4 ms·

Why not? Why judges are not for the public to pick? This puzzles me a lot lately, there's no democracy where Judges are picked by the population, although it's

by atmosx 13y ago

Why not? Why judges are not for the public to pick? This puzzles me a lot lately, there's no democracy where Judges are picked by the population, although it's one of the main 3 powers of the state which should be itself accountable.

Lukasa 13y ago
The historical reason, as far as I can recall, is that it's an attempt to make the judiciary independent. If judges were elected, they'd have exactly the same biases as the other elected offices, which means they'd be a less effective check-and-balance system. That also leaves aside the many, many ways you can corrupt an elected official that cannot be used for an unelected official. In most western democracies (and certainly in Westminster-style democracies, which I know best) the judges are bound by a certain set of rules that limit how activist they can be: specifically, a constitution. They're required to make findings of law, nor findings of morality, so they can't just manufacture law or destroy law as they see fit: they need a different law they can point to which overrules the one in question. Hence the US Constitution, which acts as the highest law in the land. A judge will always reference their decision, in the end, to an established law (or the constitution). Conversely, elected officials are empowered to _make_ law. Less true in the US (where the constitution binds the hands of the legislature and executive), but very true in Westminster systems where parliament is the supreme authority.
- atmosx 13y ago
  Thanks for the hints.
beggi 13y ago
Seperation of power (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers), but even so they are picked indirectly by the public through politicians. As a european though I am pretty amazed by all the direct voting that is done in US - you can hardly drive through a town here without running into a plethora of posters for people campaigning for various offices. You could argue that this is good democracy but I just can't imagine how voters can make informed decisions when voting for all these various offices - that is if they even bother to vote.
- ballard 13y ago
  It's an appearance of freedom, but really, many public office officials do whatever they like so long as no one is watching. Scaling oversight past Tragedy of the Commons apathy is a must have in American public politics. (Sounds obtuse bullshit to make another point but the literal meaning is also a point.)
- mcv 13y ago
  For many jobs, you need a professional rather than a politician. Judges, public prosecutors, police chiefs, etc should not be political positions.
  - pdwetz 13y ago
    In NY city and state, many judges are elected. However, they are limited to members of the NY bar (min. 10 years practicing in NY). Primarily wanted to point out that "professional" and election-based are not mutually exclusive. Source (PDF): http://www.nycbar.org/pdf/report/become_a_judge.pdf http://www.nycbar.org/pdf/report/become_a_judge.pdf
bsamuels 13y ago
Just ask yourself this - do you really want the judges to be politicians too?
thaumasiotes 13y ago
- Many US judges are elected. Many (more) aren't. - Judicial recall certainly imposes accountability, even on unelected judges. Election, in fact, doesn't impose accountability anywhere; only re-election would do that.

by atmosx 13y ago

Lukasa 13y ago

The historical reason, as far as I can recall, is that it's an attempt to make the judiciary independent. If judges were elected, they'd have exactly the same biases as the other elected offices, which means they'd be a less effective check-and-balance system. That also leaves aside the many, many ways you can corrupt an elected official that cannot be used for an unelected official. In most western democracies (and certainly in Westminster-style democracies, which I know best) the judges are bound by a certain set of rules that limit how activist they can be: specifically, a constitution. They're required to make findings of law, nor findings of morality, so they can't just manufacture law or destroy law as they see fit: they need a different law they can point to which overrules the one in question. Hence the US Constitution, which acts as the highest law in the land. A judge will always reference their decision, in the end, to an established law (or the constitution). Conversely, elected officials are empowered to _make_ law. Less true in the US (where the constitution binds the hands of the legislature and executive), but very true in Westminster systems where parliament is the supreme authority.

atmosx 13y ago
Thanks for the hints.

beggi 13y ago

Seperation of power (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers), but even so they are picked indirectly by the public through politicians. As a european though I am pretty amazed by all the direct voting that is done in US - you can hardly drive through a town here without running into a plethora of posters for people campaigning for various offices. You could argue that this is good democracy but I just can't imagine how voters can make informed decisions when voting for all these various offices - that is if they even bother to vote.

ballard 13y ago
It's an appearance of freedom, but really, many public office officials do whatever they like so long as no one is watching. Scaling oversight past Tragedy of the Commons apathy is a must have in American public politics. (Sounds obtuse bullshit to make another point but the literal meaning is also a point.)
mcv 13y ago
For many jobs, you need a professional rather than a politician. Judges, public prosecutors, police chiefs, etc should not be political positions.
- pdwetz 13y ago
  In NY city and state, many judges are elected. However, they are limited to members of the NY bar (min. 10 years practicing in NY). Primarily wanted to point out that "professional" and election-based are not mutually exclusive. Source (PDF): http://www.nycbar.org/pdf/report/become_a_judge.pdf http://www.nycbar.org/pdf/report/become_a_judge.pdf

bsamuels 13y ago

Just ask yourself this - do you really want the judges to be politicians too?

thaumasiotes 13y ago

- Many US judges are elected. Many (more) aren't. - Judicial recall certainly imposes accountability, even on unelected judges. Election, in fact, doesn't impose accountability anywhere; only re-election would do that.