5 ms·

Yeah, if all you care about is candy crush and the random pay to win adventure game. No one is playing "real" games on tablets or phones, nor will they be anyti

by EpicEng 13y ago

Yeah, if all you care about is candy crush and the random pay to win adventure game. No one is playing "real" games on tablets or phones, nor will they be anytime in the foreseeable future.

sliverstorm 13y ago
It might sound like a snide way to put it, but there is a clear dividing line; OpenGL dominates casual platforms. DirectX dominates "traditional gaming" platforms.
- peterashford 13y ago
  So the PS2/3/4 are "casual" and not "traditional gaming" platforms?
  - EpicEng 13y ago
    I believe the parent is concerned with PC games, not Console. It's not like most console producers are concerned with cross platform anyway (at least, not until perhaps now, we'll see).
  - Tuna-Fish 13y ago
    None of then really support OpenGL though. While they had OGL implementations, all of them basically require you to write against a low-level proprietary api to be competitive with other games on the platform.
MBCook 13y ago
> No one is playing "real" games on tablets or phones, nor will they be anytime in the foreseeable future. Could you explain that? I've played some pretty great games on my iPhone/iPad over the last few years. There certainly are games that could stand up to the average PC release (remember BattleField 7 and Call of Duty 18 are not average). Many are at least easily comparable to games of the 16 bit era. A sample from my purchased apps list: Battleheart, Beat Sneak Bandit, Brainsss, Device 6, Fieldrunners, Edge, Game Dev Story, Girls Like Robots, One Tap Hero, Punch Quest, The Room, Slayin, Spider, Spy Mouse, Star Command, Supermagical, Tiny Heroes, Tiny Thief, Waking Marks, and Zenbound. This doesn't include 'tiny' games, ports, digital version of boardgames, etc.
- EpicEng 13y ago
  All of your examples are casual games. WoW, Rift, Guild Wars, SC, competitive FPS's, Witcher style RPG's, Elder Scrolls, etc. these are not games you will be playing on a tablet. There exists a clear divide between casual and serious gamers. I don't mean to imply that there's anything wrong or inherently inferior about the more casual side of things, just that they really are two very different markets.
  - tripplethrendo 13y ago
    You can play WoW and Guild Wars 2 on a Mac. Doesn't that mean they are OpenGL?
    - ahomescu1 13y ago
      Guild Wars 2 uses Wine internally to run the Windows GW2 client (I used to play it, and I'd occasionally get Wine errors).
    - EpicEng 13y ago
      WoW uses OpenGL and it runs like crap on a mac.
- sliverstorm 13y ago
  Unfortunately there's no good word for the market your parent is talking about. "real" games, "hardcore" games, all have negative connotations, but your parent is contrasting lightweight games to heavyweight games. Angry Birds to Bioshock.
  - MBCook 13y ago
    I think that's the issue here too. I would divide things in three. Casual games are often quick or pick-up-and-play. Angry birds, Bejeweled, even things like Peggle or Plants vs Zombies. Most flash/FaceBook games fit in here. Then there are the hardcore games. Eve Online, World of Warcraft, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Street Fighter 4, etc. These games often require lots of skill or dedication, and are often big budget titles. But there is a ton of stuff in between. Games that you might be able to play fast but are very difficult (like Spelunky), that the player can choose how to play (Minecraft or Terraria), that just aren't designed to be highly competitive and difficult (Sly Cooper series, maybe Ratchet and Clank series), aren't hardcore ultra-deep sims (SimCity, Game Dev Story), and many sports games (Madden, NBA2k, etc). Some people go really deep on some games and play them in a 'hardcore' way. The lines aren't easy as I know many people think World of Warcraft has been dumbed-down throughout the expansions to where it may not be 'hardcore' for many people. But that's my general taxonomy. Casual, 'normal', hardcore.
driverdan 13y ago
iOS XCOM is a great game, is far more expensive than most iOS games, and is has been very successful.
- EpicEng 13y ago
  It's not about good and bad, it's the difference between a game like WoW and a game I can play on a touchpad. Very different. The lack of horsepower is an obvious issue, but do you know how many keybinds I have in a game like wow? About 30-40. How about the precision of a mouse and keyboard vs a touchscreen? Screen size (lack of)? Some games are just too complex for these sorts of input devices and there's really no benefit to running them on a portable device. I'm not raiding while outside having a smoke.
  - jcannon98188 13y ago
    The fact that you keep saying WoW is a "serious game" shows just how little you know.
bcoates 13y ago
I installed TF2 on my work tablet yesterday, it worked just fine. Civ 5 and X-Com are great on it. Is that "real" enough?
- EpicEng 13y ago
  No. Like I have said more than once now, I'm talking about games with complex control schemes that require quick reactions.
nl 13y ago
Like to put some money on that? I'd bet money that in two years time 2 out of the top 5 "real" games will be available on iOS and/or Android. (Not entirely sure how we are defining "real" games, though).
- EpicEng 13y ago
  I would. It's simply not practical to play games on mobile devices that require more complex input devices which allow for many discrete inputs and more precise control. I don't know, perhaps someone much smarter than I will figure something amazing out, but I doubt it. And I shouldn't have used the term "real". I'm talking about games like WoW. Many (many) buttons that need to be pressed quickly in response to your opponent (not talking about LFR obviously...).
  - kazagistar 13y ago
    WoW is a terrible example due to the latency mitigation factors built into the game: you can only cast spells every so often, and then you have a global cool down between spells. You could totally do it on an ipad or some such if the control scheme was a bit better optimized for it.
    - EpicEng 13y ago
      Those aren't latency mitigation factors, but ok... So, essentially, your argument is that control schemes should be dumbed down so that they play on mobile? Yeah, that will go over well.
  - nl 13y ago
    You don't think you are taking your experience of the current control scheme of WoW and projecting it as a limitation of the platform? I'd note that it's pretty hard to do tilt-control on a PC... And there are already plenty of actions games on iOS that work well (and need to be more responsive than WoW).
    - EpicEng 13y ago
Tmmrn 13y ago
Android != tablets or phones. Thanks to android being open source people can take it and build ...stuff.. with it. I'm sure you have heard of it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouya http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouya And while it's very low-end, there is still stuff like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldwU96PGOyM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldwU96PGOyM which might not be a "real" game but it seems pretty close. Now imagine the next generation of android consoles with OpenGL ES 3.0 and more powerful GPUs.

