9 ms·
It's interesting that this model has been unsuccessful in the US, but fits the demand profile perfectly in other wealthy countries. The American market, as alw
by obblekk 13y ago
It's interesting that this model has been unsuccessful in the US, but fits the demand profile perfectly in other wealthy countries.
The American market, as always, is difficult to move.
- MBCook 13y agoDon't forget the Volt was practically being given away, which certainly skews the market some.
- cowmixtoo 13y ago@40K up until this fall (and 35K now), I would hardly say that is "being given away" prices.
- sliverstorm 13y agoIt's always interesting seeing these sorts of discussions. On HN, every now and then you uncover a conversation about what's financially reasonable, between the guy making $450k/year and the guy making $45k/year.
- toomuchtodo 13y agoThey had lease specials for as low as $250/month. If you can run all-electric the majority of the time, your TCO is damn near free.
- tsotha 13y agoNot many people spend $250/month in gas.
- yardie 13y agoMany people don't want to spend $250/mo on gas. Whether they do or not is separate. I had a Nissan Pathfinder once and it was okay when gas was $2-2.50/gal (16 gallon tank, $40/wk, $150/month). Once it got to $4.00/gal damn right I found alternatives to driving that Pathfinder. The 20 minute walk to the store in the hot, Florida sun didn't seem so bad anymore. I have many friends who bought SUVs (for the "utility") and commuted way out from the exurbs. They had no choice but to eat the cost of $100 fillups while looking for cheaper alternatives.
- toomuchtodo 13y agoThe average family spends $368/month on gas: http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/05/news/economy/gas_prices_income_spending/ http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/05/news/economy/gas_prices_inco...
- tsotha 13y agoNo doubt. But that's with two cars, so it's still less than the $500 you'd spend leasing two Volts.
- ibrahima 13y agoYeah, not sure what that guy is on about. Both prices are lower than the Leaf's nominal price, and I've heard you could get ~$10k worth of tax credits or something with the Leaf. Unfortunately I don't remember the details, but I met a guy who leased a Leaf who told me about all this. He got a pretty sweet deal on the lease too.
- deelowe 13y agoIt's selling like hotcakes in Georgia.
- kelseyfrancis 13y agoIndeed. The $7500 federal + $5000 state tax credits combined with being able to drive solo in the HOV lane make it a pretty good buy (or lease).
- deelowe 13y agoyep. I just hope the value doesn't drop like a rock once the credits end. This thing has to keep a little equity for the economics to work out for me. It's a little bit of a gamble. Also, the federal isn't a credit, it's a discount off of msrp. The state is a deduction, so you typically have to carry it a few years to see the full benefit. Just in case anyone is curious.
- harpastum 13y agoWouldn't the value increase once the credits end? The new model of the Leaf will suddenly cost $12,500 more, so demand for used Leafs will skyrocket. That could definitely increase the value of your car.
- kelseyfrancis 13y ago> Also, the federal isn't a credit, it's a discount off of msrp. The state is a deduction, so you typically have to carry it a few years to see the full benefit. Just in case anyone is curious. To clarify, there _is_ a $7500 federal tax credit, but Nissan just takes it themselves and passes those savings directly to the customer, which is what makes it possible to indirectly use the credit when leasing instead of purchasing. The Georgia $5000 tax credit is indeed a credit, not a deduction, but it's a _non-refundable_ credit, meaning if you owe less than $5000 in taxes, you can only take a credit for that lesser amount the first year (so you're taxes are $0 instead of negative), but you get up to five years to take the full amount of the credit (in the case of this particular credit). The Georgia credit applies in full even if you lease instead of purchase. I doubt that's what the legislature intended, but it's the case nevertheless.
- mikestew 13y agoThe things are everywhere around Seattle, so many that I've quit waving. There are four in the parking lot at work, including mine, and our company has less than 100 people. Visiting my parents in Lakeland, FL for a week? I saw one parked in a guy's garage in their neighborhood, that's it. I'll see a half dozen Leaf's just on an eight mile drive to work on any given day. So it seems it could be geographically specific.
- jeffbarr 13y agoI've noticed the high Leaf density in Seattle as well. Perhaps we received more because we are closer to Asia.
- mikestew 13y agoSeattle was one of the few pre-order markets (CA, Phoenix, and Knoxville, TN being the others, IIRC). So they had a bit of a head start. That may lead to a snowball effect. You're less likely to risk it if you don't know anyone who has one. But if your buddy the early adopter raves about his, you might be more likely to buy. For the first year I had ours (the first year they were out), I was frequently stopped in parking lots for 5-10 minute conversations about my experience with it (friends hated driving around with me <g>). But now that they're everywhere in Seattle, I'll bet it's been at least a year since someone has talked to me in a parking lot. My guess is that folks have gathered all of the information they need to decide one way or the other and no longer feel the need to solicit strangers for input. :-)
- jpobst 13y agoNashville, TN. Nissan's North American HQ is here, so they are all over the place.
- muhfuhkuh 13y agoI guess since TN is a stone's throw away from NC, it stands to reason that the Triangle (Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill) sees its fair share of Leafs on the road as well (as I sit smiling and equally as smug behind the wheel of my Prius).
- rgbrenner 13y agoDid you read the article? If so, where did you get 'unsuccessful' from? Nissan LEAF launched in the United States in December 2010. The United States accounts for nearly half of the sales worldwide. The pace of LEAF sales has continued to accelerate. In 2013, Nissan sold 22,610 of the electric vehicles in the United States, more than twice as many as in 2012 and more than 2012 and 2011 Leaf sales combined. Nissan LEAF traditionally has performed well on the West Coast with notable markets such as San Francisco, Los Angeles and Seattle, but now interest has expanded across the country. New hot markets have emerged such as Atlanta, which has been the No. 1 LEAF market for the past five months.
- obblekk 13y agoYes I read that. But I seemeded to recall that they anticipated higher sales when they first introduced the LEAF, though I may be mistaken.
- username223 13y agoIt's not that surprising given that stuff in America is far apart, and public transportation is terrible. A Leaf supposedly gets 70-100 miles on a charge. That's just barely enough for a daily commute for many people working in the East Bay or Los Angeles. And for anyone else who wants to travel, it can only be a second car. Until an electric car can be reasonably used to travel 500 miles in a day, I can't see one becoming my primary vehicle. EDIT: Note that many Americans can only afford one car at a time.
- dan1234 13y agoIn the UK there are quite a few electric charging points in public & company car parks, so the car could be fully charged by the time you're ready to drive it home, effectively doubling the range if you don't need to drive it during the day.