13 ms·

How I resurrected my MacBook Pro by putting it in the oven

215 points by alesdotio 13y ago

Kliment 13y ago
You might want to get rid of that Vertex 2 as soon as reasonably possible. It has an issue where at some point when switched on or resumed from sleep it will corrupt all your data and refuse to boot. Some have a different bug where it will silently corrupt some of your data and the only way to find out is by the HDD light being on for longer than usual. Back up your data and get rid of it. I had it happen to me twice (warranty replacement after the first one, but then second one did it too). OCZ died as a result of this. Save yourself before it's too late.
- bananas 13y ago
  +1 for that. Had exactly the same trouble. Moved to Samsung 840 Pro since - everything works just fine.
  - slantyyz 13y ago
    I had one Vertex 2 just up and die, but another one is still going strong on Macbook, but that one's just for surfing, so it's not critical if I experience a catastrophic data loss. Will have to agree with you, the 840 Pro's are great.
- uptown 13y ago
  Any idea if the Vertex 3 is in danger of this as well? I've been running it since April, 2011 without a problem - and have good backups - but I'd hate to waste the time trying to recover.
  - spartango 13y ago
    Vertex 3 with the latest firmware seems relatively stable.
- alesdotio 13y ago
  That sounds really bad. Guess this laptop is totally doomed now. Thanks for the tip though.
jonmrodriguez 13y ago
How does this work? Is the idea that there's a loose chip, and you're reflowing the solder to re-attach it? Relatedly, one of my friends successfully revived a bricked playstation by heating up the motherboard with a heat gun.
- andyjohnson0 13y ago
  As far as I know, 170C is not quite hot enough to melt solder. It would need to be around 200C.
  - ics 13y ago
    Depends on the alloy, tin/bismuth will melt around 140C. I would've expected over 180C to be necessary as well though. Sn63Pb37 is very common and melts at 180C, but since it has lead I don't think it's used much in large scale electronics manufacture.
    - throwwit 13y ago
      I read somewhere the xbox gpu problem was a result of the lead-free solder used to meet environmental regulations.
      - jarin 13y ago
        THANKS OBAMA
        KC8ZKF 13y ago
        You're blaming RoHS on Obama?
        Anderkent 13y ago
        http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/thanks-obama http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/thanks-obama
        13y ago
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
- DanBC 13y ago
  Short circuits are sometimes fixed by melting the solder. Surface tension tends to keep devices attached to the printed circuit board and the solder on the pads. It's not something I would try except as a measure of last resort.
steeve 13y ago
Or you can use a hot air gun if you have one. Reflowing does work wonders.
- DanBC 13y ago
  Be careful not to use vigorous airspeed. It's possible to blow balls of solder away from the pads. These then cause shorts and are annoying to fault find and repair.
  - fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
    Huh? The solder balls are under the chip sandwiched between the IC and the PCB. There is no direct contact with the hot air.
    - DanBC 13y ago
      Yes, on a BGA the pads are under the IC package. That BGA will be on a PCB close to other ICs which has other packages. Using a hot airgun risks distributing small balls of solder.
      - fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
        If you can accidentally create solder-bridges with a hot-air rework, then there was too much solder; even if you're talking about fine-pitch TQFP's. I've accidentally made bridges using QFN's but only on crappy homemade PCB's and again, with too much solder. It is usually easy to correct. You can dislodge nearby capacitors, diodes, resistors, etc. but that's about it. On a good PCB that's been cleaned properly there won't be any errant solder-balls, and surface tension will not allow them to form even when using a hot-air gun or rework tool. I've never seen a hot-air tool that blows with enough force to overcome the surface tension of the solder. I have managed to get make a mess with solder when removing IC's using compressed air (not for the faint of heart), but that's a different story and it is still easy to clean up.
        13y ago
Pitarou 13y ago
Do NOT try this with a microwave oven. If you do, there will be a bad smell, and lots of sounds and lights, and you will not read Hacker News today.
- egeozcan 13y ago
  > and you will not read Hacker News today not from your laptop, at least. and most probably not from within your house too. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Will%20It%20Microwave https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Will%20It%20Mic...
- core1024 13y ago
  You can use even a microwave oven, but only in GRILL mode ;)
- aidos 13y ago
  I'm sure it wasn't a great idea but we used to microwave things for the effect. At one point there were no lightbulbs left in our house because they'd all gone in the microwave. Your very own Aurora Microwavas from the comfort of your own kitchen.
  - MichaelGG 13y ago
    Wait doesn't this break the microwave? If not, I'm gonna show my kids something really neat.
    - aidos 13y ago
      Eventually the gas in the bulb expands too much and the bulb itself shatters. In my experience, other than having to clean up the broken glass, the microwave still runs fine. At one point we had a bulb where the glass expanded out enough to ease the pressure created. We could use it again and again. Maybe it's a bad thing to do, maybe there's some horrific gas that's created. Someone on here could weigh in on that. It's an incredible effect though and I'd happily do it again. Obviously, general disclaimers on looking after your own health and safety apply.
nichodges 13y ago
Reminds me of my first Raspberry Pi. It was from the first batch, and only worked if I gave it a blast with a hairdryer. Once it warmed up it booted fine, but if I turned off the hairdryer it would turn off after about 30 seconds. At the time it was about a month wait for a new one to arrive, so I did a lot of initial Pi discovery with a hairdryer.
- stinos 13y ago
  Tried it on mine, no luck. Basically it didn't run properly because the resistance of the fuse was ridiculously high resulting in a voltage drop of almost 1V. Meaning I had to power it with a 6.5V power supply. Well, you don't find those easily so I just got rid of the fuse.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
watson 13y ago
For anyone interested in the nerdy details of why this works: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering Anyway, this isn't new - I remember seeing this on Slashdot, HN and a lot ofter other places over the years: http://voices.yahoo.com/how-reflow-laptop-motherboard-oven-6784790.html http://voices.yahoo.com/how-reflow-laptop-motherboard-oven-6... http://mr-mediocre.hubpages.com/hub/How-Baking-A-Motherboard-in-the-Oven-Worked-for-Me http://mr-mediocre.hubpages.com/hub/How-Baking-A-Motherboard... etc...
Munksgaard 13y ago
I've done this twice on different laptops. It works like a charm :) The explanation I got when I did it the first time was this: When the computer heats up and gets cold a lot, over time the solder joints on the motherboard might "crack", or something, effectively giving loose conncetions. By heating the joints in this controlled manner, the metal melts and solidifies properly when cooled down.
kakoni 13y ago
So, first reflow your motherboard, then bake some bread, get all those toxic flavours in? (Wondering if this would somehow ruin your oven..)
