10 ms·

iPad onscreen keyboard designed for LaTeX [video]

96 points by steeleduncan 13y ago

quackerhacker 13y ago
That is amazingly clean! I've been using Textastic, but this looks worth a try!
danialtz 13y ago
It looks great! of course if I want to type actually in LaTex. I find it much easier to work in an environment like LyX, which you don't have to think LaTeX and focus on big picture, and if necessary get down to TeX level. Nevertheless, the navigation/selection idea looks really handy.
newhouseb 13y ago
This is great - I don't write much LaTeX anymore, but I'm excited by where this leads. Apple has long used customized keyboards (i.e. a custom keyboard for URLs) and Microsoft is starting to introduce customized hardware Surface input covers as well. It's pretty evident that if you want high-fidelity productivity on a touch screen, you need to adapt your keyboard/input methods to be much more contextual than a general purpose QWERTY keyboard. The real challenge here is designing OS input APIs that don't by default segment you into all-or-nothing, "use 100% of our keyboard" or "emulate 100% of the text input." Emulating 100% of the text input is fine for ASCII, but there's a bajillion ways to input other languages and you typically simply can't compete with the breadth an OS provides. Windows has some abstractions around presenting word candidates for languages like Chinese that you can render custom, but iOS (and to my knowledge OS X) is pretty miserable in this respect. Hopefully this is just the beginning!
- coob 13y ago
  I think the emulating/use native problem for the keyboard is a really tricky design problem to solve. Currently the 'Apple recommended' way is to use an inputAccessoryView which is essentially a bar above the native keyboard. There could be a more elegant solution. However, as you say, the broad spectrum of inputs for different locales makes this a tricky issue.
phloxicon 13y ago
Amazing and exactly what I've been looking for. Any plans for an android port?
- steeleduncan 13y ago
  Not in the next few months, but yes, we should start work on windows/android versions of Texpad sometime this year. We want to perfect the OSX/iOS versions versions first, abstract the common editing codebase, etc. etc. then tackle some new platforms
JelteF 13y ago
If you ever need easy LaTeX generation for data generated or changed in Python. You should try out https://github.com/JelteF/PyLaTeX https://github.com/JelteF/PyLaTeX. It supports tables, plots and matrices. All with sane defaults.
beobab 13y ago
This app looks very nice. It actually makes me want to get started in learning LaTeX. The autocomplete is a very nice feature, and the cursor manipulation is genius. I can't emphasise how much I'd love to have the default apple keyboard have cursor controls. And one day I might actually get started learning it. Right after all the other things on my list...
snotskie 13y ago
I actually use LaTeX on my phone quite often. I would use this if I weren't an Android kind of guy.
- jeremysmyth 13y ago
  Really? Maybe I'm an old-skool kinda guy, but I can't fathom using a tablet or phone to do LaTeX work. I do lots of it, and I can't imagine doing it without a keyboard and vim-latexsuite. How do you get over all the shifts- and alts- on the Android keyboard to get \ and { and all the other stuff?
  - jawaddeo 13y ago
    (Disclaimer: I'm one of the people behind Texpad.) Keyboard is designed to address precisely these kind of issues. I'd recommend watching the video.
    - sebastianavina 13y ago
      I'm just guessing, but i can't see any way any custom app could be more efficient than a well tuned emacs.
king_magic 13y ago
That looks beautiful. Really nice job on the custom keyboard.
bjz_ 13y ago
Their OS X app is also quite good: https://www.texpadapp.com/osx https://www.texpadapp.com/osx Much nicer than the open source competition, to be honest.
cefstat 13y ago
The keyboard looks great in the video. Is version 1.6.3 already on the AppStore? If not, (I only find v1.6.2) is there an ETA?
- steeleduncan 13y ago
  Hopefully early next week. We are fixing bugs uncovered during the beta period right now, and we hope to submit it to the App Store at the end of the week.
omaranto 13y ago
At 0:28 when "\oplus" is inserted into the file, the key actually pressed is a filled circle. If the key you have to press doesn't look like the symbol you're trying to insert, that means you have to learn yet a new name for the symbol...
- steeleduncan 13y ago
  Thanks, I just checked the app, but that is a compression artefact. In the raw video it is clear, but not in that version. We will use a more compressible symbol next time around.
  - omaranto 13y ago
    Oh, that makes sense. I should have figured that was it.
thearn4 13y ago
Could be great for note taking. Once upon a time, I used to be able to think about math in terms of LaTeX expressions pretty fluidly. It's been awhile since I've really had to use TeX heavily though.
jroes 13y ago
I'm interested in seeing the same approach taken for programming.
celerity 13y ago
This is simply a great example of using the wrong tool for the job. No matter how "smooth" an iOS LaTeX tool is, it's still much less efficient than any computer. People are trying to force things into the iPad, which I understand, but I sincerely think that a radical change is needed to make it more than a consumption device.
- jawaddeo 13y ago
  (Disclaimer: I'm part of the Texpad team.) I agree that a lot more needs to be understood and imagined about how we may use the touch devices, but radical changes don't have to be radical on day one. Indeed, from experience radical changes fail precisely because users can only absorb so much change in one go. As it turns out when you take the touch interface into account as our iOS 7 app does, you can do some sweet things. My personal take is that you experiment with the interface _while_ making sure you don't break the existing ways of inputting (= generating content). If you shove a lot of change down people's throats in one big spoonful, you alienate them. Evolving the UI means you can take user feedback and adjust the course on the way. Radical changes mean you assume you know exactly what they want and need (and you don't mind breaking their workflow to impose the new way). That's a big assumption and may appear a little presumptuous to users who've developed a workflow around your app. We may not get it right completely in one go, but we can assure our users that the app is the product of their feedback and will continue to be.
- julienchastang 13y ago
  I don't know if I agree with the notion that the iPad is good solely for content consumption. If you ever have to write in a foreign language, you will note that it is much easier to write on the iPad thanks to terrific internationalization support in the form of language specific auto-correct and virtual keyboards that do things normal keyboards can't (like pressing on a key for a second and getting several accented characters). I have always wanted to write an APL interpreter for iPad because dealing with the APL glyphs on the iPad keyboard would theoretically workout nicely. I have not tried texpad, but their use of customizable virtual keyboards certainly looks promising.
  - 13y ago
baldfat 13y ago
When will iOS stop using the most ineffective keyboard in touch screen keyboards?? Every time I have to type in my Wifi password on someone's iOS device I cry. Not knowing if the letter is capital or lower-case is a killer and the symbol division of two screens is mind blowing; + and = is on page two! I can't hold down on a letter to select numbers or symbols is also crazy. Not being able to slide also is crazy. TL&DR Apple's iOS on screen keyboard is the worst!
amimetic 13y ago
Their Mac App is great: I've used perhaps a dozen LaTeX editors on many platforms and it is probably my favourite. Nice autocomplete, great preview pane, good navigation between files and a very clean interface. If you are on Windows there is a slightly obscure one called InLage that is excellent (basically Visual Studio for LaTeX). With this new keyboard I may have to try their iPad app.

