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Dark spot under cockpit of A-10s
- cushychicken 13y agoInteresting answer. My offhand guess would have been discoloration in the metal due to heat put off by this monster: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAU-8_Avenger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAU-8_Avenger
- lake_rogue 13y agoMy guess was a variation: as a warning to ground personnel not to touch that area of the fuselage, as after any recent firing of the GAU-8 that area would be "HOT PLATE".
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- thearn4 13y agoPretty clever. False cockpit aside, the A-10 is my favorite plane of all time. It has a sound that's really unmistakable. (well, technically I guess it's the GAU-8 making the sound...)
- arethuza 13y agoSlightly off topic... The village where I grew up in Scotland is on a headland on the coast and was near a couple of RAF bases - it seemed a popular route point so my childhood had a lot of very low flying military aircraft about so I guess we were all used to the noise. Then came the day when there was a Vulcan bomber doing apparently doing aerobatics at a fairly low level over the village - it's probably close to 40 years but I don't think I will ever forget that utterly glorious sound.... [Edit: the sight of a Vulcan being thrown around the sky isn't something I'll forget either!]
- twic 13y agoI saw one doing tricks at an airshow at RAF Valley many years ago. It sounded like tearing silk.
- arethuza 13y agoHere is a video of a Vulcan taking off - that "howl" is pretty distinctive! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzdtYU7i_jY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzdtYU7i_jY I have to assume that the secret UK war plan wasn't to drop H-bombs on the Soviets but to deafen them into submission.
- amorphid 13y agoAt an airshow, I saw a US Harrier do a vertical take off. It was really loud! At a different airshow, I saw an SR-71 take off and fly around. That was pretty damn loud, too. It set off every car alarm in the parking lot.
- dingaling 13y agoThe painted false cockpit was first operationally used on Canadian CF-18 Hornets, but derived from USAF research in conjunction with an aviation artist. So the A-10 community adopted it second-hand.
- dylanrw 13y agoIts engines are most definitely distinctive, that fan sound is some sweet music.
- larrydag 13y agoThe A-10 is one on of the aircraft that is on the list for retirement from the US Air Force. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairchild_Republic_A-10_Thunderbolt_II#Proposed_retirement http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairchild_Republic_A-10_Thunder... The A-10 is a cold war designed attack jet to be used to take out Soviet tanks. Its really good at slow (relatively) , guided, precise air-to-ground strikes. I think it would make a good candidate for a new class of a drones fleet.
- ericcumbee 13y agoMy dad always said that he'd take one A-10 covering him over an entire squadron of F-16s.
- SDGT 13y agoThat's mostly because A-10's were specifically designed for engaging ground targets, while F-16's were originally designed for air superiority and later evolved into a multi role platform.
- jfb 13y agoYeah, possibly. What is indisputable is that the mooted replacement (the F-35) is as useless as tits on a boar for close ground support.
- mcv 13y agoIt truly baffles me just how many very effective and specialized planes are supposed to be replaced by the F-35, which, it seems, can't really do any of those tasks right. There's a very good reason why there were so many specialized aircraft in the first place.
- smacktoward 13y agoThe problem is that the F-35 costs a gazillion dollars, and (partly because it costs a gazillion dollars) the program is too politically wired-in to cancel. So they have to cut other planes to make room for it, and the only way to do that is to claim the F-35 can do the missions those other planes currently do. Which it can't, of course, but since admitting that would require keeping the other planes, which would require canceling the F-35, which can't happen, everybody has sort of agreed to pretend it can.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- ericcumbee 13y agoMy dad has always said that the A-10 is an infantryman's best friend. an F-16 or F-18 will straff over the battle field and is gone. an A-10 will just hang around. When I was younger we went to a nature preserve that is adjacent to the gunnery range at Moody Air Force base. We went up in an observation tower overlooking the preserve and watched A-10s do strafing practice. The sound of the GAU-8 main gun is something you have to hear to believe. If bad intentions have a sound it's that gun.
- jameskilton 13y agoNo kidding! I was at a shooting range long time ago, and I still remember that "brup BRUP!" of those cannons going off (double because you hear the sonic boom of the bullets before you hear the bullets themselves). One of my favorite military planes for sure. Sad that it's getting decommissioned but it has served us well.
- at-fates-hands 13y ago>>> The sound of the GAU-8 main gun is something you have to hear to believe. Proof right here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wQ0BXExYkg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wQ0BXExYkg The commentary is priceless on this one. More proof right here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrhoYnpgm-g http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrhoYnpgm-g Get goosebumps every time I watch those. Too bad they're being retired.
- kawsper 13y agoThis one is also amazing and scary at the same time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4zm5duK3hY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4zm5duK3hY The cannons on the A-10 sounds like an angry bull.
- diydsp 13y agoThanks for these. I had never heard it before. It sounds like two-three main sounds. There's a snappy one, then a grunty one, then a crackly one. Is the snappy the bombs exploding reaching, the grunty the gun sounds reaching the mic and the crackly one some kind of secondary explosion?
