23 ms·
Canada Post to phase out urban home mail delivery
- epochwolf 13y agoAnd of course, there's someone posting about the US Postal Service in the comments.
- comatose_kid 13y agoThat's funny because you kind of did the same thing here :)
- ojbyrne 13y agoAssuming you're talking about the same comment I'm looking at, they do try to suggest "a North America wide attempt by Conservative Party's to destroy the Public Postal service and in turn destroy two of the largest unions." which makes it relevant.
- valtron 13y agoWow! Look at that sharp decline in volume of mail! It's now 10% of what it was 4 years ago! Oh, wait, the horizontal axis doesn't start at 0.
- yan 13y agoAgree, that is an awful chart.
- ihsw 13y agoHere is a graph with zeroed X-axis. http://i.imgur.com/OAul7h2.png http://i.imgur.com/OAul7h2.png At the average rate of decline (constant ~4.5% decrease in mail delivered per year), it should reach 10% of 2008's usage by 2050. This obviously does not reflect reality, and it's just a napkin calculation.
- ddebernardy 13y agoCurious to know how much of that is spam. Since the advent of email, nearly everything that ends in my own mailbox are bills and statements, government-related correspondence, the occasional e-commerce related package and (shit tons of) spam. If the two former went full electronic, there would be very little point in having a mailbox at all -- unless you actually read your spam.
- graeme 13y agoLittle known fact: almost all of the spam (at least in my area) is not postal delivery. Private couriers deliver it. You can affix a "pas de pub" (no ads) sticker to your mailbox, and it stops. (It's possible the post also stops some spam delivery with this notice) I havne't received junk mail in over a year.
- lstamour 13y agoCanada Post delivers junk mail to my private mailbox. Changed my bills to online (for those I could) and posted letter-stickers to my mailbox saying "No Admail Please" and now I get 0 spam mailings. Also opted out of CMA marketing, including opting out former residents addresses.
- flipchart 13y agoI find it amusing that email spam is such an issue for people, but physical mail and SMS spam is not. At least in South Africa, I really can't find a way to report SMS spam so I just keep on receiving it. And who the hell would I have to speak to in order to stop receiving shit in my physical mailbox
- herge 13y agoThey seemed to have fixed the graph, by the way.
- dmix 13y agoNote: they only proposed this idea, they haven't confirmed it. Just like in August when they were asking the government for money, they proposed cutting delivery to every-other day. With this announcement, they got the bail-out money and are now proposing a much more drastic solution. Neither have been implemented.
- slantyyz 13y agoWhen I moved to the suburbs, I thought I would hate the community mailboxes, but they've actually turned out to be handy, because most small and mid sized packages can be securely delivered into the community mailbox. Larger packages or those that require a signature are usually dropped off at the mail depot at a nearby drug store, which is open late. When I buy online, especially from the US, I try to ship via USPS for this reason (also because they don't add exorbitant Canadian brokerage fees the way UPS and FedEx do).
- guyzero 13y agoYes, shipping to Canada from the US via USPS is generally the best option because they'll handle customs clearance. I've had FedEx abandon packages in the oddest places and had to go and pick them up and clear customs for them myself.
- GnarfGnarf 13y agoYes, UPS (the courier) are thieves when it comes to outrageous "brokerage" fees. Unfortunately a lot of places won't ship USPS (the post office) because they can't get a signature as proof of delivery.
- slantyyz 13y agoI just bought a $150 item, of which $20 was shipping and then had to pay $60 COD to UPS at the door, of which $40 was a brokerage fee to UPS (the rest was duty and tax). Outrageous is an understatement.
- 13y ago
- dergachev 13y agoI've lived in downtown Montreal for the last ten years. For as long as I can remember, they've been doing exactly this with packages. Even if you're home, the mailman will just leave a slip saying that you can pick up your package at the local Canada Post outlet. I have to wonder whether this will mean a huge boon to mail scanning services like outboxmail.com
- slantyyz 13y agoOne feature that I like: If you have a newer community mailbox, smaller packages get left in a larger compartment in the community mailbox and they leave the compartment key in your own mailbox. After you pick it up, you drop the key in the outbound mail compartment. It's very handy if you're not home to receive packages. In a way, it's like BufferBox.
