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>Financiers like Icahn are motivated by short term profits above all else. That's one way to look at it. Another is to note that Icahn built a thriving financ
by hnnewguy 13y ago
>Financiers like Icahn are motivated by short term profits above all else.
That's one way to look at it.
Another is to note that Icahn built a thriving financial company that has survived for over 4 decades, and employs over 60,000 people globally. I'd say that requires long term thinking and demonstrates a bit of business acumen.
- adventured 13y agoCan you explain how his financial company employs 60,000 people? Or did you mean he has ownership stakes in industrial firms that employ 60,000 people? Because he most certainly has never created 60,000 jobs by starting a company.
- hnnewguy 13y ago>Can you explain how his financial company employs 60,000 people? Do you think that large, multi-billion dollar financial conglomerates run themselves? >Or did you mean he has ownership stakes in industrial firms that employ 60,000 people? Both. Through wholly-owned subsidiaries and the financial holding company. What does it matter? My point is, painting him like he's some inexperienced financier is utterly disingenuous. I know it's en vogue to hate on "banksters", but his business experience (and, in my opinion, economic value-added) is of a magnitude greater than Mr. Andreesen's.
- adventured 13y agoWell I wasn't looking to engage in a battle of baseless statements. I asked if you can elaborate on the 60,000 employees you said his financial company employs. Medium-size (Icahn is no Goldman or BlackRock), multi-billion dollar hedge funds and private equity groups (and similar) do not have 60,000 employees. Take a quick look reference at how many people Buffett has employed in his offices over the years. The industrial firms he owns stakes in employ lots of people, he didn't start those companies of course, and he doesn't run them. BlackRock has 11,000 employees with a couple hundred billion in assets. Goldman Sachs has 32,000 employees with $911 billion in assets under management. To name two examples. I'm willing to bet Icahn's financial company is extremely small in fact and employs very few people relative to the value of its holdings. What does it matter? Because I'm fascinated by where those 60,000 people are employed. Who's hating on bankers? Not me. Who said he isn't extremely savvy? Not me. I asked where you got the 60,000 figure, simple.
- hnnewguy 13y ago>Not me. I asked where you got the 60,000 figure, simple. Their 10k lists each subsidiary and the number employed: http://www.ielp.com/sec.cfm?SortOrder=Type%20Ascending&DocType=&DocTypeExclude=&Year=&FormatFilter=&CIK= http://www.ielp.com/sec.cfm?SortOrder=Type%20Ascending&DocTy... 2/3 are employed by Federal Mogul, an automotive parts supplier controlled by IE.
- x0x0 13y agothat's the only way to look at it; Icahn is a thieving sack of shit. Look at TWA: Icahn got fucking paid no matter whether TWA succeeded or failed. I can maybe see how these leeches ought to get 1/2 billion dollar payouts if they come in and rescue a company, but 0.5B when they ruin a company? Heads I win, tails you lose.
- hnnewguy 13y ago>that's the only way to look at it; Icahn is a thieving sack of shit. Curious what your opinion is of Mr. Andreessen, and the conflict-of-interest accusations? is he included in your "leeches" remark, or does he get the SV pass? The story is plausible. If I were an eBay shareholder, I'd be incensed.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- EC1 13y agoWhat puts you in a position to be an objective judge of the dealings of billionaires?
- x0x0 13y agotheir behavior, particularly said behavior's effects on others
- nathanvanfleet 13y agoYes definitely, let's hope he's continues to be successful and handicaps more American businesses and we'll see how you feel about it in 10 years. He'll wreck more than 60,000 jobs but he'll have a lot of money for himself.