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If you were building a startup today, what would you use?
- akc 13y agoresults: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1fKVsAFT3nRVvlcJ74p0ZI2uqwDq_qtNvxx8ne6LTI9E/viewanalytics https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1fKVsAFT3nRVvlcJ74p0ZI2uqwDq...
- akc 13y agotabulated results https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApqmTkgH6Ua_dEZOdTFIX2lGMVVINjBRS25BenNYSXc#gid=0 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApqmTkgH6Ua_dEZ...
- zequel 13y agoDisappointed Windows Azure isn't listed. Ignoring the anti-anything Microsoft crowd, it's a stable easy-to-use reasonably (at least competitive) priced platform.
- carterschonwald 13y agoHaskell.
- gaoshan 13y agoSo I guess the (currently third place) "Other" is mostly PHP? I know it's not cool but it still seems strange to leave that popular and frequently used platform out of the poll.
- kodablah 13y agoI would assume Scala or Clojure
- akc 13y agoadded.
- thaumaturgy 13y agoHip developers are not allowed to acknowledge the existence of ... that language. Uttering its name is forbidden.
- hdevalence 13y ago<?php $foo = "0wz"; $foo++; $foo++; echo "PHP goes to $foo"; ?>
- RossM 13y agoResults in: http://3v4l.org/koVpq http://3v4l.org/koVpq Reasoning: 0wz++ = 0xa (converted from hex to dec) = 10++ = 11 Not sure why 0wz++ = 0xa, but if you increment strings I'd expect oddities (or some sort of ascii increment).
- thaumaturgy 13y agoOh, bravo. That is nice. It took me a moment to figure out. For others: PHP allows you to increment strings, and if you try to do that, it follows Perl's habits (http://perldoc.perl.org/perlop.html#Auto-increment-and-Auto-decrement http://perldoc.perl.org/perlop.html#Auto-increment-and-Auto-...): "If, however, the variable has been used in only string contexts since it was set, and has a value that is not the empty string and matches the pattern /^[a-zA-Z][0-9]\z/ , the increment is done as a string, preserving each character within its range, with carry..." So "0wz"++ becomes "0xa", "0xa"++ becomes "the hexadecimal representation of 10, plus one". I learned something new today.
- stusmall 13y agoI'm surprised that iOS is winning out as much as it is on the first native side to build.
- jsankey 13y agoI actually prefer Android as a user. But if I'm building native (instead of HTML5), it's because I want a polished UI, and that is easier to deliver on iOS where there are only a handful of devices to test against (in particular screen resolutions). Assuming the app goes well on iOS then I'd happily take on the extra effort of an Android version.
- MaysonL 13y agoI'm surprised that it isn't winning by a larger margin.
- stusmall 13y agoWhy is that? My motivation for picking Android is the larger market share. Even if you have engineering preferences, to me what really matters is getting it out in front of a wider audience.
- bitcrusher 13y agoWhat markets are you trying to get more in front of? US? Europe? China? What device levels are you trying to get in front of? Android seems like a "no brainer" until you start looking at the details... For example, if you cut out all "cheap shit 2.2 android devices" and focus on new(ish) Android 4.0> things get REALLY murky... In the US iOS still holds a lead over Android in those markets; in Europe Android is ahead, but then you have localization to deal with. Additionally, Android might have an edge in some markets, but the fact that iOS users actually PAY for apps also makes a big difference. The point is that Android is a sensible choice but it's not an automagic choice, nor is it as cut and dry as it appears.
- stusmall 13y ago
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- wasd 13y agoI am most surprised by the number of people who want to use Go. It isn't that Go isn't a great piece of technology but I thought it would be really difficult to hire for and seems a bit overkill for an MVP.
- lstamour 13y agoDepends. If what you need to build is actually a simple interface between database and front-end over an XML or JSON API, Go's not that much heavier than the alternatives, with the promise of more performance in the future and with less code than many other libraries require. Plus if you host on Google App Engine, it's free to start. Even the HTML templating has built-in context-aware output filtering for XSS prevention. That said, Rails, or any language developers are more familiar with, can be faster. At that point, I'd argue even static HTML pages might be one of the fastest MVPs to put together...
- alkonaut 13y agoAgain with the assumption that "startup" is synonymous with "web/mobile app". What about thick clients/desktop apps/consoles etc? If I were to start my career from scratch in 2014 I'd pick F#, and keep an eye out for Rust.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- michaelochurch 13y agoWhy F# over Haskell? I feel like the near-reliance on Windows is the biggest issue for F#. Haskell fits the Unix environment a lot better.
- alkonaut 13y agoF# for several reasons 1) Tooling, I like proper thick IDE's like xamarins or VS. 2) better platform support (I'm serious, it isnt tied so much to windows as you might think but is one of few languages you can e.g make a 3-platform mobile app with today!). Running Haskell in the same IDE with the same compiler on several platforms is hard. Making android/iOS or web apps with it is also tricky. 3) I like ML more than Haskell, 4) trivial to slap a non-functional C# front end on F# business logic should that be necessary, much harder to do from Haskell or ML without having to resort to C/C++.