- seszett 13y agoThe larger compartments are barely the size of a regular mailbox here in France though. So, while I can understand the desire to reduce costs on the part of Canada Post, I thought they offered zero convenience to users. And going out in the cold and the snow to fetch my mail in winter in a sidewalk-less neighbourhood was really not a pleasant experience (even if they were not very far from our house).
- memracom 13y agoIn Canada we have winter weather 6-8 months of the year. We LOVE going out in the cold. We play in the cold. We drink in the cold. We go out naked in the cold (after a hot tub session).
- seszett 13y agoWell, that's not what people say while they're shoveling the snow out of their driveway just after the snow plow filled it with snow from the street, though. Or when they slip in the slush and ruin their mail when coming back from the community mailbox.
- bryanlarsen 13y agoWhy not significantly increase the price of bulk mailing? More money for the post office, less advertisements in my mailbox. win-win. If they increase the price too much the reduction in usage will more than offset the increase in price, but I doubt that they're close to that yet.
- randlet 13y agoApparently they're struggling on bulk deliveries too since so many people are opting out[1]. [1] http://globalnews.ca/news/585922/canada-post-opts-for-junk-mail/ http://globalnews.ca/news/585922/canada-post-opts-for-junk-m...
- danielweber 13y agoAt least in the US, bulk mail subsidizes the rest of the system, because it's a system with very high fixed costs spread over a larger volume.
- eigenvector 13y agoAs the article notes, two-thirds of Canadians already do not have home mail delivery. Many urban residents, like myself, who live in newer areas with community mail boxes (a mail box that is maybe 100 metres from your home with everyone's mail) or in any type of apartment or condo building do not have mail delivered to our doorsteps. It's secure (the boxes are locked unlike a doorstep mailbox), convenient (parcels can be locked in a special parcel dropbox, the key for which is deposited in your own mailbox, instead of having to be retrieved at the post office) and cheaper for the postal system. Only people who live in older, more affluent areas built before community mailboxes receive home mail delivery. It's effectively a subsidy from us to them. Good riddance.
- msrpotus 13y agoDoes each person have their own mailbox, just all together (which is what most US apartment buildings have) or is it just a big open box with everyone's mail?
- randlet 13y agoThe former.
- a-priori 13y agoEveryone gets their own mailbox with a separate key, they're just all together in one place. They look like this: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_AMDCvMaCBE4/TPNLlfBWovI/AAAAAAAAAfA/uarcWXVzv40/s1600/IMG_7794.JPG http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_AMDCvMaCBE4/TPNLlfBWovI/AAAAAAAAAf...
- slantyyz 13y agoOf note for non-Canadians - those big compartments at the bottom are "shared". If you get a package that can fit in one that doesn't require a signature, the mail carrier will drop the package in there and put its key in your mail compartment. After you pick up your package, you drop the key off in the outbound mail slot at the top of the box. It's very convenient.
- sailfast 13y agoSmall but perhaps worthwhile thought - I didn't see argued or tested that reduced convenience of mailbox locations and delivery might actually reduce the pieces of mail delivered using Canada Post. Here in the US (I know, I know - different) a great deal of my daily mail is marketing material. I would definitely not walk to my post box to reach it so the reach / impact for advertisers would go down. Reduced impact would bring reduced spending. I think mailed marketing material is somewhat outmoded and wasteful, but I definitely still see it and thumb through my catalogs.
- RobAtticus 13y agoI'm not sure I follow. Wouldn't you still have to check your mail anyway for something that is non-marketing material? Once you're at the box, you might as well take whatever's there, right?
