7 ms·

The fact that Brendan hasn't publicly changed his position or donated $1000+ to an LGBT organization (to offset his Prop 8 donation) means that this must be a d

by bluthru 13y ago

The fact that Brendan hasn't publicly changed his position or donated $1000+ to an LGBT organization (to offset his Prop 8 donation) means that this must be a deeply held belief of his. I trust Mozilla will keep him on a short leash, but it's still troubling.

angersock 13y ago
What's wrong with it being a deeply-held belief? Hell, for that matter, what exactly is this position everyone keeps ascribing to him? Other than the donation, what do we know?
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- azth 13y ago
  Indeed. It's like a witch hunt.
- courtf 13y ago
  >what exactly is this position everyone keeps ascribing to him? That he doesn't think gay people should have the same rights as straight people? Was this a trick question? > What's wrong with it being a deeply-held belief? That we are putting it to a vote at all will be a point of historical embarrassment in the not so distant future. Is this not clear? I don't understand the incredulity; it's all rather plain.
- ftfish 13y ago
  "What's wrong with it being a deeply-held belief?" Wait, what? Alright, let's start from the beginning. "Hell, for that matter, what exactly is this position everyone keeps ascribing to him?" It may seem like we can't really tell, because he never really openly commented on this, but what we do know is this: * he donated $1,000 of his own money to support Proposition 8 * the full text of Proposition 8 (according to Wikipedia): Section I. Title This measure shall be known and may be cited as the "California Marriage Protection Act." Section 2. Article I. Section 7.5 is added to the California Constitution, to read: Sec. 7.5. Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California. Is it really hard to figure out that Brendan Eich is a man who would pay $1,000 so that two consenting people in love can not marry if they are of the same sex? I am not a gay person myself and I think it's safe to assume you are neither. And you might have read http://www.teamrarebit.com/blog/2014/03/24/goodbye_firefox_marketplace/ http://www.teamrarebit.com/blog/2014/03/24/goodbye_firefox_m... by now. But I really recommend doing a little bit of a research on the topics of gay marriage and LGBTs to see what exactly is wrong with his belief that LGBT people don't deserve basic human and civil rights. Note: I was only responding to the quoted text. It's a whole another issue whether he should resign as a CEO of an organization that prides itself for being open and inclusive (or at least issue an apology and/or a statement of his changed mind on this issue). Also another question is whether it is the right solution to boycott a whole company which I am sure is full of people who do not agree with the new CEO's belief.
  - Don_ 13y ago
    >It's a whole another issue whether he should resign as a CEO of an organization that prides itself for being open and inclusive (or at least issue an apology and/or a statement of his changed mind on this issue). Why would either of those options happen? Since when is a person not entitled to his own opinions and beliefs? Him being the CEO has nothing to do with the stand on diversity of the organization itself, that was the whole point of Mozilla's statement. He is not firing his gay employees or enforcing his agenda upon the organization because that has nothing to do with his current position at Mozilla. In fact, the money he spent was his own, not Mozilla's. One can do whatever the fuck one wants with his own money as long as it's legal. Making his stance against gay marriage public was probably not a good idea from a business standpoint, but there's absolutely nothing from that that should taint Mozilla's image.
    - ftfish 13y ago
      The real problem here is that he actually acted on his opinions. If someone is a homophobe, racist or even a pedophile -- while they are not acting on their opinions or whatever drives them, I agree, they are free to think whatever they want. It would be better for them to work those issues out, but hey, if they're not actually harming anyone, I don't personally care. We don't really know yet how his personal beliefs will affect the company. Read through some of the other comments here, I agree it could just be in very subtle -- yet still negative -- ways. What I think is more interesting is how this reveals how deeply rooted sexism and homophobia are in our society. Yes, racism is still obviously a problem, but think for a moment what the reactions would be if the new CEO was known to have donated to KKK. Here are some more fun exercises: * what if the new CEO was a scientologist? * what if the new CEO was an African American and it was revealed he donated to a group that attempts to make interracial marriage illegal again because he believes white people are sub-human creatures (the way the actual new CEO probably sees gay people, since he doesn't believe they deserve human and civil rights)? * what if the new CEO was a neo-nazi sympathizer? * what if the new CEO was a woman who really, really doesn't like men (and maybe even donated to some cause that attacks men or men's rights in some way)? You can argue that all of these are just opinions. But where do we draw the line? People are usually very inconsistent with that. Homophobia is tolerated while putting a woman in a leading position makes people question this decision. Heck, people get all riled up over Ben Affleck being the next Batman, but the fact Bill Murray abused his wife doesn't stop him from being a geek idol.

by bluthru 13y ago

angersock 13y ago

What's wrong with it being a deeply-held belief? Hell, for that matter, what exactly is this position everyone keeps ascribing to him? Other than the donation, what do we know?