by EpicEng 13y ago

Yeah, if all you care about is candy crush and the random pay to win adventure game. No one is playing "real" games on tablets or phones, nor will they be anytime in the foreseeable future.

sliverstorm 13y ago

It might sound like a snide way to put it, but there is a clear dividing line; OpenGL dominates casual platforms. DirectX dominates "traditional gaming" platforms.

peterashford 13y ago
So the PS2/3/4 are "casual" and not "traditional gaming" platforms?
- EpicEng 13y ago
  I believe the parent is concerned with PC games, not Console. It's not like most console producers are concerned with cross platform anyway (at least, not until perhaps now, we'll see).
- Tuna-Fish 13y ago
  None of then really support OpenGL though. While they had OGL implementations, all of them basically require you to write against a low-level proprietary api to be competitive with other games on the platform.

MBCook 13y ago

> No one is playing "real" games on tablets or phones, nor will they be anytime in the foreseeable future. Could you explain that? I've played some pretty great games on my iPhone/iPad over the last few years. There certainly are games that could stand up to the average PC release (remember BattleField 7 and Call of Duty 18 are not average). Many are at least easily comparable to games of the 16 bit era. A sample from my purchased apps list: Battleheart, Beat Sneak Bandit, Brainsss, Device 6, Fieldrunners, Edge, Game Dev Story, Girls Like Robots, One Tap Hero, Punch Quest, The Room, Slayin, Spider, Spy Mouse, Star Command, Supermagical, Tiny Heroes, Tiny Thief, Waking Marks, and Zenbound. This doesn't include 'tiny' games, ports, digital version of boardgames, etc.

