6 ms·

Safari Push Notifications

55 points by superchink 13y ago

cfontes 13y ago
What a weird feeling I get when seeing this. It looks so cool but pisses me off at the same time. I hope I get a way to turn this off easily of at least filter it's content.
- usearegex 13y ago
  You have to specifically grant permission to websites to let them send you notifications, Safari will ask you the first time you visit the site similar to how sites can request your current location. You can change these settings later through the Safari preferences.
- caiob 13y ago
  Why does it piss you off? It's only there because you've chosen to.
  - axman6 13y ago
    Look at the domain name, clearly it's an evil ploy from the devil incorporate.
- taspeotis 13y ago
  I hope I get a way to turn this off easily 1. Don't turn it on 2. ??? 3. Profit
techscruggs 13y ago
Its interesting that Safari doesn't need to be on for these to work. I wonder if it will launch my browser of choice (Chrome) when I click on one of these.
- cwilson 13y ago
  Safari doesn't have to be on, but you do need to be using Mavericks. Good question around "default browser" behavior however. I really, really hope they don't try to force Safari on me with these.
- shawkinaw 13y ago
  Presumably you at least need to visit the site with Safari initially to enable the notifications.
- whyenot 13y ago
  It doesn't. FF is my default browser. If I click on a notification from the NY Times, it opens in Safari.
cwilson 13y ago
So correct me if I'm wrong, but this ONLY works if you have Mavericks, correct? If so, why is it called Safari Push Notifications? Safari doesn't have to be running for them to work. Unless you don't have to be using Mavericks, and it works with the latest version of Safari (assuming you have it launched) regardless of OS (Windows, OSX v*, etc), and Mavericks is only required when you don't have Safari running.
- bdash 13y ago
  Yes, this only works if you have Mavericks. It is called Safari Push Notifications because it's a push notification feature provided by Safari, to distinguish it from OS X's more general support for push notifications. Safari also supports the "Web Notifications" specification[1], which allows a website to post a notification while it is open in Safari. This has been supported for a few releases now and is also available in some other browsers. I believe Gmail can make use of this to call attention to new emails while open in a background tab. [1]: <https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/notifications/raw-file/tip/Overview.html> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/notifications/raw-file/tip/Overview.h...
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
    - bdash 13y ago
      Can you clarify what part of my comment this is in response to? I'm having difficulty understanding why you chose to post it in reply to my comment.
- masklinn 13y ago
  > If so, why is it called Safari Push Notifications? Safari doesn't have to be running for them to work. Because as far as the user can see, Safari is the interface to these notifications: that's where you get the prompt to subscribe to the notification, and you can configure or remove notifications from its settings.
wiradikusuma 13y ago
Now we just need a standard for this, as not many people use Safari in Mac (compared to others as a whole).
- jcutrell 13y ago
  The problem with this is the basic structure of the notification system. The standard would be the push system itself (rather than a browser standard).
- aroman 13y ago
  That's really really not possible if you understand the basics of how this works. This is NOT a browser API, this is an API for Apple's own cloud push notification infrastructure. This technology can ONLY work with a giant third-party server doing the legwork.
songzme 13y ago
Safari is my #1 browser to download chrome. It seems to always fall behind the HTML5 features that matters most. For example, WebRTC lets developers integrate real time audio/video/data awesomeness into websites and its readily available in firefox and chrome, but not safari.
- leokun 13y ago
  We've developed a WebRTC PeerConnection video chat, and it is not so great just yet. It barely works in Firefox, and is all around buggy and constantly changing.
  - jmspring 13y ago
    WebRTC is not yet a standard, video codec is still being discussed, so not surprised Apple is being conservative. Google is much more experimental with Chrome.
- coldtea 13y ago
  >For example, WebRTC lets developers integrate real time audio/video/data awesomeness into websites and its readily available in firefox and chrome, but not safari. And how does WebRTC matters for everyday use at the moment? I haven't seen anything that is not a tech-demo or similar relying on it. It would be nice to have it in Safari too (and I use Chrome myself), but it's hardly a deal breaker (or even relevant).
  - morgante 13y ago
    It's relevant to developers, in that some of what we do is tech-demos.
  - kartoffelmos 13y ago
    Arguably, it is because the lack of browser support that makes WebRTC "not matter for everyday use". We would see a lot more use if IE and Safari would implement it. And not only for video conferencing (such as https://appear.in https://appear.in), but also for multiplayer gaming, filesharing, audio recording+++
jws 13y ago
If you think you want to do this in the future, then get your corporate D-U-N-S number and corporate Apple developer account. Things can go wrong in this process, there are horror stories of it taking many weeks.