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
azth 13y ago
Indeed. It's like a witch hunt.
courtf 13y ago
>what exactly is this position everyone keeps ascribing to him? That he doesn't think gay people should have the same rights as straight people? Was this a trick question? > What's wrong with it being a deeply-held belief? That we are putting it to a vote at all will be a point of historical embarrassment in the not so distant future. Is this not clear? I don't understand the incredulity; it's all rather plain.
ftfish 13y ago
"What's wrong with it being a deeply-held belief?" Wait, what? Alright, let's start from the beginning. "Hell, for that matter, what exactly is this position everyone keeps ascribing to him?" It may seem like we can't really tell, because he never really openly commented on this, but what we do know is this: * he donated $1,000 of his own money to support Proposition 8 * the full text of Proposition 8 (according to Wikipedia): Section I. Title This measure shall be known and may be cited as the "California Marriage Protection Act." Section 2. Article I. Section 7.5 is added to the California Constitution, to read: Sec. 7.5. Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California. Is it really hard to figure out that Brendan Eich is a man who would pay $1,000 so that two consenting people in love can not marry if they are of the same sex? I am not a gay person myself and I think it's safe to assume you are neither. And you might have read http://www.teamrarebit.com/blog/2014/03/24/goodbye_firefox_marketplace/ http://www.teamrarebit.com/blog/2014/03/24/goodbye_firefox_m... by now. But I really recommend doing a little bit of a research on the topics of gay marriage and LGBTs to see what exactly is wrong with his belief that LGBT people don't deserve basic human and civil rights. Note: I was only responding to the quoted text. It's a whole another issue whether he should resign as a CEO of an organization that prides itself for being open and inclusive (or at least issue an apology and/or a statement of his changed mind on this issue). Also another question is whether it is the right solution to boycott a whole company which I am sure is full of people who do not agree with the new CEO's belief.
- Don_ 13y ago
  >It's a whole another issue whether he should resign as a CEO of an organization that prides itself for being open and inclusive (or at least issue an apology and/or a statement of his changed mind on this issue). Why would either of those options happen? Since when is a person not entitled to his own opinions and beliefs? Him being the CEO has nothing to do with the stand on diversity of the organization itself, that was the whole point of Mozilla's statement. He is not firing his gay employees or enforcing his agenda upon the organization because that has nothing to do with his current position at Mozilla. In fact, the money he spent was his own, not Mozilla's. One can do whatever the fuck one wants with his own money as long as it's legal. Making his stance against gay marriage public was probably not a good idea from a business standpoint, but there's absolutely nothing from that that should taint Mozilla's image.
  - ftfish 13y ago
    The real problem here is that he actually acted on his opinions. If someone is a homophobe, racist or even a pedophile -- while they are not acting on their opinions or whatever drives them, I agree, they are free to think whatever they want. It would be better for them to work those issues out, but hey, if they're not actually harming anyone, I don't personally care. We don't really know yet how his personal beliefs will affect the company. Read through some of the other comments here, I agree it could just be in very subtle -- yet still negative -- ways. What I think is more interesting is how this reveals how deeply rooted sexism and homophobia are in our society. Yes, racism is still obviously a problem, but think for a moment what the reactions would be if the new CEO was known to have donated to KKK. Here are some more fun exercises: * what if the new CEO was a scientologist? * what if the new CEO was an African American and it was revealed he donated to a group that attempts to make interracial marriage illegal again because he believes white people are sub-human creatures (the way the actual new CEO probably sees gay people, since he doesn't believe they deserve human and civil rights)? * what if the new CEO was a neo-nazi sympathizer? * what if the new CEO was a woman who really, really doesn't like men (and maybe even donated to some cause that attacks men or men's rights in some way)? You can argue that all of these are just opinions. But where do we draw the line? People are usually very inconsistent with that. Homophobia is tolerated while putting a woman in a leading position makes people question this decision. Heck, people get all riled up over Ben Affleck being the next Batman, but the fact Bill Murray abused his wife doesn't stop him from being a geek idol.