- q3k 13y ago
  Actually, a lot of electronics from this era failed because they manufacturers were still experimenting with RoHS (read: no lead) electronics production, especially lead-free solder. While heating a RoHS PCB in a food oven might still be kinda toxic, at least it's lead-free ;).
jonmrodriguez 13y ago
If you use a temperature hot enough for reflow (200C or more, according to andyjohnson0), is there any risk of heavy components on the bottom side falling off?
- benjamincburns 13y ago
  Except for extreme cases, no. The cohesive force of molten solder is more than enough to hold your components in place. Also interestingly enough, this is also what causes surface mount components to automagically "settle" over their pads when you have the proper amount of solder/flux.
rekwah 13y ago
Reminds me of the Xbox 360 "towel trick" tutorials for combating RROD back on the original models.
WildUtah 13y ago
I once had a Toshiba laptop that would work only after spending twenty minutes in the freezer, and then only until it warmed up. I don't think it had the same problem as this MacBook, though.
- werid 13y ago
  That sounds like the old harddrive trick where a harddrive refuses to start until it's cold enough.
  - dorfuss 13y ago
    How do you guys invent this stuff? It wouldn't cross my mind... ;)
    - marquis 13y ago
      Learn how computers work, some mechanical physics knowledge would be helpful. You need a bit of education in order to rely safely on Googled advice, and if in doubt: don't do it!
  - yardie 13y ago
    I unbroke an iPod 5G by slamming it into my desk fairly hard. That was about 3 years ago and it's still working. Something about the HDD bearings seizing because of shock. I have a Seagate HDD in the freezer for 2 years now. Every method of recovery I've used has been unsuccessful. I'm waiting to send it into a recovery service, and $1500+ that I haven't got lying around.
    - specialist 13y ago
      While doing desktop support, one of my Mac user's hard drive was failing, wouldn't spin up at boot. So you had to help spin it up. One trick was to give the HDD housing a rotation jerk the moment you turn on power. Another was to use a pencil eraser to spin the exposed spindle, also during power on. Good times.
furyg3 13y ago
> For a perfectly golden and crunchy crust make sure you leave it in there for precisely around 7 minutes. Comedy gold.
downplay 13y ago
I have a friend, that lived in a dodgy part of town. And the day he bought his new Powerbook, he hid it in the oven before he left the house. Sadly after a visit to the pub, he thought pizza would be a good idea and preheated the oven. Only to suddenly realise his new computer was inside it. He rescued and cooled it, and oddly, it survived! Only it had shelf marks permanently moulded into the chassis forever more.
- sgt 13y ago
  "that lived in a dodgy part of town." ^ How is this relevant to your story?
  - raimue 13y ago
    Why else would you need to hide your laptop in the oven?
  - pgeorgi 13y ago
    I read that as an explanation for the "hide notebooks in the oven" thing.
- fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
  I am surprised the LCD survived. Most don't like temperatures higher than ~150 F.
- aestra 13y ago
  This is why I obsessively check the oven before I turn it on. Always. We had an incident when I was probably 5 years old when my sister put a stuffed toys in the oven then a while later my mom turned it on to use it. Then we smelled smoke... There was no lasting damage (beyond my sister losing her favorite toy) and she of course was much too young to know better. That incident however got me paranoid about me turning on the oven with unknown objects in it. So now I check first.
mgkimsal 13y ago
"with people having apparently similar but in reality completely unrelated problems" Not sure what he was reading - this is a known problem with at least many early 2011 MBP - I had one (still do - it's in the closet). Apple is refusing to acknowledge this as a problem, and will offer to replace the motherboard (or something like that) for ... $300 and approximately 5 business days. From what I've read, whatever they replace doesn't actually do the trick; by many accounts, even when you drop it off for repair, they've claimed to not be able to reproduce the problem. Hint: use the external video chip, or force a use of it. FWIW, if you're in the triangle area, sixrig.com gives really good service, and got me a new refurb laptop the day after xmas at 9pm at night. Source: apple forums and http://mbp2011.com http://mbp2011.com
- johnchristopher 13y ago
  > Source: apple forums and http://mbp2011.com http://mbp2011.com Wow: “The problem might be on the GPU” Said the “Genius”. That’s exactly what I was hoping to hear (he didn’t mentioned this until I pushed them this far.) So I replied, “You all knew exactly what’s going on here and you intentionally kept this from the customers, right?” Right this moment, the “Genius” has left. That's insane.
  - mgkimsal 13y ago
    They wouldn't run any advanced diagnostics on mine because I had 'too much ram' in it - model was rated for 8gb but I had 16gb. Not necessarily unreasonable, but... it worked fine for 2 years with that ram in it, and the problem was obviously video related. well, nothing's that obvious, but... they didn't offer to just unscrew the back, remove the extra ram, and run more tests - they seemed to want to not handle my issue at the store. "5 business days" without my business computer is a bit too much, and now I realize I need a fallback strategy. :/
  - slantyyz 13y ago
    There's a lot of variability these stories in terms of how you're treated by a Genius when you take your computer in. When I took my problematic 2011 MBP in, they pretty quickly determined that it was a motherboard issue and replaced it. Two months after my motherboard was replaced the video glitches started appearing again. Coincidentally (or not?) it happens that I use Coda every day, and Coda forced Macs (inadvertently, apparently -- Panic used Apple's guidelines on how to implement this "gracefully", but Apple's flag was buggy) to use the discrete card all the time. Interestingly enough, once Panic disabled the 'use discrete gpu' flag in Coda, my screen glitch problems basically went away on my new motherboard.
quackerhacker 13y ago
I gotta say, I would've never thought of baking the motherboard. Makes sense in regards to overclocking and as the op stated, he constantly ran his MBP. Baking, I guess, would kinda resolder connections...total guess. My recommendation, I repair devices all the time now, after you remove all the little screws and the piece you need (like a motherboard or pcb), take the time and put every screw in the hole it came out of. Trick I learned as a mechanic. It helps prevents losing them and guessing, since sometimes screw threads and height vary.
- gus_massa 13y ago
  I usually make a map of the board and use masking tape to fix the screw to the map.
  - quackerhacker 13y ago
    Yeah, if I'm running a fast fix (like pull a battery, ect.) I'll usually arrange the screws in an orientation to how I pulled them out, but long fixes like the op had (or when your waiting for parts)... I put the back in. Not a bad idea with the masking tape, guess a magnet would work too.
eterpstra 13y ago
Similar story: I was at a friend's house, and we wanted to play Nintendo Wii. Tried to turn it on, but nothing happened. My buddy grabbed the power brick, tossed it in the microwave, and blasted it for 3 seconds. After plugging it back in, it started like nothing was wrong. I was flabbergasted (one: because WTF! who puts a power supply in a microwave? and two: OMG! it worked!)
- kawsper 13y ago