alecsmart1 13y ago
This is truly a good step forward. I am not sure why it's called Safari Push Notification. As per their docs, it is primarily an OS function. So technically it should be possible to do this using Chrome on Mac as well. However, it is possible they bundle it with Safari. Then they can have push notifications in Windows as well.
- saurik 13y ago
  How do you anticipate getting the push token from Chrome if not via the Safari-specific JavaScript APIs?
  - alecsmart1 13y ago
    That's a good point. Then why do they need OS support? Why not run a simple background service when Safari is installed and make it cross-platform.
    - saurik 13y ago
      Apple does not consider cross-platform features to be in their interest: they make money on hardware, and consider quality software to be a feature of that hardware. Safari itself is not cross-platform: it was temporarily distributed for Windows, but it has not been updated in a year and a half; you can't add a cross-platform background service to a web browser that is only distributed bundled with an operating system ;P. (As far as I understand, Safari for Windows mostly existed just to get web developers to support Safari better, but as they've now gained so much marketshare they discontinued that project.)
      - Samuel_Michon 13y ago
        > [Safari] was temporarily distributed for Windows Meaning from June of 2007 to this day. 6 years is temporary for a browser as much as living on earth feels temporary for a human.
        13y ago
clintboxe 13y ago
If you want to see an example, check out Redfin: http://blog.redfin.com/blog/2013/10/redfin-introduces-new-instant-notifications-in-apple-safari-os-x-mavericks.html http://blog.redfin.com/blog/2013/10/redfin-introduces-new-in...
denzil_correa 13y ago
Will and won't this encourage spam from websites in the form of advertisements etc.? I hope this has some form of authentication barrier. Presently, I prefer desktop notifications from Chrome via Chime on websites I have signed in. - http://chimeapp.com/ http://chimeapp.com/
- glhaynes 13y ago
  Yeah, the user has to accept notifications per site.
- RossM 13y ago
  It's opt-in, similar to Chrome's desktop notifications.
- bradleyland 13y ago
  I up-voted because I've noticed a dramatic increase in the number of auth requests as I browse websites. In most cases the website authors are just trying to be helpful, but the bar is pretty high for me to sign up for push notifications. For most websites, I prefer to get email, if anything at all. Push notifications are the kind of thing I'm only going to use for transactional matters. The problem (for me) is that no one seems to be able to run a push service without abusing it. I can't sign up for weather alerts without being bombarded with useless information, much less a Mac news-site.
CSDude 13y ago
Considering all the time we spent trying to defeat pop-ups, this is just a step back for many more advertisements. The push notifications on the mobile is already bad, especially on Android, it can get much more worse on a web browser.
- bdash 13y ago
  From the "Notification Programming Guide for Websites"[1]: > Opting In to Notifications > > Users must opt in to receive notifications. The opt-in process only occurs > once per domain. The presentation of asking for permission is identical > for all website notifications. In fact, the permission policy that > a user chooses for push notifications applies to local notifications. It goes on to say that "users can adjust their notification preferences in Safari preferences and System Preferences". [1]: https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/NetworkingInternet/Conceptual/NotificationProgrammingGuideForWebsites/UserExperience/UserExperience.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40013225-CH10-SW7 https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/Networ...
srinivasanv 13y ago
Why not just make it a Mac feature as opposed to a Safari feature? This feels a little like Microsoft trying to integrate IE into Windows.
- valleyer 13y ago
  I think even most of Microsoft's critics agree that the criticism over integrating IE and Windows was pointless. Basically every major desktop and mobile OS does the same thing these days. Also, Safari is only released on OS X. So I'm not sure what your first sentence really means either.
dave1010uk 13y ago
Apple must need to know who you are as soon as you log in for this to work. Presumably this only works if you have some kind of Apple account. Do Macs call home each time a user logs into a Mac? If so, are Mac users generally aware and OK with this?
- crystaln 13y ago
  Yes. It's optional, but most users use an iCloud account that sync their address book, calendar, etc. Just like Microsoft and Google.
  - bdash 13y ago
    As far as I'm aware, iCloud accounts aren't required for push notifications. The push notification system identifies devices by an opaque token that isn't tied to any user-identifiable information. Edit: The Apple Push Notification Service documentation at https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/NetworkingInternet/Conceptual/RemoteNotificationsPG/Chapters/ApplePushService.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40008194-CH100-SW9 https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/Networ... talks about the architecture and seems to match my recollection.
grigio 13y ago
fuck you apple! To see this video you need safari browser, a registered account and then it is also buggy the video seek is broken