- eigenvector 13y agoA common problem is that people simply don't pick up the marketing mail (or worse, drop it on the ground next to the community mailbox). It piles up until their mailbox is full, and then the local postal worker knocks on your door and reminds you to be a nice person and pick up your mail.
- kaybe 13y agoCan't you put a sticker on so you won't get marketing material? In Germany you can sue parties who still put it into your mailbox.
- breischl 13y agoThat seems like a great opportunity! Put a big recycling bin right there, but before recycling the contents go through and catalog the mass marketing mail that was discarded without being read. Then sell that information back to the marketers. Less waste, more targeted mailings, money for the post office, everyone wins! Yeah, I'm kidding... though it might actually work.
- Patrick_Devine 13y agoThe most lucrative part of mail delivery, parcel post, is doing well. Canada Post also owns 91% of Purolator, another parcel delivery service similar to UPS or Fedex, which is also doing just fine. To me, this is the same as telcos complaining about the last mile problem. It's expensive to deliver something to someone's house, particularly when people choose to live in sprawling neighborhoods with little connectivity in terms of roads. If I have to drive to someone's house, would I rather deliver a letter for 60 cents or less (bulk mail), or a parcel for $4 to $10? Just like the telcos, the government grants the postal service a monopoly on first class letters so that they, amongst other things, guarantee connectivity to remote parts of the country at a flat rate. If that's important either the government has to pony up tax money to provide the service, or the cost of the service has to go up. One thing the government has been unwilling to do is charge different prices depending on how much a letter actually costs to send. I'm certain people in remote communities might balk, but maybe dynamic pricing makes sense, particularly when anyone can print their own postage with cheap laser/inkjet printers.
- InclinedPlane 13y agoFor being a developed country Canada has pretty terrible parcel and mail delivery, largely due to wonky regulations. Canada Post is horrible and UPS is excessively expensive for no good reasons. It's held back the advance of e-commerce there significantly.
- brandon272 13y agoPersonally, my experience shipping with Canada Post, UPS, FedEx and Purolator to and from urban and rural areas in Canada has been overwhelmingly positive over the years.
- slantyyz 13y agoReally? I am generally happier when a company offers Canada Post as a shipping option. I don't have to worry about being home to sign for the package, and for stuff coming from the US via USPS, I don't have to worry about exorbitant surcharges from the likes of Fedex or UPS. OTOH, it's nice that UPS Canada's standard shipping no longer requires you to be at home (signature not required) but you also have to worry about people stealing your package if you live in a dodgy neighborhood.
- Pxtl 13y agoAfter being burned by brokerage fees, industrial-zone depots, misconnected packages, and incompetent delivery men through various private couriers, I always insist on Canada Post. They're not perfect, but they're definitely the least awful option.
- DaemonHN 13y agoWhat if they made the door-to-door delivery a premium subscription that one could opt-in? That could provide some revenue to offset the losses they are posting. If you decided not to get it, your mail goes to the community mailbox.
- richardlblair 13y agoIt's a great idea. I think that as time goes on, less and less mail will be sent. I don't even open my mail anymore. They are just bills. I look at the sender, and then log onto their website. It's almost like a reminder, incase I forget to pay a bill. Actually, now that I think of it, I only get bills from 1 or 2 companies. The other text/email me.
- JL2010 13y agoI wish that first chart extended back to say... 1996. I think it would have given a better scale to indicate how much the rise of the internet has effected traditional mail delivery.
- dobbsbob 13y agoThere's also the extra emissions factor. Instead of human powered clean energy they will all have vehicles, which no doubt will cost extra in gas and vehicle maint costs when we are supposed to be moving away from fossil fuels
- Raphmedia 13y agoGreat idea. Remember that in Montreal, you have to climb outdoor stairs covered with ice to get to the mailbox. Or roads blocked with snow. Easier to have a common area. We already have that outside cities anyway.