96 points by steeleduncan 13y ago

That is amazingly clean! I've been using Textastic, but this looks worth a try!

It looks great! of course if I want to type actually in LaTex. I find it much easier to work in an environment like LyX, which you don't have to think LaTeX and focus on big picture, and if necessary get down to TeX level. Nevertheless, the navigation/selection idea looks really handy.

newhouseb 13y ago

This is great - I don't write much LaTeX anymore, but I'm excited by where this leads. Apple has long used customized keyboards (i.e. a custom keyboard for URLs) and Microsoft is starting to introduce customized hardware Surface input covers as well. It's pretty evident that if you want high-fidelity productivity on a touch screen, you need to adapt your keyboard/input methods to be much more contextual than a general purpose QWERTY keyboard. The real challenge here is designing OS input APIs that don't by default segment you into all-or-nothing, "use 100% of our keyboard" or "emulate 100% of the text input." Emulating 100% of the text input is fine for ASCII, but there's a bajillion ways to input other languages and you typically simply can't compete with the breadth an OS provides. Windows has some abstractions around presenting word candidates for languages like Chinese that you can render custom, but iOS (and to my knowledge OS X) is pretty miserable in this respect. Hopefully this is just the beginning!

coob 13y ago
I think the emulating/use native problem for the keyboard is a really tricky design problem to solve. Currently the 'Apple recommended' way is to use an inputAccessoryView which is essentially a bar above the native keyboard. There could be a more elegant solution. However, as you say, the broad spectrum of inputs for different locales makes this a tricky issue.

phloxicon 13y ago

Amazing and exactly what I've been looking for. Any plans for an android port?

steeleduncan 13y ago
Not in the next few months, but yes, we should start work on windows/android versions of Texpad sometime this year. We want to perfect the OSX/iOS versions versions first, abstract the common editing codebase, etc. etc. then tackle some new platforms

JelteF 13y ago

If you ever need easy LaTeX generation for data generated or changed in Python. You should try out https://github.com/JelteF/PyLaTeX https://github.com/JelteF/PyLaTeX. It supports tables, plots and matrices. All with sane defaults.

beobab 13y ago

This app looks very nice. It actually makes me want to get started in learning LaTeX. The autocomplete is a very nice feature, and the cursor manipulation is genius. I can't emphasise how much I'd love to have the default apple keyboard have cursor controls. And one day I might actually get started learning it. Right after all the other things on my list...