- arethuza 13y agoReminds me of eye mimicry in animal camouflage: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eyespot_%28mimicry%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eyespot_%28mimicry%29
- Shivetya 13y agomy favorite on the art of camoflage http://99percentinvisible.org/episode/episode-65-razzle-dazzle/ http://99percentinvisible.org/episode/episode-65-razzle-dazz...
- beebs93 13y agoI was really expecting something 10x more complex (e.g. A special WiFi-reflecting paint that prevents missiles from stealing the A-10s bandwidth or some such). I love how simple yet effective it is. A very "just-use-a-pencil-in-outer-space"-type solution.
- nodata 13y agopencil in outer space is an urban legend: http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp
- Sharlin 13y agoNote that what you seem to be referring to is an urban legend [1]. Initially both NASA and the Russians used pencils, but they were quickly deemed potentially hazardous because they shed graphite flakes that in microgravity may end up in places where you don't want them - being electrically conductive they may even cause short-circuits. Simple ball-point pens work fine in microgravity because they rely on the capillary effect, not gravity, to work. [1] http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp
- vonmoltke 13y agoAlso, not mentioned in the Snopes article, is that the refill cartridge and ink used in the pen weren't even developed specifically with NASA in mind. Fisher wanted to create a ballpoint pen that would work in all manner of extreme environments, write on wet surfaces, and work upside down. Microgravity was just one of those extreme environments.
- blueskin_ 13y agoA pencil in space is a very bad idea. It will create floating graphite shards that are conductive and could short out critical equipment (as well as not being great health-wise). Actually, even though it is an urban legend, it is something I could see the USSR doing with their disregard for their astronauts' safety.
- jmount 13y agoA-10 was a Boyd sponsored aircraft, a fun topic: http://www.win-vector.com/blog/2010/04/deming-wald-and-boyd-cutting-through-the-fog-of-analytics/ http://www.win-vector.com/blog/2010/04/deming-wald-and-boyd-...
- beat 13y agoI figured that dark spot was just the result of pilots doing dangerous maneuvers while getting shot at by tanks and AA. I'd leave a dark spot, too.
- evanm 13y agoBigger question -- who knew there was an aviation Stack Exchange??!? I always went to quora to read kind of stuff.
- TeMPOraL 13y agoStack Exchange is evolving towards Reddit, which has subreddits for every conceivable topic and then some.
- dkrich 13y agoWhen I was a kid I saw this demo tape and was blown away by how lethal and intimidating the A-10 looked. Ever since I've been fascinated with it. The video quality is very poor because this was shot in the late seventies or early eighties but it demonstrates the ferocity of the plane pretty well. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVvAQHz5jGs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVvAQHz5jGs
- jug6ernaut 13y agoWhile off topic, i found this interesting bit of information on the a10's gun wiki page. "The recoil force of the GAU-8/A[16] is 10,000 pounds-force (45 kN),[3] which is slightly more than the output of one of the A-10's two TF34 engines (9,065 lbf / 40.3 kN each).[17] While this recoil force is significant, in practice cannon fire only slows the aircraft a few miles per hour in level flight." The gun firing produces more force through recoil on the plane then is produced by one of the plane's engines. That is simply amazing. Edit: The guns wiki page(it has a wiki page). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAU-8_Avenger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAU-8_Avenger
- Avenger42 13y agoIt's also mentioned in an XKCD "what if": https://what-if.xkcd.com/21/ https://what-if.xkcd.com/21/ > The GAU-8 Avenger fires up to sixty one-pound bullets a second. It produces almost five tons of recoil force, which is crazy considering that it’s mounted in a type of plane (the A-10 “Warthog”) whose two engines produce only four tons of thrust each. If you put two of them in one aircraft, and fired both guns forward while opening up the throttle, the guns would win and you’d accelerate backward. > To put it another way: If I mounted a GAU-8 on my car, put the car in neutral, and started firing backward from a standstill, I would be breaking the interstate speed limit in less than three seconds.
- tomp 13y ago> To put it another way: If I mounted a GAU-8 on my car, put the car in neutral, and started firing backward from a standstill, I would be breaking the interstate speed limit in less than three seconds. More likely, you would have a cabrio in 1.62 seconds.
- nunb 13y agoyou mean you'd have to cut off the roof to mount it? http://i.imgur.com/CFtOzAD.jpg http://i.imgur.com/CFtOzAD.jpg ;)
- 13y ago
- rplnt 13y agoIs there air-air combat happening somewhere in the world? If not, when was the last time this could have been used?
- snits 13y agoIt has no place in air-to-air combat other than trying to not get shot down. It is a dedicated ground attack, CAS platform. It has seen plenty of use in that role in Iraq and Afghanistan. I believe the Soviets in Tom Clancy's Red Storm Rising, and the Taliban both refer to it as the "Devil's Cross". Probably one of my greatest memories from NTC is being on a hill, and having an A-10 crest the hill, inverted, and then roll over as it continues down the other side on its way to attack a column of OPFOR armor. F-16s and F-18s would just zip right by and be gone in a second. The A-10s would lazily swing back and forth as they worked their way down the valley.
