4 ms·

No surprise here. I recently switched from iOS to Android, and the two readily available app stores on my device(Google Play and Amazon)are little more than a

by AmVess 13y ago

No surprise here. I recently switched from iOS to Android, and the two readily available app stores on my device(Google Play and Amazon)are little more than a cross between a digital flea market and the wild west. Google would do well to copy Apple's approach to app store curation and locking down their OS so that shenanigans like this can't be pulled off.

girvo 13y ago
Uh, Path did stuff like this on iOS well before. We aren't immune here, though that is changing with iOS 7.
- jakobe 13y ago
  Apple already locked down app access to personal data (like contacts) in iOS 6. In iOS 7 they are just going further (eg. now a dialog also pops up for access to camera and mic) The main difference is that Android has this all-or-nothing approach (accept giving the app all these permissions, or don't use the app at all), while iOS asks you for each permission individually, and you can use an app without granting it specific permissions. (eg. the weather app -- disallow access to location, and you can still type in place names manually)
  - ge0rg 13y ago
    The funny thing here is, Android had no choice to do it properly, because the respective "ask the user" mechanisms in Java, though present, are patented by Oracle, and the Android developers had to find an alternative mechanism to prevent infringement. OTOH, maybe they did it this way so you can't prevent ad-driven apps from accessing all the fine data about you.
    - viraptor 13y ago
      Citation please? Popping up a dialog isn't something Java-specific. I don't believe MS would license those patents to implement UAC either. This just sounds really improbable.
    - madeofpalk 13y ago
      > Android had no choice to do it properly With the technology we have, saying that one of the biggest software companies in the world just 'had no choice' but to implement something in a particular way is crazy.
bad_user 13y ago
I sure hope Google doesn't copy Apple's approach, because the openness of the platform and the relaxed rules of Google Play is what drove me to use Android in the first place, even though my first two smartphones where an iPhone 3G and then a 3GS, which are now paper holders. Apple's curated approach wasn't allowing me to find and install an app for a very simple need - completely blocking calls and SMS from certain phone numbers, without those numbers even showing up in the logs. My iPhone couldn't do tethering either, because it's an on/off switch accessible to your mobile career and my mobile career was charging an extra 4 EUR/month for it. Also, people don't freaking read and we can pretend that it's somehow our problem, but what's so hard at looking at the list of required dependency and reading: - wants access to your location - wants to read your contacts list What's so hard about asking yourself - why the hell would a flashlight app or screensaver want to know my location or my contacts list or whatever? Are people so dumb that we need to disallow them from hurting themselves? Android is not perfect and the permissions system could sure use some work. It would have been awesome if you could disallow certain permissions, but still install the app, in which case the app would simply not receive your location, or it would receive a blank contacts list and so on.
- ajanuary 13y ago
  One of the issues is that to a lot of people some of the reasons apps need particular permissions is pretty opaque. especially when requested up front. While with flashlights it might be obvious, with even slightly more complex apps it leads to a culture of 'fuck it'.
- bruceboughton 13y ago
  Also, people don't freaking read and we can pretend that it's somehow our problem, but what's so hard at looking at the list of required dependency and reading: - wants access to your location - wants to read your contacts list The problem with this is these apps poison the whole marketplace. If I'm going to buy a car, I'm not going to buy it from somewhere where half the cars, perhaps the popular, good-looking ones, phone home to advertisers and track my location for profit and where it is my job to read all the paperwork to check which ones do and which ones don't. The reason why the App Store has been so attractive to developers is that it has engaged users who know the downside of installing random app Foo is not high. If we train users to be wary of apps, it will not be good for hones developers of good quality apps either.
pjc50 13y ago
What would help this would be "exclude by permission" in Play store search, so you can easily find which of the dozens of flashlight apps doesn't require extra permissions. Or a proper Open Source app store like F-Droid.

by AmVess 13y ago

girvo 13y ago

Uh, Path did stuff like this on iOS well before. We aren't immune here, though that is changing with iOS 7.

jakobe 13y ago
Apple already locked down app access to personal data (like contacts) in iOS 6. In iOS 7 they are just going further (eg. now a dialog also pops up for access to camera and mic) The main difference is that Android has this all-or-nothing approach (accept giving the app all these permissions, or don't use the app at all), while iOS asks you for each permission individually, and you can use an app without granting it specific permissions. (eg. the weather app -- disallow access to location, and you can still type in place names manually)
- ge0rg 13y ago
  The funny thing here is, Android had no choice to do it properly, because the respective "ask the user" mechanisms in Java, though present, are patented by Oracle, and the Android developers had to find an alternative mechanism to prevent infringement. OTOH, maybe they did it this way so you can't prevent ad-driven apps from accessing all the fine data about you.
  - viraptor 13y ago
    Citation please? Popping up a dialog isn't something Java-specific. I don't believe MS would license those patents to implement UAC either. This just sounds really improbable.
  - madeofpalk 13y ago
    > Android had no choice to do it properly With the technology we have, saying that one of the biggest software companies in the world just 'had no choice' but to implement something in a particular way is crazy.

bad_user 13y ago

I sure hope Google doesn't copy Apple's approach, because the openness of the platform and the relaxed rules of Google Play is what drove me to use Android in the first place, even though my first two smartphones where an iPhone 3G and then a 3GS, which are now paper holders. Apple's curated approach wasn't allowing me to find and install an app for a very simple need - completely blocking calls and SMS from certain phone numbers, without those numbers even showing up in the logs. My iPhone couldn't do tethering either, because it's an on/off switch accessible to your mobile career and my mobile career was charging an extra 4 EUR/month for it. Also, people don't freaking read and we can pretend that it's somehow our problem, but what's so hard at looking at the list of required dependency and reading: - wants access to your location - wants to read your contacts list What's so hard about asking yourself - why the hell would a flashlight app or screensaver want to know my location or my contacts list or whatever? Are people so dumb that we need to disallow them from hurting themselves? Android is not perfect and the permissions system could sure use some work. It would have been awesome if you could disallow certain permissions, but still install the app, in which case the app would simply not receive your location, or it would receive a blank contacts list and so on.

ajanuary 13y ago
One of the issues is that to a lot of people some of the reasons apps need particular permissions is pretty opaque. especially when requested up front. While with flashlights it might be obvious, with even slightly more complex apps it leads to a culture of 'fuck it'.
bruceboughton 13y ago
Also, people don't freaking read and we can pretend that it's somehow our problem, but what's so hard at looking at the list of required dependency and reading: - wants access to your location - wants to read your contacts list The problem with this is these apps poison the whole marketplace. If I'm going to buy a car, I'm not going to buy it from somewhere where half the cars, perhaps the popular, good-looking ones, phone home to advertisers and track my location for profit and where it is my job to read all the paperwork to check which ones do and which ones don't. The reason why the App Store has been so attractive to developers is that it has engaged users who know the downside of installing random app Foo is not high. If we train users to be wary of apps, it will not be good for hones developers of good quality apps either.

pjc50 13y ago

What would help this would be "exclude by permission" in Play store search, so you can easily find which of the dozens of flashlight apps doesn't require extra permissions. Or a proper Open Source app store like F-Droid.