  It isn't the best of ideas to cook electronics in a oven also used for food.
  - eterpstra 13y ago
    One detail I forgot to mention: this was at the end of a very successful night of drinking.
    - lifeformed 13y ago
      Ah, now it all makes sense.
- fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
  Stupid Wii power supplies, these are known to be pieces of junk. I keep a spare for this reason. Simply letting it "rest" unconnected for some unknown duration also does the trick.
  - outworlder 13y ago
    That's probably an open polyfuse. Unlike the fuses of old, the new ones actually regenerate themselves (re-crystallize).
    - fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
      That is a good idea. I should have thought of that. Thanks.
zz1 13y ago
Same procedure done by Mio Cugino, but way more accurate! :) http://www.miocugino.com/macbook-resuscitato/ http://www.miocugino.com/macbook-resuscitato/
- gus_massa 13y ago
  Autotranlation: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.miocugino.com%2Fmacbook-resuscitato%2F&sandbox=1 http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=...
ripa 13y ago
This is a known method for fixing this type of problem where the solder has been damaged due to excess heat and/or improper cooling from the start. It's also known that this is most likely a temporary fix where it will fail again in a couple of months (depending on the usage etc.). This is also why I would take great caution purchasing a used laptop (especially with a discrete graphics card). It's a real risk that the previous user did this trick to quickly sell it while it's "working". As an owner of a 2011 Macbook Pro with AMD graphics (known to fail) I sure hope that Apple acknowledges this issue soon.
netcan 13y ago
Rise again from the ashes.
marincounty 13y ago
Did not read story, but if it it what I think; HP had the same problem with a bad nvidia chip, poorly designed cooling system, etc. They denied the problem, until sued. Meanwhile, desperate users where putting their motherboards in the oven, curling the hairs in the nvida chip, and sticking pennies on the hot chip. I will never buy another HP laptop! I'm surprised Apple won't admit to a problem. I think if Steve was still alive he would admit to the defect and offer a fix--why?? Because Steve was one of us--he liked his toys, and expected them to work. A video card problem would have irked the hell out of home, and his engineers would have to pay for their mistake. What's his name--Tim Cook--just worries about the books. Which will eventually be Apples fall from grace.
- mst 13y ago
  > Did not read story Then please don't comment. This is Hacker News, not slashdot.
  - PhantomGremlin 13y ago
    Right. It's not like the story was War and Peace. Not even the Cliff's Notes of War and Peace. It took about a minute for me to read, including time looking at the pictures.
ninive 13y ago
Did it too successfully 3 years ago with my Acer laptop. It worked but as you're saying, didn't lasted so much. Anyway was pretty cool ;) Pic here: http://imgur.com/iDaYpBD http://imgur.com/iDaYpBD
enscr 13y ago
Dealt with similar issue with HP tx2000 (HP is a horrible company that refuses to acknowledge a problem that has plagued their entire series). I removed the processor, applied fresh thermal paste with a copper shim & gave it the oven + hair dryer treatment. It worked for a while but failed again. Not worth wasting time on it. It's better to ebay it for parts.
- jcd748 13y ago
  I used to have an HP with this problem as well. Eventually I managed to get my files off the computer, and then promptly bought a new, not-an-HP laptop. Never again.
benburton 13y ago
> leave it in there for precisely around 7 minutes Nice.
bcl 13y ago
Sounds like tin (solder) whiskers: http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/background/index.htm http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/background/index.htm
epx 13y ago
I used a Sterilair (a small heater that supposedly cleans the air) to ressurect a Sony camera. It also stopped working with no obvious reason, I suspected of humidity and left it hung about 30cm above the heater for one day.
shocks 13y ago
I have done this with a handful of Xbox 360s. Works like a charm! Also makes for some interesting questions from your housemates...
tomwhipple 13y ago
See also http://support.apple.com/kb/TS4088?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US http://support.apple.com/kb/TS4088?viewlocale=en_US&locale=e... I printed the article, the GPU kernel panic log and took them to the Genius bar. Apple replaced the mainboard for free, more than 3 years after the purchase. It took me more than a year of dealing with random crashes and several visits to the genius bar before I found this article. Though the downside is that you'd miss the excitement described here...
- Neeo 13y ago
  I have searched the definition of existence out of this issue but have never found this article, if I had just seen this article before the 3 year mark. But I have already solved the issue by installing Linux and not installing the Nvidia driver. I will buy a new laptop soon anyways, but I will still run Linux tough. I will try OP's method when I get a new laptop.
kator 13y ago
There are chips on both sides of this board, is there a chance you could re-flow them off because of gravity on the other side of the board?
danmatan 13y ago
I recall some years ago (7?), some other mac having some characteristic issue that could almost always be fixed with a little time in the oven. Having a kitchen with an oven and living in a student area where Apple products were popular, I sensed a business opportunity. I put up an ad on some local classifieds with a lowball price for these units (but not much different than what the broken ones would sell for on Ebay, minus the hassle). I quickly learned that, after investing in a premium product, people would rather hold onto their brick rather than turn it into at least some cash. I never even got a chance to try out the procedure, people would counter-offer with ridiculous prices for, what is for them, a brick. The sunk cost fallacy at work. edit: I think I even offered pickup and some data recovery/security as a part of the offer, no takers.
Edmond 13y ago
Some of these weird hardware fixes are due to manufacturers using adhesive. I believe Creative (creative.com) for instance intentionally uses adhesives that ware out after a certain period. This would cause your product to stop working, I did a writeup on fixing their MP3 players some years back : http://vistev.blogspot.com/2010/02/harware-fix-for-creative-zen.html http://vistev.blogspot.com/2010/02/harware-fix-for-creative-... Now merely hitting the device or doing some other crazy stuff may cause the necessary components to align and viola things work :)
caycep 13y ago
This is due to failure of the ball grid array solder, I'm assuming? Most of what I've seen has been due to failure of the video card - I think the nvidia ones were notorious on certain models, but I've had it happen on my 2009 iMac with a radeon card. Sort of what sold me on integrated GPU's as being the ideal in these form factors - less parts to blow up in your face....
- slantyyz 13y ago
  >> This is due to failure of the ball grid array solder, I'm assuming? On the longest 2011 MBP GPU issue discussion on Apple Support, there was some speculation that the switch to weaker "green" solder by Apple caused the issue. Some people had their GPUs reflowed at an independent service center, and it fixed the problem, but for others, it was only a short term fix, with the GPU glitch returning after a few weeks/months.
- nobleach 13y ago