- shirro 13y agoAustralia Post has had 3 consecutive years of growth with a group profit of $312 million after tax last year. They offset their regulated business (eg mail delivery) which loses $218 million a year with things like parcel delivery that are very profitable and growing. In a country where everything generally costs far more than other places stamps are 60c. I wonder how long that is sustainable. Perhaps increased competition in the Canadian market makes it harder for them to make the profits needed to subsidise their mail delivery.
- stevewillows 13y agoAs a frequent Canada Post user, it still gets me that it's cheaper to send something to Europe or the US than it is to a fellow Canadian. What factors allow USPS to be cheaper for the consumer while providing better service?
- scott_s 13y agoLosing money? http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/10/us/post-office-loss-declines-in-third-quarter.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/10/us/post-office-loss-declin...
- stevewillows 13y agoUnbelievable. Looking around, it looks like postal system are often operating at a loss. Looks like an industry that could use some fresh eyes.
- toomuchtodo 13y agoNot everything is meant to be run for-profit.
- Karunamon 13y agoThe main thing screwing over the USPS is the moronic and absurd requirement that they pre-fund retirement for people who don't even work there yet. And then when they try to petition to change their policies to deal with the shortfalls (no Saturday delivery, etc), congress smacks 'em down.
- stevewillows 13y agoI can understand not being for-profit, but operating at such a loss is absurd in it's own right. Adding even 1c per stamp would be a major improvement to the bottom line.
- maerF0x0 13y agoIMO all things of importance fall into two categories 1) it can be sent electronically or 2) it is important enough to go get it from a central location (be it central boxes or a depot for bigger items). Additionally: If mobility is an issue and its a good that must come physically to you (prescription for example), then its of value to pay UPS/Fedex/DHL/Competitor to come to your door.
- kylefox 13y agoCanada Post is an entity that sustains itself solely by delivering direct marketing junk mail. As a Canadian citizen I would prefer to see it disappear entirely. If people need things physically sent to them they should rely on the private sector (FedEx, Purolator, etc). Such a system would reduce waste and encourage digital of documents, invoices, etc. +1.
- beloch 13y agoI'd love to see some cooperation between courier services when it comes to last-mile delivery services. Any package sent to me via international air-mail, which is cheap compared to most couriers, goes through canada post's last mile. This is actually pretty brilliant. If the package is small and no duties are required to be paid, it goes right in the superbox on my street. If it's larger or requires duties, it goes to the nearest canada post station, which is about a five minute walk from my house. Canada post stations are everywhere and have great coverage. Compare this to UPS or Purolator (which Canada post owns the majority of). They always try to deliver packages in between noon and 5pm, when I (and probably most other people) am never home. They each have one bloody depot in the city, open roughly 12-5 naturally, and it's a freakin' half-hour drive out of the way. Invariably, I have to go out of my way to drive over to their office to pick up my packages because they are incapable of delivery during the hours I am home (and they won't just drop off packages over a certain value). Though purolator may be owned by Canada post, they do not use Canada Post's last-mile infrastructure. Horrendous! Isn't the point of paying extra for a courier convenience? If Canada Post were to take over last-mile delivery from UPS and Purolator, or at least take over the failed deliveries so customers only have to go to the local post-office, they could bring in extra cash while vastly improving service to customers. Why on Earth isn't this being done, if not for UPS (which can burn in HELL for all I care), at the very least for Purolator? P.S. UPS is utter bloody crap for cross-border shipments. Any U.S. vendor who only ships via UPS does not get my business. The common joke up here is that "UPS stands for Use Purolator Stupid!".
- bowlofpetunias 13y agoThe last mile handover is usually where things go horribly wrong. That's why vendors that operate internationally choose UPS, the only courier that can deliver from a factory in China to a doorstep almost anywhere on the planet without having to hand it over to local services, which will vary wildly in quality. Also, nobody wants to pay the extortionate prices an old school state monopoly like Canada Post apparently is. It always surprises me that North-America holds on to their state systems where in Europe all of this is being privatized and post offices are disappearing. The monopolistic postal service is exactly why competitors can't invest in a better service.