional and should be rolled back by at least 2 orders of magnitude. That doesn't have to entail turning the world over to Russian and Chinese hackers.
- throwaway2048 13y ago
  >That doesn't have to entail turning the world over to Russian and Chinese hackers. That's exactly what they do when they allow bugs like this to continue to exist, rather than working to fix holes, not exploit them.
- smtddr 13y ago
  >>That doesn't have to entail turning the world over to Russian and Chinese hackers. Boogey man FUD, I'm not worried about any hackers from [Insert_forgein_country_elites_want_you_to_hate]. The USgov, NSA and corrupt law enforcement are the only terrorists I'm worried about.
  - jryle80 13y ago
    Pretty interesting statement. Why? Nations have track records of not killing/spying on each others?

slantedview 13y ago

"The NSA's job is to spy on behalf of the country." Spying on the country and spying on behalf of the country are not really the same thing.

Zigurd 13y ago

I doubt such subtlety entered into the decision. The NSA plays offense, and this was a win from that point of view. The only way to get a different result is to re-allocate resources away from NSA and build an agency from the ground up that is geared toward securing systems.

john_b 13y ago

I think you missed the part where the NSA claimed it prioritized protecting the data of Americans and American companies. Nobody denies that exploiting the bug would be useful for the NSA.