  I can confirm that my 2008 iMac had this same problem with the nVidia card. And yes, cooking it in the oven did bring it back long enough to grab the few items that I wanted. At the time, I read that it had to do with Apple switching to lead free solder. Sad to know I may face this with the 2011 MBP that I am typing this on (and I love so dearly)
  - caycep 13y ago
    fortunately, I had my mac setup with ssh enabled...so I was able to rsync it off to another computer off network. (Who needs graphics anyway?) Apple support, to their credit, handled my case extremely well, even though I was out of warranty.
mjt0229 13y ago
One thing that I love to make is mac & cheese.
unicornporn 13y ago
Remember that there might be a law in your country that regulates complaints. In Sweden we have "reklamationstid"[1] which gives you sort of a legislated warranty (applies to almost all goods) for three years. All goods that I have complained about using "reklamationstiden" have been replaced. [1] http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.konsumentverket.se/mobil/Din-ratt-som-konsument/Reklamera-och-klaga/&usg=ALkJrhh34gx7-dXD27hTnEIGRK1VK2Oa2w http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&h...
- danmatan 13y ago
  Is it common to have your replacement/repair refused unless you bring up the "reklamationstiden" argument?
  - unicornporn 13y ago
    Yes, many people don't know about this law. The shops know this and takes advantage of it. Of course there is also the manufacturer's warranty, which lasts for as long as the manufacturer decides.
    - oneeyedpigeon 13y ago
      Why have that law, and then make it legal for the shops to not acknowledge it up front? Why does the law have to be some weird kind of game where only people in the know benefit from it?
fakename 13y ago
I had ram slots die in my mbp due to warping. the solution was to loosen the screws around the ram slots, letting the bent board unbend. I imagine cooking would soften things up and allow loose connections to better connect.
martydill 13y ago
This has been an issue as far back as a decade ago with G3 iBooks. I had my G3 800's logic board replaced twice under warranty, but it failed again after that. The 'hot coin on the gpu' trick solved the problem, albeit temporarily. http://forums.macnn.com/69/mac-notebooks/210232/diy-ibook-dual-usb-logic-board/ http://forums.macnn.com/69/mac-notebooks/210232/diy-ibook-du... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBook#Quality_issues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBook#Quality_issues
mmastrac 13y ago
I resurrected my old 2009 Macbook Pro that was doing something similar by turning it on and putting it under a blanket for an hour. It generated enough heat to reflow whatever BGA had busted and has worked perfectly since.
D9u 13y ago
I had a somewhat similar issue with an Acer Aspire Aspire One ZG5 netbook, except my problem was that the device would power off after about 1.5 minutes from powering on. Apparently a thermal cutoff switch needed some recalibration/replacement, so my fix was 2 hours in the freezer followed by a few more hours waiting for condensation to evaporate before attempting to power the netbook on again... I used the above method for nearly a year before acquiring my present laptop, relegating the netbook to my growing pile of disfunctional hardware.
dleibovic 13y ago
Is there any cause for concern about toxic chemicals being released into an oven that you use to cook food?
greyskull 13y ago
This was a "well-known" (quoted because it's well known as far as enthusiast communities are concerned) fix attempt for discrete GPU cards on desktops. I've seen a lot of success stories where old GPUs (think GTX 8800) would crap out; owner would take off the shroud, heatsink, and any other removable parts, put it in the oven for a few minutes, and boom, reflowed solder fixed the issue.
btoptical 13y ago
I think this process is really baking out moisture as the PCBA is not in the oven long enough to get to temperature and the temperature is not hot enough to reflow the solder. Most of the components on the board are not hermetically packaged and there probably are moisture sensitive parts on the PCBA. So the baking at 170C for 7 minutes is essentially a drying process. Also, I think Apple probably has to be ROHS compliant and that means they have to use lead-free TnSn solder. The transition temperature for lead-free solder is typically about 20C higher than normal leaded solders.
grandalf 13y ago
If it's reflowing then couldn't the same be accomplished with more focused application of a heat gun?
nviennot 13y ago
That reminds me of http://viennot.biz/reflow_oven.pdf http://viennot.biz/reflow_oven.pdf
pyed 13y ago
I had the same issue on early 2011, fixed it for 600$+ because I'm not in the US, and sold it for 768$ and got the new Retina with hate.
michaelchum 13y ago
This is astonishing... But anyone else feels like this sounds like trolling? There is no actual video, but only pictures. And perhaps, maybe it's just me, but I don't see how high heat can resurrect the logic board?
mmariani 13y ago
My MBP17 died one week ago. Way to go Apple!
null_ptr 13y ago
It makes me sad to read how some mistreat their laptops. Why keep it on 24/7? Even if you're using your computer 12 hours a day you're letting it burn for nothing for the other 12! And then you buy a new one every year.
- sneak 13y ago
  Burn what, precisely? It's not a woodstove.
- prewett 13y ago
  Electronics likes being in a steady thermal state, and mechanical devices like a hard drive have less wear when continuously spinning. It's the spinning up and down that causes a lot of the wear.
kkl232 13y ago
Hilarious!! At some point I spilled water all over my MacbookPro and I turned it off and let it dry overnight. The next morning it refused to turn on. I took it to Apple and they say they must send it to repairs for 750 dollars!! I refused to pay money, went home, asked some friends about it, and concluded that I should put my computer in an inverted position like a teepee. I let it sit for 2 days. And Voila! Good as new!
- josephjrobison 13y ago
  Same exact thing happened to me! Brand new hot starbucks green tea spilled all over my 4 month old MacBook Air mid-2013. I was devastated. Stupidly I tried to turn it on right after the spill and it turned on for a moment then shut off and wouldn't turn on again. I put the keyboard face down on paper towels and indirectly in front of a fan for a few days and it came back to life! I now have a keyboard spill guard of course...
- __david__ 13y ago
  If you have a gas oven with a pilot lite, it's the perfect place to let things dry out (don't turn it on, just let the small flame of the pilot lite dry things out). These seem to be more rare nowadays, though.
auctiontheory 13y ago
This gives "cooking the books" a whole new meaning.
- PhantomGremlin 13y ago
  Nicely done. Best quip I've read on HN today.
mncolinlee 13y ago
This is a hackish form of "Reflow Soldering." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering I used to work at Cray, the supercomputer company. Back in the 1970s, 30 yrs before I got there, they used to solder the circuits on each board by baking the entire board in an actual kitchen oven. With smaller and more delicate circuitry on mainboards these days, this is less practical and more dangerous, but that doesn't mean it isn't still possible with some degree of luck. I'd still recommend removing the BIOS battery if you're crazy enough to attempt this.
MobsterMac 13y ago
There is a huge uprising about Mac Book Pro's motherboard's failing. I wonder if this would work for the issues described here. https://discussions.apple.com/message/25163418?ac_cid=tw123456#25163418 https://discussions.apple.com/message/25163418?ac_cid=tw1234...