55 points by superchink 13y ago

What a weird feeling I get when seeing this. It looks so cool but pisses me off at the same time. I hope I get a way to turn this off easily of at least filter it's content.

usearegex 13y ago
You have to specifically grant permission to websites to let them send you notifications, Safari will ask you the first time you visit the site similar to how sites can request your current location. You can change these settings later through the Safari preferences.
caiob 13y ago
Why does it piss you off? It's only there because you've chosen to.
- axman6 13y ago
  Look at the domain name, clearly it's an evil ploy from the devil incorporate.
taspeotis 13y ago
I hope I get a way to turn this off easily 1. Don't turn it on 2. ??? 3. Profit

techscruggs 13y ago

Its interesting that Safari doesn't need to be on for these to work. I wonder if it will launch my browser of choice (Chrome) when I click on one of these.

cwilson 13y ago
Safari doesn't have to be on, but you do need to be using Mavericks. Good question around "default browser" behavior however. I really, really hope they don't try to force Safari on me with these.
shawkinaw 13y ago
Presumably you at least need to visit the site with Safari initially to enable the notifications.
whyenot 13y ago
It doesn't. FF is my default browser. If I click on a notification from the NY Times, it opens in Safari.

cwilson 13y ago

So correct me if I'm wrong, but this ONLY works if you have Mavericks, correct? If so, why is it called Safari Push Notifications? Safari doesn't have to be running for them to work. Unless you don't have to be using Mavericks, and it works with the latest version of Safari (assuming you have it launched) regardless of OS (Windows, OSX v*, etc), and Mavericks is only required when you don't have Safari running.

bdash 13y ago
Yes, this only works if you have Mavericks. It is called Safari Push Notifications because it's a push notification feature provided by Safari, to distinguish it from OS X's more general support for push notifications. Safari also supports the "Web Notifications" specification[1], which allows a website to post a notification while it is open in Safari. This has been supported for a few releases now and is also available in some other browsers. I believe Gmail can make use of this to call attention to new emails while open in a background tab. [1]: <https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/notifications/raw-file/tip/Overview.html> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/notifications/raw-file/tip/Overview.h...
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
  - bdash 13y ago
    Can you clarify what part of my comment this is in response to? I'm having difficulty understanding why you chose to post it in reply to my comment.
masklinn 13y ago
> If so, why is it called Safari Push Notifications? Safari doesn't have to be running for them to work. Because as far as the user can see, Safari is the interface to these notifications: that's where you get the prompt to subscribe to the notification, and you can configure or remove notifications from its settings.

wiradikusuma 13y ago

Now we just need a standard for this, as not many people use Safari in Mac (compared to others as a whole).

jcutrell 13y ago
The problem with this is the basic structure of the notification system. The standard would be the push system itself (rather than a browser standard).
aroman 13y ago
That's really really not possible if you understand the basics of how this works. This is NOT a browser API, this is an API for Apple's own cloud push notification infrastructure. This technology can ONLY work with a giant third-party server doing the legwork.

songzme 13y ago

Safari is my #1 browser to download chrome. It seems to always fall behind the HTML5 features that matters most. For example, WebRTC lets developers integrate real time audio/video/data awesomeness into websites and its readily available in firefox and chrome, but not safari.

leokun 13y ago
We've developed a WebRTC PeerConnection video chat, and it is not so great just yet. It barely works in Firefox, and is all around buggy and constantly changing.
- jmspring 13y ago
  WebRTC is not yet a standard, video codec is still being discussed, so not surprised Apple is being conservative. Google is much more experimental with Chrome.
coldtea 13y ago
>For example, WebRTC lets developers integrate real time audio/video/data awesomeness into websites and its readily available in firefox and chrome, but not safari. And how does WebRTC matters for everyday use at the moment? I haven't seen anything that is not a tech-demo or similar relying on it. It would be nice to have it in Safari too (and I use Chrome myself), but it's hardly a deal breaker (or even relevant).
- morgante 13y ago
  It's relevant to developers, in that some of what we do is tech-demos.
- kartoffelmos 13y ago
  Arguably, it is because the lack of browser support that makes WebRTC "not matter for everyday use". We would see a lot more use if IE and Safari would implement it. And not only for video conferencing (such as https://appear.in https://appear.in), but also for multiplayer gaming, filesharing, audio recording+++

jws 13y ago

If you think you want to do this in the future, then get your corporate D-U-N-S number and corporate Apple developer account. Things can go wrong in this process, there are horror stories of it taking many weeks.