- JshWright 13y agoThat 'crest the hill inverted' trick is insane... They do it because following the contour of the hill while flying right sire up would result in too many negative g's. By flipping inverted, the g-force is now 'down' (relative to the pilot) and they can pull a lot harder (since the body is much better at dealing with g-foreces in that direction).
- kenrikm 13y agoI don't think there has been really Air - Air combat in a very long time. (Vietnam?) - though using this on a A10 makes a lot of sense, tricking ground forces yo think you're banking in their direction when your not and tricking enemy aircraft of the same can give an advantage.
- chloraphil 13y agohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post%E2%80%93World_War_II_air-to-air_combat_losses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post%E2%80%93World_War_II_air-t...
- snits 13y ago
- xbryanx 13y agoShips in WWII used to use techniques like this as well. I saw a great exhibit on camouflage at the Imperial War Museum that featured quite a few examples of this: http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30019323 http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30019323
- bch 13y agodazzle camo (razzle dazzle): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzle_camouflage http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzle_camouflage
- dangayle 13y agoWhoa. Cool.
- hcarvalhoalves 13y agoI think it deserves a little more explanation: This camouflage was effective not at hiding the ship, but denying the U-Boat captains the ability to see in which direction it's moving to properly launch torpedoes. The patterned painting makes it harder to find where the bow is pointing to.
- davidedicillo 13y agoThe most fascinating thing about this for me is that it's nothing more than what many fishes do.
- dwd 13y agoWhat they didn't mention was that it relies on the idea that turns are made using a pull back as you can handle a higher number of positive Gs than negative.
- yawz 13y agoI like it! Very much like mimicking the nature. That type of naturally evolved patterns are common in nature (fish, birds, insects, etc.) to confuse predators.
- tomphoolery 13y agoOctopus-driven security.
- gdonelli 13y agoold school technology borrowed from nature!
- dba7dba 13y agoA joke I heard is that if Air Force was allowed to buy whatever plane it wanted, every single one of them would be a single seat jet fighter that goes very fast. No cargo plane, no helicopter, no tanker, no CAS plane. Air Force should just hand over A-10 to Army, the ones who really know how valuable A-10 is.
- WalterBright 13y agoFor those interested in the unusual development of the A-10, see the book "Boyd: The Fighter Pilot Who Changed the Art of War".
- JabavuAdams 13y agoI wonder how badly that would mess up combat drones' vision systems? Welcome to a world of anti-machine-vision camouflage.
- kjs3 13y agoBefore this, the armchair generals were all "stupid military, retiring the A-1 Skyraider with a jet! How can a jet loiter on target long enough to do close air support worth a shit!".
- rangibaby 13y agoWhat is old is new again: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embraer_EMB_314_Super_Tucano http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embraer_EMB_314_Super_Tucano
- kjs3 13y agoSorta. Same mission and all, but the A-29 is a turboprop because it's a) cheaper and b) simpler to fly and maintain than a military jet intended for militaries that are primarily concerned about such things. The A-1 was a prop because it was part of the last generation of military prop planes. I don't think the designers of the A-29 were looking to recreate the success of the A-1. Looks like an effective platform, tho.
- frou_dh 13y agoI don't know how accurate it is, but I remember this entertaining video of A-10 designer Pierre Sprey talking about how the new F-35 is garbage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxDSiwqM2nw http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxDSiwqM2nw Themes of bloat and unwarranted complexity are perhaps universal.
- userbinator 13y ago"I have an A-10 with this stain under the cockpit. I've tried scrubbing it with soap and water, jet fuel, and degreaser, but it stays there. Does anyone know a better solvent?" I was expecting something like that from the title...
- tehwebguy 13y agoI was more surprised to read that it was patented. Not that it doesn't make sense, but I had never considered that governments might not use a particular military tool because of a licensing issue.
- kackontent 13y agoBoys with toys. Toys for killing people.
- Warhawg01 13y agoThe amount of silly garbage in this thread is astounding. I thought you HN folks were supposed to be smart. Anyone here actually fly A-10s? Or been on the ground and had one support you? No, the plane does not slow down when you shoot the gun. Source: I have almost 3000 hours in this plane. Flew today, actually.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- Nrsolis 13y agoAs opposed to speak authoritatively on a topic with ZERO experience beyond a Wiki page? This thread got cross-linked to some forums where ACTUAL COMBAT VETS frequent. You'd be wise to ask your questions of them instead of talking out of your ass.
- BrownBuffalo 13y agoEqually as interesting is the Naval efforts of many countries to camo their ships. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzle_camouflage http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzle_camouflage - Jazz Hands, anyone?
- ilovecookies 13y agoThat plane has to be quite sturdy to fire that gun. 10 tonnes from the front and four from the back.
- ilovecookies 13y agoThis is seriously turning more and more into reddit.