215 points by alesdotio 13y ago

You might want to get rid of that Vertex 2 as soon as reasonably possible. It has an issue where at some point when switched on or resumed from sleep it will corrupt all your data and refuse to boot. Some have a different bug where it will silently corrupt some of your data and the only way to find out is by the HDD light being on for longer than usual. Back up your data and get rid of it. I had it happen to me twice (warranty replacement after the first one, but then second one did it too). OCZ died as a result of this. Save yourself before it's too late.

bananas 13y ago
+1 for that. Had exactly the same trouble. Moved to Samsung 840 Pro since - everything works just fine.
- slantyyz 13y ago
  I had one Vertex 2 just up and die, but another one is still going strong on Macbook, but that one's just for surfing, so it's not critical if I experience a catastrophic data loss. Will have to agree with you, the 840 Pro's are great.
uptown 13y ago
Any idea if the Vertex 3 is in danger of this as well? I've been running it since April, 2011 without a problem - and have good backups - but I'd hate to waste the time trying to recover.
- spartango 13y ago
  Vertex 3 with the latest firmware seems relatively stable.
alesdotio 13y ago
That sounds really bad. Guess this laptop is totally doomed now. Thanks for the tip though.

jonmrodriguez 13y ago

How does this work? Is the idea that there's a loose chip, and you're reflowing the solder to re-attach it? Relatedly, one of my friends successfully revived a bricked playstation by heating up the motherboard with a heat gun.

andyjohnson0 13y ago
As far as I know, 170C is not quite hot enough to melt solder. It would need to be around 200C.
- ics 13y ago
  Depends on the alloy, tin/bismuth will melt around 140C. I would've expected over 180C to be necessary as well though. Sn63Pb37 is very common and melts at 180C, but since it has lead I don't think it's used much in large scale electronics manufacture.
  - throwwit 13y ago
    I read somewhere the xbox gpu problem was a result of the lead-free solder used to meet environmental regulations.
    - jarin 13y ago
      THANKS OBAMA
      - KC8ZKF 13y ago
        You're blaming RoHS on Obama?
        Anderkent 13y ago
        http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/thanks-obama http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/thanks-obama
        13y ago

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

DanBC 13y ago
Short circuits are sometimes fixed by melting the solder. Surface tension tends to keep devices attached to the printed circuit board and the solder on the pads. It's not something I would try except as a measure of last resort.

steeve 13y ago

Or you can use a hot air gun if you have one. Reflowing does work wonders.

DanBC 13y ago
Be careful not to use vigorous airspeed. It's possible to blow balls of solder away from the pads. These then cause shorts and are annoying to fault find and repair.
- fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
  Huh? The solder balls are under the chip sandwiched between the IC and the PCB. There is no direct contact with the hot air.
  - DanBC 13y ago
    Yes, on a BGA the pads are under the IC package. That BGA will be on a PCB close to other ICs which has other packages. Using a hot airgun risks distributing small balls of solder.
    - fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
      If you can accidentally create solder-bridges with a hot-air rework, then there was too much solder; even if you're talking about fine-pitch TQFP's. I've accidentally made bridges using QFN's but only on crappy homemade PCB's and again, with too much solder. It is usually easy to correct. You can dislodge nearby capacitors, diodes, resistors, etc. but that's about it. On a good PCB that's been cleaned properly there won't be any errant solder-balls, and surface tension will not allow them to form even when using a hot-air gun or rework tool. I've never seen a hot-air tool that blows with enough force to overcome the surface tension of the solder. I have managed to get make a mess with solder when removing IC's using compressed air (not for the faint of heart), but that's a different story and it is still easy to clean up.
      - 13y ago

Pitarou 13y ago

Do NOT try this with a microwave oven. If you do, there will be a bad smell, and lots of sounds and lights, and you will not read Hacker News today.

egeozcan 13y ago
> and you will not read Hacker News today not from your laptop, at least. and most probably not from within your house too. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Will%20It%20Microwave https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Will%20It%20Mic...
core1024 13y ago
You can use even a microwave oven, but only in GRILL mode ;)
aidos 13y ago
I'm sure it wasn't a great idea but we used to microwave things for the effect. At one point there were no lightbulbs left in our house because they'd all gone in the microwave. Your very own Aurora Microwavas from the comfort of your own kitchen.
- MichaelGG 13y ago
  Wait doesn't this break the microwave? If not, I'm gonna show my kids something really neat.
  - aidos 13y ago
    Eventually the gas in the bulb expands too much and the bulb itself shatters. In my experience, other than having to clean up the broken glass, the microwave still runs fine. At one point we had a bulb where the glass expanded out enough to ease the pressure created. We could use it again and again. Maybe it's a bad thing to do, maybe there's some horrific gas that's created. Someone on here could weigh in on that. It's an incredible effect though and I'd happily do it again. Obviously, general disclaimers on looking after your own health and safety apply.

nichodges 13y ago

Reminds me of my first Raspberry Pi. It was from the first batch, and only worked if I gave it a blast with a hairdryer. Once it warmed up it booted fine, but if I turned off the hairdryer it would turn off after about 30 seconds. At the time it was about a month wait for a new one to arrive, so I did a lot of initial Pi discovery with a hairdryer.

stinos 13y ago
Tried it on mine, no luck. Basically it didn't run properly because the resistance of the fuse was ridiculously high resulting in a voltage drop of almost 1V. Meaning I had to power it with a 6.5V power supply. Well, you don't find those easily so I just got rid of the fuse.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

watson 13y ago

For anyone interested in the nerdy details of why this works: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering Anyway, this isn't new - I remember seeing this on Slashdot, HN and a lot ofter other places over the years: http://voices.yahoo.com/how-reflow-laptop-motherboard-oven-6784790.html http://voices.yahoo.com/how-reflow-laptop-motherboard-oven-6... http://mr-mediocre.hubpages.com/hub/How-Baking-A-Motherboard-in-the-Oven-Worked-for-Me http://mr-mediocre.hubpages.com/hub/How-Baking-A-Motherboard... etc...