alecsmart1 13y ago

This is truly a good step forward. I am not sure why it's called Safari Push Notification. As per their docs, it is primarily an OS function. So technically it should be possible to do this using Chrome on Mac as well. However, it is possible they bundle it with Safari. Then they can have push notifications in Windows as well.

saurik 13y ago
How do you anticipate getting the push token from Chrome if not via the Safari-specific JavaScript APIs?
- alecsmart1 13y ago
  That's a good point. Then why do they need OS support? Why not run a simple background service when Safari is installed and make it cross-platform.
  - saurik 13y ago
    Apple does not consider cross-platform features to be in their interest: they make money on hardware, and consider quality software to be a feature of that hardware. Safari itself is not cross-platform: it was temporarily distributed for Windows, but it has not been updated in a year and a half; you can't add a cross-platform background service to a web browser that is only distributed bundled with an operating system ;P. (As far as I understand, Safari for Windows mostly existed just to get web developers to support Safari better, but as they've now gained so much marketshare they discontinued that project.)
    - Samuel_Michon 13y ago
      > [Safari] was temporarily distributed for Windows Meaning from June of 2007 to this day. 6 years is temporary for a browser as much as living on earth feels temporary for a human.
      - 13y ago

clintboxe 13y ago

If you want to see an example, check out Redfin: http://blog.redfin.com/blog/2013/10/redfin-introduces-new-instant-notifications-in-apple-safari-os-x-mavericks.html http://blog.redfin.com/blog/2013/10/redfin-introduces-new-in...

denzil_correa 13y ago

Will and won't this encourage spam from websites in the form of advertisements etc.? I hope this has some form of authentication barrier. Presently, I prefer desktop notifications from Chrome via Chime on websites I have signed in. - http://chimeapp.com/ http://chimeapp.com/

glhaynes 13y ago
Yeah, the user has to accept notifications per site.
RossM 13y ago
It's opt-in, similar to Chrome's desktop notifications.
bradleyland 13y ago
I up-voted because I've noticed a dramatic increase in the number of auth requests as I browse websites. In most cases the website authors are just trying to be helpful, but the bar is pretty high for me to sign up for push notifications. For most websites, I prefer to get email, if anything at all. Push notifications are the kind of thing I'm only going to use for transactional matters. The problem (for me) is that no one seems to be able to run a push service without abusing it. I can't sign up for weather alerts without being bombarded with useless information, much less a Mac news-site.

CSDude 13y ago

Considering all the time we spent trying to defeat pop-ups, this is just a step back for many more advertisements. The push notifications on the mobile is already bad, especially on Android, it can get much more worse on a web browser.

bdash 13y ago
From the "Notification Programming Guide for Websites"[1]: > Opting In to Notifications > > Users must opt in to receive notifications. The opt-in process only occurs > once per domain. The presentation of asking for permission is identical > for all website notifications. In fact, the permission policy that > a user chooses for push notifications applies to local notifications. It goes on to say that "users can adjust their notification preferences in Safari preferences and System Preferences". [1]: https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/NetworkingInternet/Conceptual/NotificationProgrammingGuideForWebsites/UserExperience/UserExperience.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40013225-CH10-SW7 https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/Networ...

srinivasanv 13y ago

Why not just make it a Mac feature as opposed to a Safari feature? This feels a little like Microsoft trying to integrate IE into Windows.

valleyer 13y ago
I think even most of Microsoft's critics agree that the criticism over integrating IE and Windows was pointless. Basically every major desktop and mobile OS does the same thing these days. Also, Safari is only released on OS X. So I'm not sure what your first sentence really means either.

dave1010uk 13y ago

Apple must need to know who you are as soon as you log in for this to work. Presumably this only works if you have some kind of Apple account. Do Macs call home each time a user logs into a Mac? If so, are Mac users generally aware and OK with this?

crystaln 13y ago
Yes. It's optional, but most users use an iCloud account that sync their address book, calendar, etc. Just like Microsoft and Google.
- bdash 13y ago
  As far as I'm aware, iCloud accounts aren't required for push notifications. The push notification system identifies devices by an opaque token that isn't tied to any user-identifiable information. Edit: The Apple Push Notification Service documentation at https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/NetworkingInternet/Conceptual/RemoteNotificationsPG/Chapters/ApplePushService.html#//apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40008194-CH100-SW9 https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/Networ... talks about the architecture and seems to match my recollection.

grigio 13y ago

fuck you apple! To see this video you need safari browser, a registered account and then it is also buggy the video seek is broken