5 ms·

Gay Developers Boycott As Mozilla Appoints Allegedly Anti-Gay CEO

25 points by robbyking 13y ago

Ashan 13y ago
While they're entitled to do that, wouldn't it have made sense to boycott long ago when Eich helped found Mozilla?
- nobody_nowhere 13y ago
  Doesn't that predate his donation?
  - Ashan 13y ago
    While it does, the donation was made 6 years ago. He has been CEO for less than a week. At the time he was CTO.
- smickie 13y ago
  Sounds like it only came out the Brendan Eich was homophobic when he recently supported overturning Prop 8.
  - transitionality 13y ago
    The former does not follow from the latter.
nobody_nowhere 13y ago
I don't like to tell other people what to do, but I wouldn't want to see any revenue generated (even indirectly) by me find its way into this guy's pocket. Not that there's a truly positive or better option....
trebor 13y ago
Isn't this just intolerant of his own views and morals? He's free to have those, last I checked.
- jrs235 13y ago
  Times have changed. It use to be you were only allowed to have (and voice) popular views and beliefs. Today you are not allowed to have (and voice) unpopular views and beliefs.
- futurist 13y ago
  According to these folks, it's okay to have your own views and morals. That is, as long as it is politically correct.
  - jnbiche 13y ago
    Can you expound on what you mean by "these folks"?
- mister_m 13y ago
  If his views and morals clash with basic human rights, then he deserves whatever "intolerant" reactions he receives.
- keeshawn 13y ago
  No. People are free to associate with whomever they wish. Just as Mozilla is free to appoint an anti-gay CEO, those of us who disagree with that direction are free to go elsewhere when we choose to contribute to an open-source project.
- HelloMcFly 13y ago
  Of course he is. That doesn't make a boycott wrong, or the those who boycott "intolerant." Further the causes you wish to further, but be aware that as a consumer I may choose to withhold direct or indirect support based on your decisions. That's fair for everyone.
  - transitionality 13y ago
    Trying to get someone fired because you disagree with their political stance is both intolerant and bigoted. It is political oppression.
transitionality 13y ago
Not a significant threat. I think the developer community can easily weather the loss of a couple of percent of its ranks.
Mikeb85 13y ago
Maybe they should boycott companies that do business in India since homosexuality is actually still outlawed there (as in outright illegal - even in Russia homosexuality is legal)... This gets no press. But no, let's rag on Mozilla because Brendan Eich has views we don't agree with. Linus Torvalds and Richard Stallman both have views I don't like but I use Linux and GNU software... In fact, if I were to boycott everyone I didn't agree with I'd have to live in a hole in the ground.
shittyanalogy 13y ago
The biggest impact this could possibly have is in producing legislation that lets large donations conceal their source because of fear of hateful retaliation. Ironic I know. If we don't want to have those laws we need to be a little less witch-hunty about what we discover in the records.
- jnbiche 13y ago
  I personally don't think there's anything "witch-hunty" about this boycott. This information about Eich's donation has been available for some 6 years, and only became a recent issue when he was promoted to the head of an organization based on community values and community contributions. I can guarantee you that the same thing would happen if someone who donated to Prop. 8 were appointed to the head of Wikimedia Foundation, or any similar organization that depends on a community's goodwill to flourish. And to those commenting with complaints about what Eich is/isn't "allowed" to do: of course he's allowed to do whatever he wants (within the law). But if he takes a stand that is unpopular with some people, and is appointed to the head of an important organization, it's likewise their right to cease doing business with said organization. I have mixed feelings. Some of the open source projects I'm most interested in at the moment are under the aegis of Mozilla, but I'm also not happy at all with the message this sends out to those of us who were deeply offended by Prop. 8.
  - shittyanalogy 13y ago
    He probably didn't want his donation to be public information and now he, and all of us, know exactly why large donators sometimes do everything they can to conceal themselves. Events like this, whether 6 years late or not, give good reason to not have to reveal yourself when donating. I mean it's quite literally still haunting him. Whether he still feels the same way or not. Also it's one thing to cease doing business with an organization yourself. It's another thing entirely to try to incite other people to do the same using your notoriety as a tool for coercion. Times change, people change, records do not. It's hard to explain what you were thinking and what was happening 6 years ago. It's easy to point a finger now and say, "look at what that asshole did."
tedchs 13y ago
Warning, this site seems to have some articles that are probably NSFW at many places.
rando289 13y ago
IMO, Mozilla's work for the public good is more important than this. Times are changing quickly, but remember that Obama was on the same side as Eich, and prop 8 passed with a majority of voters. I don't think it is very helpful to be shaming everyone who did not support gay marriage in a vote 6 years ago.
- dragonwriter 13y ago
  > Times are changing quickly, but remember that Obama was on the same side as Eich Really? Can you cite any statement or action of Obama advocating for or directed toward advancing the cause of removing the right of same sex couples to marry any place that it had been established?
  - cynwoody 13y ago
    In 2008, when Prop 8 was on the ballot, Obama was for civil unions but professed to believe that marriage is a sacred union between a man and a woman. "I'm not somebody who promotes same-sex marriage, but I do believe in civil unions." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K9dS9wl7U http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K9dS9wl7U
    - dragonwriter 13y ago
      Not promoting same sex marriage is not the same thing as promoting withdrawing it where it has been established. So, that's not an example of what was asked.
nastysquar3d 13y ago
Personally, I'm so sick of everyone being so damn sensitive about everything nowadays. Guess what? Business is business and 99.99% of the time CEO's are appointed on their business acumen and not their personal beliefs. If Eich is a professional he'll keep the two separate.