Munksgaard 13y ago

I've done this twice on different laptops. It works like a charm :) The explanation I got when I did it the first time was this: When the computer heats up and gets cold a lot, over time the solder joints on the motherboard might "crack", or something, effectively giving loose conncetions. By heating the joints in this controlled manner, the metal melts and solidifies properly when cooled down.

kakoni 13y ago

So, first reflow your motherboard, then bake some bread, get all those toxic flavours in? (Wondering if this would somehow ruin your oven..)

q3k 13y ago
Actually, a lot of electronics from this era failed because they manufacturers were still experimenting with RoHS (read: no lead) electronics production, especially lead-free solder. While heating a RoHS PCB in a food oven might still be kinda toxic, at least it's lead-free ;).

jonmrodriguez 13y ago

If you use a temperature hot enough for reflow (200C or more, according to andyjohnson0), is there any risk of heavy components on the bottom side falling off?

benjamincburns 13y ago
Except for extreme cases, no. The cohesive force of molten solder is more than enough to hold your components in place. Also interestingly enough, this is also what causes surface mount components to automagically "settle" over their pads when you have the proper amount of solder/flux.

rekwah 13y ago

Reminds me of the Xbox 360 "towel trick" tutorials for combating RROD back on the original models.

WildUtah 13y ago

I once had a Toshiba laptop that would work only after spending twenty minutes in the freezer, and then only until it warmed up. I don't think it had the same problem as this MacBook, though.

werid 13y ago
That sounds like the old harddrive trick where a harddrive refuses to start until it's cold enough.
- dorfuss 13y ago
  How do you guys invent this stuff? It wouldn't cross my mind... ;)
  - marquis 13y ago
    Learn how computers work, some mechanical physics knowledge would be helpful. You need a bit of education in order to rely safely on Googled advice, and if in doubt: don't do it!
- yardie 13y ago
  I unbroke an iPod 5G by slamming it into my desk fairly hard. That was about 3 years ago and it's still working. Something about the HDD bearings seizing because of shock. I have a Seagate HDD in the freezer for 2 years now. Every method of recovery I've used has been unsuccessful. I'm waiting to send it into a recovery service, and $1500+ that I haven't got lying around.
  - specialist 13y ago
    While doing desktop support, one of my Mac user's hard drive was failing, wouldn't spin up at boot. So you had to help spin it up. One trick was to give the HDD housing a rotation jerk the moment you turn on power. Another was to use a pencil eraser to spin the exposed spindle, also during power on. Good times.

furyg3 13y ago

> For a perfectly golden and crunchy crust make sure you leave it in there for precisely around 7 minutes. Comedy gold.

downplay 13y ago

I have a friend, that lived in a dodgy part of town. And the day he bought his new Powerbook, he hid it in the oven before he left the house. Sadly after a visit to the pub, he thought pizza would be a good idea and preheated the oven. Only to suddenly realise his new computer was inside it. He rescued and cooled it, and oddly, it survived! Only it had shelf marks permanently moulded into the chassis forever more.

sgt 13y ago
"that lived in a dodgy part of town." ^ How is this relevant to your story?
- raimue 13y ago
  Why else would you need to hide your laptop in the oven?
- pgeorgi 13y ago
  I read that as an explanation for the "hide notebooks in the oven" thing.
fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
I am surprised the LCD survived. Most don't like temperatures higher than ~150 F.
aestra 13y ago
This is why I obsessively check the oven before I turn it on. Always. We had an incident when I was probably 5 years old when my sister put a stuffed toys in the oven then a while later my mom turned it on to use it. Then we smelled smoke... There was no lasting damage (beyond my sister losing her favorite toy) and she of course was much too young to know better. That incident however got me paranoid about me turning on the oven with unknown objects in it. So now I check first.

mgkimsal 13y ago

"with people having apparently similar but in reality completely unrelated problems" Not sure what he was reading - this is a known problem with at least many early 2011 MBP - I had one (still do - it's in the closet). Apple is refusing to acknowledge this as a problem, and will offer to replace the motherboard (or something like that) for ... $300 and approximately 5 business days. From what I've read, whatever they replace doesn't actually do the trick; by many accounts, even when you drop it off for repair, they've claimed to not be able to reproduce the problem. Hint: use the external video chip, or force a use of it. FWIW, if you're in the triangle area, sixrig.com gives really good service, and got me a new refurb laptop the day after xmas at 9pm at night. Source: apple forums and http://mbp2011.com http://mbp2011.com

johnchristopher 13y ago
> Source: apple forums and http://mbp2011.com http://mbp2011.com Wow: “The problem might be on the GPU” Said the “Genius”. That’s exactly what I was hoping to hear (he didn’t mentioned this until I pushed them this far.) So I replied, “You all knew exactly what’s going on here and you intentionally kept this from the customers, right?” Right this moment, the “Genius” has left. That's insane.
- mgkimsal 13y ago
  They wouldn't run any advanced diagnostics on mine because I had 'too much ram' in it - model was rated for 8gb but I had 16gb. Not necessarily unreasonable, but... it worked fine for 2 years with that ram in it, and the problem was obviously video related. well, nothing's that obvious, but... they didn't offer to just unscrew the back, remove the extra ram, and run more tests - they seemed to want to not handle my issue at the store. "5 business days" without my business computer is a bit too much, and now I realize I need a fallback strategy. :/
- slantyyz 13y ago
  There's a lot of variability these stories in terms of how you're treated by a Genius when you take your computer in. When I took my problematic 2011 MBP in, they pretty quickly determined that it was a motherboard issue and replaced it. Two months after my motherboard was replaced the video glitches started appearing again. Coincidentally (or not?) it happens that I use Coda every day, and Coda forced Macs (inadvertently, apparently -- Panic used Apple's guidelines on how to implement this "gracefully", but Apple's flag was buggy) to use the discrete card all the time. Interestingly enough, once Panic disabled the 'use discrete gpu' flag in Coda, my screen glitch problems basically went away on my new motherboard.

quackerhacker 13y ago

I gotta say, I would've never thought of baking the motherboard. Makes sense in regards to overclocking and as the op stated, he constantly ran his MBP. Baking, I guess, would kinda resolder connections...total guess. My recommendation, I repair devices all the time now, after you remove all the little screws and the piece you need (like a motherboard or pcb), take the time and put every screw in the hole it came out of. Trick I learned as a mechanic. It helps prevents losing them and guessing, since sometimes screw threads and height vary.

gus_massa 13y ago
I usually make a map of the board and use masking tape to fix the screw to the map.
- quackerhacker 13y ago
  Yeah, if I'm running a fast fix (like pull a battery, ect.) I'll usually arrange the screws in an orientation to how I pulled them out, but long fixes like the op had (or when your waiting for parts)... I put the back in. Not a bad idea with the masking tape, guess a magnet would work too.

eterpstra 13y ago

Similar story: I was at a friend's house, and we wanted to play Nintendo Wii. Tried to turn it on, but nothing happened. My buddy grabbed the power brick, tossed it in the microwave, and blasted it for 3 seconds. After plugging it back in, it started like nothing was wrong. I was flabbergasted (one: because WTF! who puts a power supply in a microwave? and two: OMG! it worked!)