EpicEng 13y ago
All of your examples are casual games. WoW, Rift, Guild Wars, SC, competitive FPS's, Witcher style RPG's, Elder Scrolls, etc. these are not games you will be playing on a tablet. There exists a clear divide between casual and serious gamers. I don't mean to imply that there's anything wrong or inherently inferior about the more casual side of things, just that they really are two very different markets.
- tripplethrendo 13y ago
  You can play WoW and Guild Wars 2 on a Mac. Doesn't that mean they are OpenGL?
  - ahomescu1 13y ago
    Guild Wars 2 uses Wine internally to run the Windows GW2 client (I used to play it, and I'd occasionally get Wine errors).
  - EpicEng 13y ago
    WoW uses OpenGL and it runs like crap on a mac.
sliverstorm 13y ago
Unfortunately there's no good word for the market your parent is talking about. "real" games, "hardcore" games, all have negative connotations, but your parent is contrasting lightweight games to heavyweight games. Angry Birds to Bioshock.
- MBCook 13y ago
  I think that's the issue here too. I would divide things in three. Casual games are often quick or pick-up-and-play. Angry birds, Bejeweled, even things like Peggle or Plants vs Zombies. Most flash/FaceBook games fit in here. Then there are the hardcore games. Eve Online, World of Warcraft, Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Street Fighter 4, etc. These games often require lots of skill or dedication, and are often big budget titles. But there is a ton of stuff in between. Games that you might be able to play fast but are very difficult (like Spelunky), that the player can choose how to play (Minecraft or Terraria), that just aren't designed to be highly competitive and difficult (Sly Cooper series, maybe Ratchet and Clank series), aren't hardcore ultra-deep sims (SimCity, Game Dev Story), and many sports games (Madden, NBA2k, etc). Some people go really deep on some games and play them in a 'hardcore' way. The lines aren't easy as I know many people think World of Warcraft has been dumbed-down throughout the expansions to where it may not be 'hardcore' for many people. But that's my general taxonomy. Casual, 'normal', hardcore.

driverdan 13y ago

iOS XCOM is a great game, is far more expensive than most iOS games, and is has been very successful.

EpicEng 13y ago
It's not about good and bad, it's the difference between a game like WoW and a game I can play on a touchpad. Very different. The lack of horsepower is an obvious issue, but do you know how many keybinds I have in a game like wow? About 30-40. How about the precision of a mouse and keyboard vs a touchscreen? Screen size (lack of)? Some games are just too complex for these sorts of input devices and there's really no benefit to running them on a portable device. I'm not raiding while outside having a smoke.
- jcannon98188 13y ago
  The fact that you keep saying WoW is a "serious game" shows just how little you know.

bcoates 13y ago

I installed TF2 on my work tablet yesterday, it worked just fine. Civ 5 and X-Com are great on it. Is that "real" enough?

EpicEng 13y ago
No. Like I have said more than once now, I'm talking about games with complex control schemes that require quick reactions.

nl 13y ago

Like to put some money on that? I'd bet money that in two years time 2 out of the top 5 "real" games will be available on iOS and/or Android. (Not entirely sure how we are defining "real" games, though).

EpicEng 13y ago
I would. It's simply not practical to play games on mobile devices that require more complex input devices which allow for many discrete inputs and more precise control. I don't know, perhaps someone much smarter than I will figure something amazing out, but I doubt it. And I shouldn't have used the term "real". I'm talking about games like WoW. Many (many) buttons that need to be pressed quickly in response to your opponent (not talking about LFR obviously...).
- kazagistar 13y ago
  WoW is a terrible example due to the latency mitigation factors built into the game: you can only cast spells every so often, and then you have a global cool down between spells. You could totally do it on an ipad or some such if the control scheme was a bit better optimized for it.
  - EpicEng 13y ago
    Those aren't latency mitigation factors, but ok... So, essentially, your argument is that control schemes should be dumbed down so that they play on mobile? Yeah, that will go over well.
- nl 13y ago
  You don't think you are taking your experience of the current control scheme of WoW and projecting it as a limitation of the platform? I'd note that it's pretty hard to do tilt-control on a PC... And there are already plenty of actions games on iOS that work well (and need to be more responsive than WoW).
  - EpicEng 13y ago

Tmmrn 13y ago

Android != tablets or phones. Thanks to android being open source people can take it and build ...stuff.. with it. I'm sure you have heard of it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouya http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouya And while it's very low-end, there is still stuff like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldwU96PGOyM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldwU96PGOyM which might not be a "real" game but it seems pretty close. Now imagine the next generation of android consoles with OpenGL ES 3.0 and more powerful GPUs.