25 points by robbyking 13y ago

Ashan 13y ago

While they're entitled to do that, wouldn't it have made sense to boycott long ago when Eich helped found Mozilla?

nobody_nowhere 13y ago
Doesn't that predate his donation?
- Ashan 13y ago
  While it does, the donation was made 6 years ago. He has been CEO for less than a week. At the time he was CTO.
smickie 13y ago
Sounds like it only came out the Brendan Eich was homophobic when he recently supported overturning Prop 8.
- transitionality 13y ago
  The former does not follow from the latter.

nobody_nowhere 13y ago

I don't like to tell other people what to do, but I wouldn't want to see any revenue generated (even indirectly) by me find its way into this guy's pocket. Not that there's a truly positive or better option....

trebor 13y ago

Isn't this just intolerant of his own views and morals? He's free to have those, last I checked.

jrs235 13y ago
Times have changed. It use to be you were only allowed to have (and voice) popular views and beliefs. Today you are not allowed to have (and voice) unpopular views and beliefs.
futurist 13y ago
According to these folks, it's okay to have your own views and morals. That is, as long as it is politically correct.
- jnbiche 13y ago
  Can you expound on what you mean by "these folks"?
mister_m 13y ago
If his views and morals clash with basic human rights, then he deserves whatever "intolerant" reactions he receives.
keeshawn 13y ago
No. People are free to associate with whomever they wish. Just as Mozilla is free to appoint an anti-gay CEO, those of us who disagree with that direction are free to go elsewhere when we choose to contribute to an open-source project.
HelloMcFly 13y ago
Of course he is. That doesn't make a boycott wrong, or the those who boycott "intolerant." Further the causes you wish to further, but be aware that as a consumer I may choose to withhold direct or indirect support based on your decisions. That's fair for everyone.
- transitionality 13y ago
  Trying to get someone fired because you disagree with their political stance is both intolerant and bigoted. It is political oppression.

transitionality 13y ago

Not a significant threat. I think the developer community can easily weather the loss of a couple of percent of its ranks.

Mikeb85 13y ago

Maybe they should boycott companies that do business in India since homosexuality is actually still outlawed there (as in outright illegal - even in Russia homosexuality is legal)... This gets no press. But no, let's rag on Mozilla because Brendan Eich has views we don't agree with. Linus Torvalds and Richard Stallman both have views I don't like but I use Linux and GNU software... In fact, if I were to boycott everyone I didn't agree with I'd have to live in a hole in the ground.

shittyanalogy 13y ago

The biggest impact this could possibly have is in producing legislation that lets large donations conceal their source because of fear of hateful retaliation. Ironic I know. If we don't want to have those laws we need to be a little less witch-hunty about what we discover in the records.

jnbiche 13y ago
I personally don't think there's anything "witch-hunty" about this boycott. This information about Eich's donation has been available for some 6 years, and only became a recent issue when he was promoted to the head of an organization based on community values and community contributions. I can guarantee you that the same thing would happen if someone who donated to Prop. 8 were appointed to the head of Wikimedia Foundation, or any similar organization that depends on a community's goodwill to flourish. And to those commenting with complaints about what Eich is/isn't "allowed" to do: of course he's allowed to do whatever he wants (within the law). But if he takes a stand that is unpopular with some people, and is appointed to the head of an important organization, it's likewise their right to cease doing business with said organization. I have mixed feelings. Some of the open source projects I'm most interested in at the moment are under the aegis of Mozilla, but I'm also not happy at all with the message this sends out to those of us who were deeply offended by Prop. 8.
- shittyanalogy 13y ago
  He probably didn't want his donation to be public information and now he, and all of us, know exactly why large donators sometimes do everything they can to conceal themselves. Events like this, whether 6 years late or not, give good reason to not have to reveal yourself when donating. I mean it's quite literally still haunting him. Whether he still feels the same way or not. Also it's one thing to cease doing business with an organization yourself. It's another thing entirely to try to incite other people to do the same using your notoriety as a tool for coercion. Times change, people change, records do not. It's hard to explain what you were thinking and what was happening 6 years ago. It's easy to point a finger now and say, "look at what that asshole did."

tedchs 13y ago

Warning, this site seems to have some articles that are probably NSFW at many places.

rando289 13y ago

IMO, Mozilla's work for the public good is more important than this. Times are changing quickly, but remember that Obama was on the same side as Eich, and prop 8 passed with a majority of voters. I don't think it is very helpful to be shaming everyone who did not support gay marriage in a vote 6 years ago.

dragonwriter 13y ago
> Times are changing quickly, but remember that Obama was on the same side as Eich Really? Can you cite any statement or action of Obama advocating for or directed toward advancing the cause of removing the right of same sex couples to marry any place that it had been established?
- cynwoody 13y ago
  In 2008, when Prop 8 was on the ballot, Obama was for civil unions but professed to believe that marriage is a sacred union between a man and a woman. "I'm not somebody who promotes same-sex marriage, but I do believe in civil unions." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K9dS9wl7U http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K9dS9wl7U
  - dragonwriter 13y ago
    Not promoting same sex marriage is not the same thing as promoting withdrawing it where it has been established. So, that's not an example of what was asked.

nastysquar3d 13y ago

Personally, I'm so sick of everyone being so damn sensitive about everything nowadays. Guess what? Business is business and 99.99% of the time CEO's are appointed on their business acumen and not their personal beliefs. If Eich is a professional he'll keep the two separate.