kawsper 13y ago
It isn't the best of ideas to cook electronics in a oven also used for food.
- eterpstra 13y ago
  One detail I forgot to mention: this was at the end of a very successful night of drinking.
  - lifeformed 13y ago
    Ah, now it all makes sense.
fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
Stupid Wii power supplies, these are known to be pieces of junk. I keep a spare for this reason. Simply letting it "rest" unconnected for some unknown duration also does the trick.
- outworlder 13y ago
  That's probably an open polyfuse. Unlike the fuses of old, the new ones actually regenerate themselves (re-crystallize).
  - fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
    That is a good idea. I should have thought of that. Thanks.

zz1 13y ago

Same procedure done by Mio Cugino, but way more accurate! :) http://www.miocugino.com/macbook-resuscitato/ http://www.miocugino.com/macbook-resuscitato/

gus_massa 13y ago
Autotranlation: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.miocugino.com%2Fmacbook-resuscitato%2F&sandbox=1 http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=...

ripa 13y ago

This is a known method for fixing this type of problem where the solder has been damaged due to excess heat and/or improper cooling from the start. It's also known that this is most likely a temporary fix where it will fail again in a couple of months (depending on the usage etc.). This is also why I would take great caution purchasing a used laptop (especially with a discrete graphics card). It's a real risk that the previous user did this trick to quickly sell it while it's "working". As an owner of a 2011 Macbook Pro with AMD graphics (known to fail) I sure hope that Apple acknowledges this issue soon.

netcan 13y ago

Rise again from the ashes.

marincounty 13y ago

Did not read story, but if it it what I think; HP had the same problem with a bad nvidia chip, poorly designed cooling system, etc. They denied the problem, until sued. Meanwhile, desperate users where putting their motherboards in the oven, curling the hairs in the nvida chip, and sticking pennies on the hot chip. I will never buy another HP laptop! I'm surprised Apple won't admit to a problem. I think if Steve was still alive he would admit to the defect and offer a fix--why?? Because Steve was one of us--he liked his toys, and expected them to work. A video card problem would have irked the hell out of home, and his engineers would have to pay for their mistake. What's his name--Tim Cook--just worries about the books. Which will eventually be Apples fall from grace.

mst 13y ago
> Did not read story Then please don't comment. This is Hacker News, not slashdot.
- PhantomGremlin 13y ago
  Right. It's not like the story was War and Peace. Not even the Cliff's Notes of War and Peace. It took about a minute for me to read, including time looking at the pictures.

ninive 13y ago

Did it too successfully 3 years ago with my Acer laptop. It worked but as you're saying, didn't lasted so much. Anyway was pretty cool ;) Pic here: http://imgur.com/iDaYpBD http://imgur.com/iDaYpBD

enscr 13y ago

Dealt with similar issue with HP tx2000 (HP is a horrible company that refuses to acknowledge a problem that has plagued their entire series). I removed the processor, applied fresh thermal paste with a copper shim & gave it the oven + hair dryer treatment. It worked for a while but failed again. Not worth wasting time on it. It's better to ebay it for parts.

jcd748 13y ago
I used to have an HP with this problem as well. Eventually I managed to get my files off the computer, and then promptly bought a new, not-an-HP laptop. Never again.

benburton 13y ago

> leave it in there for precisely around 7 minutes Nice.

bcl 13y ago

Sounds like tin (solder) whiskers: http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/background/index.htm http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/background/index.htm

epx 13y ago

I used a Sterilair (a small heater that supposedly cleans the air) to ressurect a Sony camera. It also stopped working with no obvious reason, I suspected of humidity and left it hung about 30cm above the heater for one day.

shocks 13y ago

I have done this with a handful of Xbox 360s. Works like a charm! Also makes for some interesting questions from your housemates...

tomwhipple 13y ago

See also http://support.apple.com/kb/TS4088?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US http://support.apple.com/kb/TS4088?viewlocale=en_US&locale=e... I printed the article, the GPU kernel panic log and took them to the Genius bar. Apple replaced the mainboard for free, more than 3 years after the purchase. It took me more than a year of dealing with random crashes and several visits to the genius bar before I found this article. Though the downside is that you'd miss the excitement described here...

Neeo 13y ago
I have searched the definition of existence out of this issue but have never found this article, if I had just seen this article before the 3 year mark. But I have already solved the issue by installing Linux and not installing the Nvidia driver. I will buy a new laptop soon anyways, but I will still run Linux tough. I will try OP's method when I get a new laptop.

kator 13y ago

There are chips on both sides of this board, is there a chance you could re-flow them off because of gravity on the other side of the board?

danmatan 13y ago

I recall some years ago (7?), some other mac having some characteristic issue that could almost always be fixed with a little time in the oven. Having a kitchen with an oven and living in a student area where Apple products were popular, I sensed a business opportunity. I put up an ad on some local classifieds with a lowball price for these units (but not much different than what the broken ones would sell for on Ebay, minus the hassle). I quickly learned that, after investing in a premium product, people would rather hold onto their brick rather than turn it into at least some cash. I never even got a chance to try out the procedure, people would counter-offer with ridiculous prices for, what is for them, a brick. The sunk cost fallacy at work. edit: I think I even offered pickup and some data recovery/security as a part of the offer, no takers.

Edmond 13y ago

Some of these weird hardware fixes are due to manufacturers using adhesive. I believe Creative (creative.com) for instance intentionally uses adhesives that ware out after a certain period. This would cause your product to stop working, I did a writeup on fixing their MP3 players some years back : http://vistev.blogspot.com/2010/02/harware-fix-for-creative-zen.html http://vistev.blogspot.com/2010/02/harware-fix-for-creative-... Now merely hitting the device or doing some other crazy stuff may cause the necessary components to align and viola things work :)

caycep 13y ago

This is due to failure of the ball grid array solder, I'm assuming? Most of what I've seen has been due to failure of the video card - I think the nvidia ones were notorious on certain models, but I've had it happen on my 2009 iMac with a radeon card. Sort of what sold me on integrated GPU's as being the ideal in these form factors - less parts to blow up in your face....

slantyyz 13y ago
>> This is due to failure of the ball grid array solder, I'm assuming? On the longest 2011 MBP GPU issue discussion on Apple Support, there was some speculation that the switch to weaker "green" solder by Apple caused the issue. Some people had their GPUs reflowed at an independent service center, and it fixed the problem, but for others, it was only a short term fix, with the GPU glitch returning after a few weeks/months.
nobleach 13y ago
I can confirm that my 2008 iMac had this same problem with the nVidia card. And yes, cooking it in the oven did bring it back long enough to grab the few items that I wanted. At the time, I read that it had to do with Apple switching to lead free solder. Sad to know I may face this with the 2011 MBP that I am typing this on (and I love so dearly)
- caycep 13y ago
  fortunately, I had my mac setup with ssh enabled...so I was able to rsync it off to another computer off network. (Who needs graphics anyway?) Apple support, to their credit, handled my case extremely well, even though I was out of warranty.