snotskie 13y ago

I actually use LaTeX on my phone quite often. I would use this if I weren't an Android kind of guy.

jeremysmyth 13y ago
Really? Maybe I'm an old-skool kinda guy, but I can't fathom using a tablet or phone to do LaTeX work. I do lots of it, and I can't imagine doing it without a keyboard and vim-latexsuite. How do you get over all the shifts- and alts- on the Android keyboard to get \ and { and all the other stuff?
- jawaddeo 13y ago
  (Disclaimer: I'm one of the people behind Texpad.) Keyboard is designed to address precisely these kind of issues. I'd recommend watching the video.
  - sebastianavina 13y ago
    I'm just guessing, but i can't see any way any custom app could be more efficient than a well tuned emacs.

king_magic 13y ago

That looks beautiful. Really nice job on the custom keyboard.

bjz_ 13y ago

Their OS X app is also quite good: https://www.texpadapp.com/osx https://www.texpadapp.com/osx Much nicer than the open source competition, to be honest.

cefstat 13y ago

The keyboard looks great in the video. Is version 1.6.3 already on the AppStore? If not, (I only find v1.6.2) is there an ETA?

steeleduncan 13y ago
Hopefully early next week. We are fixing bugs uncovered during the beta period right now, and we hope to submit it to the App Store at the end of the week.

omaranto 13y ago

At 0:28 when "\oplus" is inserted into the file, the key actually pressed is a filled circle. If the key you have to press doesn't look like the symbol you're trying to insert, that means you have to learn yet a new name for the symbol...

steeleduncan 13y ago
Thanks, I just checked the app, but that is a compression artefact. In the raw video it is clear, but not in that version. We will use a more compressible symbol next time around.
- omaranto 13y ago
  Oh, that makes sense. I should have figured that was it.

thearn4 13y ago

Could be great for note taking. Once upon a time, I used to be able to think about math in terms of LaTeX expressions pretty fluidly. It's been awhile since I've really had to use TeX heavily though.

jroes 13y ago

I'm interested in seeing the same approach taken for programming.

celerity 13y ago

This is simply a great example of using the wrong tool for the job. No matter how "smooth" an iOS LaTeX tool is, it's still much less efficient than any computer. People are trying to force things into the iPad, which I understand, but I sincerely think that a radical change is needed to make it more than a consumption device.

jawaddeo 13y ago
(Disclaimer: I'm part of the Texpad team.) I agree that a lot more needs to be understood and imagined about how we may use the touch devices, but radical changes don't have to be radical on day one. Indeed, from experience radical changes fail precisely because users can only absorb so much change in one go. As it turns out when you take the touch interface into account as our iOS 7 app does, you can do some sweet things. My personal take is that you experiment with the interface _while_ making sure you don't break the existing ways of inputting (= generating content). If you shove a lot of change down people's throats in one big spoonful, you alienate them. Evolving the UI means you can take user feedback and adjust the course on the way. Radical changes mean you assume you know exactly what they want and need (and you don't mind breaking their workflow to impose the new way). That's a big assumption and may appear a little presumptuous to users who've developed a workflow around your app. We may not get it right completely in one go, but we can assure our users that the app is the product of their feedback and will continue to be.
julienchastang 13y ago
I don't know if I agree with the notion that the iPad is good solely for content consumption. If you ever have to write in a foreign language, you will note that it is much easier to write on the iPad thanks to terrific internationalization support in the form of language specific auto-correct and virtual keyboards that do things normal keyboards can't (like pressing on a key for a second and getting several accented characters). I have always wanted to write an APL interpreter for iPad because dealing with the APL glyphs on the iPad keyboard would theoretically workout nicely. I have not tried texpad, but their use of customizable virtual keyboards certainly looks promising.
- 13y ago

baldfat 13y ago

When will iOS stop using the most ineffective keyboard in touch screen keyboards?? Every time I have to type in my Wifi password on someone's iOS device I cry. Not knowing if the letter is capital or lower-case is a killer and the symbol division of two screens is mind blowing; + and = is on page two! I can't hold down on a letter to select numbers or symbols is also crazy. Not being able to slide also is crazy. TL&DR Apple's iOS on screen keyboard is the worst!

amimetic 13y ago

Their Mac App is great: I've used perhaps a dozen LaTeX editors on many platforms and it is probably my favourite. Nice autocomplete, great preview pane, good navigation between files and a very clean interface. If you are on Windows there is a slightly obscure one called InLage that is excellent (basically Visual Studio for LaTeX). With this new keyboard I may have to try their iPad app.