- MetaCosm 13y agoXamarin is really the "killer app" for .NET at the moment. Being able to use a common codebase for Windows RT, Windows Phone, Windows, OS-X, Android, iOS is amazing. Being able to do full native work on top of that on every platform. The apps look, feel and act native cause they are using native widgets. Last I checked the F# supports was still a little crufty (over a year ago) -- but if they really get the F# support to be top tier, I will have to return and have another look.
- alkonaut 13y ago
- mindcrime 13y agoMan, Grails / Groovy never get any love from these poll authors! C'mon, Grails rocks people... :-) Seriously, I switched all of our development from Java/Tapestry/etc. to Groovy/Grails a few years ago, and really couldn't be happier with the decision. Grails isn't flawless, but it mostly "just works" and makes my life SO much easier than before. No, it isn't the "flavor of the day" like node.js or what-have-you, but it works, it stays out of the way, and gets the job done. And it lets me leverage the decade plus of experience doing Java that I previously experienced. What more could you ask for?
- lstamour 13y agoI'd also put my 2¢ out for JRuby. It's amazing how nice it can be to have Java libraries mixed in with Ruby on Rails, and your only penalty for it is a delayed startup cost (with potentially faster JIT to boot, and new Java 8 scripting performance to look forward to).
- pkinsky 13y agoI chose Scala/Play framework for the same reasons. Java might be awful, but the JVM is a beast. >Though my tip though for the long term replacement of javac is Scala. I'm very impressed with it! I can honestly say if someone had shown me the Programming in Scala book by by Martin Odersky, Lex Spoon & Bill Venners back in 2003 I'd probably have never created Groovy. -James Strachan
- TimisaGeek 13y ago+10000 - we've switched to Grails ~3 years ago, probably our best tech decision EVER.
- qdog 13y agoI find your lack of C on the back end...disturbing.
- akc 13y agoI for one didn't know about Digital Ocean before I put this survey out, and now I do, and am really grateful as a result.
- emeraldd 13y agoFor small stuff, their entry level 5$ a month droplet is perfect and pretty much beats anything else I've come across. Having SSD backed storage is nice too.
- gaoshan 13y agoDigital Ocean is great.... I've been using them for a bunch of stuff. Make for great dab/staging servers and low cost platforms.
- mbesto 13y ago- If you don't know a web programming language, find the easiest one to learn (quicker to launch) - If you do know programming languages, use the one you're best at (quicker to launch) I'll refer to my previous argument for all of this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6169120 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6169120
- drivingmenuts 13y agoHaving nearly finished my first real-world project in NodeJS/MongoDB, I gotta say, it's better than sliced bread. Papa just found himself a brand new hammer. Now to go find some more nails.
- herokusaki 13y agoCare to compare it with your previous experiences in webdev?
- drivingmenuts 13y agoThere was a lot less dithering over proper database design; I just created objects in code and stored them wholesale. Aside from some administrative details/learning (zero knowledge going in), I spent far less time worrying about Mongo and more about my code, none of which has to do any manipulation of the database. On the code side, I already know JS pretty well, though mostly from a UI-manipulation side. It was more like extending knowledge I already had, than having to learn something completely new. The slowest part was trying to determine which modules met my needs, then sorting through the myriad of somewhat confusingly- (or just plain badly-) written documentation. The best part was being able to use the same language end-to-end. When I deal with PHP, there is always some context-switching between it and the other parts. This project flowed much more naturally and left me quite enthusiastic about whatever the next one is (I get a lot of latitude in devising solutions). Some of the code is probably badly-written and I'll spend some time cleaning that up (first project in Node) for an update and there are still a couple of parts to write (shell scripts, mainly). There's also one key part that no-one seems to be able to solve (MD5 in Mono won't match the MD5 from JS), but we'll figure that out as we can ignore it, for now. Really, given all the interruptions I faced during the process, going from zero to finished in two weeks of eight-hour days (including having to learn some things) feels pretty good. The same project in PHP would have taken about the same amount of time, without having to learn new things. Admittedly, I'm a slow coder because I want to make it right the first time so I don't have to f* with it later, not just have a running solution. I'm not as thrilled with PHP as I used to be and half the time, I feel like I should reinvent the wheel, rather than just using a lib. That's my informal review of the experience. Take it for what it's worth.
- ilaksh 13y agoPretty big bias issue with the choice of options. Would like to see a tally of Other broken down on the home page of results.
- omgitstom 13y agoMan, I would love to see this done yearly so we can examine the trends.
- michaelochurch 13y agoI wouldn't limit myself to one language or framework, in reality. Growing very fast? Python, with C for high-performance components. Python's got great libraries for everything, and hiring Python and C programmers wouldn't be hard because those languages have a lot of users. Growing typically fast? Clojure. Drop to Java if needed for extremely high performance demands, or if I need to hire fast. Growing at a leisurely pace? I'd be tempted to try Haskell (and possibly switch to Clojure). It's badass, it'd be fun to learn, and some of the smartest people I know are big fans of it. However, with the "leisurely pace" (R&D) I'd be tempted to hire people only as smart as I am and let them use whatever they wanted.