mjt0229 13y ago

One thing that I love to make is mac & cheese.

unicornporn 13y ago

Remember that there might be a law in your country that regulates complaints. In Sweden we have "reklamationstid"[1] which gives you sort of a legislated warranty (applies to almost all goods) for three years. All goods that I have complained about using "reklamationstiden" have been replaced. [1] http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.konsumentverket.se/mobil/Din-ratt-som-konsument/Reklamera-och-klaga/&usg=ALkJrhh34gx7-dXD27hTnEIGRK1VK2Oa2w http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&h...

danmatan 13y ago
Is it common to have your replacement/repair refused unless you bring up the "reklamationstiden" argument?
- unicornporn 13y ago
  Yes, many people don't know about this law. The shops know this and takes advantage of it. Of course there is also the manufacturer's warranty, which lasts for as long as the manufacturer decides.
  - oneeyedpigeon 13y ago
    Why have that law, and then make it legal for the shops to not acknowledge it up front? Why does the law have to be some weird kind of game where only people in the know benefit from it?

fakename 13y ago

I had ram slots die in my mbp due to warping. the solution was to loosen the screws around the ram slots, letting the bent board unbend. I imagine cooking would soften things up and allow loose connections to better connect.

martydill 13y ago

This has been an issue as far back as a decade ago with G3 iBooks. I had my G3 800's logic board replaced twice under warranty, but it failed again after that. The 'hot coin on the gpu' trick solved the problem, albeit temporarily. http://forums.macnn.com/69/mac-notebooks/210232/diy-ibook-dual-usb-logic-board/ http://forums.macnn.com/69/mac-notebooks/210232/diy-ibook-du... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBook#Quality_issues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBook#Quality_issues

mmastrac 13y ago

I resurrected my old 2009 Macbook Pro that was doing something similar by turning it on and putting it under a blanket for an hour. It generated enough heat to reflow whatever BGA had busted and has worked perfectly since.

D9u 13y ago

I had a somewhat similar issue with an Acer Aspire Aspire One ZG5 netbook, except my problem was that the device would power off after about 1.5 minutes from powering on. Apparently a thermal cutoff switch needed some recalibration/replacement, so my fix was 2 hours in the freezer followed by a few more hours waiting for condensation to evaporate before attempting to power the netbook on again... I used the above method for nearly a year before acquiring my present laptop, relegating the netbook to my growing pile of disfunctional hardware.

dleibovic 13y ago

Is there any cause for concern about toxic chemicals being released into an oven that you use to cook food?

greyskull 13y ago

This was a "well-known" (quoted because it's well known as far as enthusiast communities are concerned) fix attempt for discrete GPU cards on desktops. I've seen a lot of success stories where old GPUs (think GTX 8800) would crap out; owner would take off the shroud, heatsink, and any other removable parts, put it in the oven for a few minutes, and boom, reflowed solder fixed the issue.

btoptical 13y ago

I think this process is really baking out moisture as the PCBA is not in the oven long enough to get to temperature and the temperature is not hot enough to reflow the solder. Most of the components on the board are not hermetically packaged and there probably are moisture sensitive parts on the PCBA. So the baking at 170C for 7 minutes is essentially a drying process. Also, I think Apple probably has to be ROHS compliant and that means they have to use lead-free TnSn solder. The transition temperature for lead-free solder is typically about 20C higher than normal leaded solders.

grandalf 13y ago

If it's reflowing then couldn't the same be accomplished with more focused application of a heat gun?

nviennot 13y ago

That reminds me of http://viennot.biz/reflow_oven.pdf http://viennot.biz/reflow_oven.pdf

pyed 13y ago

I had the same issue on early 2011, fixed it for 600$+ because I'm not in the US, and sold it for 768$ and got the new Retina with hate.

michaelchum 13y ago

This is astonishing... But anyone else feels like this sounds like trolling? There is no actual video, but only pictures. And perhaps, maybe it's just me, but I don't see how high heat can resurrect the logic board?

mmariani 13y ago

My MBP17 died one week ago. Way to go Apple!

null_ptr 13y ago

It makes me sad to read how some mistreat their laptops. Why keep it on 24/7? Even if you're using your computer 12 hours a day you're letting it burn for nothing for the other 12! And then you buy a new one every year.

sneak 13y ago
Burn what, precisely? It's not a woodstove.
prewett 13y ago
Electronics likes being in a steady thermal state, and mechanical devices like a hard drive have less wear when continuously spinning. It's the spinning up and down that causes a lot of the wear.

kkl232 13y ago

Hilarious!! At some point I spilled water all over my MacbookPro and I turned it off and let it dry overnight. The next morning it refused to turn on. I took it to Apple and they say they must send it to repairs for 750 dollars!! I refused to pay money, went home, asked some friends about it, and concluded that I should put my computer in an inverted position like a teepee. I let it sit for 2 days. And Voila! Good as new!

josephjrobison 13y ago
Same exact thing happened to me! Brand new hot starbucks green tea spilled all over my 4 month old MacBook Air mid-2013. I was devastated. Stupidly I tried to turn it on right after the spill and it turned on for a moment then shut off and wouldn't turn on again. I put the keyboard face down on paper towels and indirectly in front of a fan for a few days and it came back to life! I now have a keyboard spill guard of course...
__david__ 13y ago
If you have a gas oven with a pilot lite, it's the perfect place to let things dry out (don't turn it on, just let the small flame of the pilot lite dry things out). These seem to be more rare nowadays, though.

auctiontheory 13y ago

This gives "cooking the books" a whole new meaning.

PhantomGremlin 13y ago
Nicely done. Best quip I've read on HN today.

mncolinlee 13y ago

This is a hackish form of "Reflow Soldering." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflow_soldering I used to work at Cray, the supercomputer company. Back in the 1970s, 30 yrs before I got there, they used to solder the circuits on each board by baking the entire board in an actual kitchen oven. With smaller and more delicate circuitry on mainboards these days, this is less practical and more dangerous, but that doesn't mean it isn't still possible with some degree of luck. I'd still recommend removing the BIOS battery if you're crazy enough to attempt this.

MobsterMac 13y ago

There is a huge uprising about Mac Book Pro's motherboard's failing. I wonder if this would work for the issues described here. https://discussions.apple.com/message/25163418?ac_cid=tw123456#25163418 https://discussions.apple.com/message/25163418?ac_cid=tw1234...