7 ms·

Frontend: The web visual editor

70 points by marizmelo 13y ago

Kickstart campaign for the most advanced open-source web editor for your browser.

dennyoi 13y ago
If you have no ideas - create secure messenger...or web builder.
duiker101 13y ago
there are many of this apps already, and while there are a couple that are nice my question is: has anyone actually ever used any of this for something serious?
- porker 13y ago
  Yes but this one is slightly different being open source - it means (rather than everyone re-inventing the wheel) it can be integrated into Drupal, Wordpress, any other CMS... which I for one would be in favour of, as it would level the playing field again.
  - tmikaeld 13y ago
    +1 for this excellent argument!
  - marizmelo 13y ago
    You have captured the idea porker. Thanks.
korussian 13y ago
This seems to be more or less exactly the same as http://jetstrap.com http://jetstrap.com
- ilaksh 13y ago
  Looks like its different because its not for building only front ends but actually fully functional websites on Node.us. and its open source.
kayoone 13y ago
The open source part of it is cool, but i still have a couple of issues with it: + why do you need 75K as a minimum ? Sounds a bit high, even for 2 people + They say its built with node, but what about the frontend of frontend ? Only jquery ? + does it support bootstrap or other layouting frameworks? + when will they let people contribute to it ? Id really like something like this being open source, but in that case i feel it would need some more flexibility to be integrated into CMSes and Frameworks. Abstracted reusable components to plug it into existing systems, some kind of Content Repository integration for versioning etc. If thats the plan, ill fund in a heartbeat. If its meant just as a downloadable tool to built basic websites it wouldnt have much appeal to me though.
- ilaksh 13y ago
  It is a CMS in itself. How is 75k high for two people? Are they supposed to commit to living below the poverty line?
  - kayoone 13y ago
    They say its "An open source Photoshop replacement for web design" in which case it would be cool to integrate something like this into existing systems. Starting yet another CMS system from scratch doesn't sound like the best idea.
  - BenjaminN 13y ago
    In which country living with $75k is living below the poverty line exactly?
    - simonv3 13y ago
      Developers have completely lost touch with what an average wage is for a single person family.
    - Samuel_Michon 13y ago
      As I understand it, that's for 2 devs. Subtract the Kickstarter fees, sending out the Kickstarter rewards, and various taxes, that leaves them with maybe $20k per person. Of course, that number is meaningless by itself, not knowing how long it will take them to complete the project. If they devote more than a year to the project, depending on where they live that's not a lot of income.
ilaksh 13y ago
Do the components include back-end Node.is code also? If so I really hope your project becomes popular and is open source. Because I think that developers should code components not UIs or reinventing Crud or email sign up forms. So this is the right direction for developers not just designers or novices. The popular approach with a lot of manual code for basic things like layout and other things is very dumb. Components are the way to go.
- marizmelo 13y ago
  Components should be easy to plugin on the system using any available APIs out there. Facebook Login, Twitter Feeds, Database integration, etc. Our goal is not to build a simple visual editor. We want to create an ecosystems for developers, designers, and regular users. This is just a "kickstart".
glazskunrukitis 13y ago
Have you seen Webflow[0] and Froont[1]? [0] https://webflow.com/ https://webflow.com/ [1] http://froont.com/ http://froont.com/
- tmikaeld 13y ago
  Yes, but they are not open source. Have you seen divshot, jetstrap or easel? You probably have, are they open source? NO!
- marizmelo 13y ago
  Yes, they are great. I have met with the Webflow team (great guys). The differences: 1. Frontend is open-source; 2. Database integration; 3. Plugins (components) create by users; Other differences will appear on the stretch goals.
mooted1 13y ago
Webflow, an existing product, is much more powerful and pretty affordable. Macaw, if it's as awesome as it looks in the demo, may be better than Webflow. This, this is thoroughly underwhelming. Sorry. If open source is your biggest differentiator, I think you should emphasize this. Being able to use this as a part of other environments would make it much more compelling. Maybe change up the kickstarter page?
- marizmelo 13y ago
  Webflow is great and Macaw seems amazing, but let me try to make the difference clear here: Frontend vs Webflow: 1. Frontend is open-source (as you mention); 2. Frontend has a databased integration (ORM); 3. Frontend let users create their own components and templates and plugin on the system; 4. You can develop locally (for speed) and push projects to the web whenever you are done; 6. You can host frontend on your own server online and deploy projects from there; Frontend vs Macaw: 1. Frontend runs on the browser, there is not "preview" process; 2. Frontend is open-source; 3. Frontend let users plug their own components and templates; 4. You can develop locally and push projects whenever you are done; 5. You can host frontend on your own server online and deploy projects from there; 6. Frontend is responsive (mobile ready), with Macaw you need to check if your project will work on mobile first (and on tablet); More differences will appear on the stretch goals. Thank you for the comment.
sorich87 13y ago
A shameless plug for my own similar open source project with an already functional version http://www.brickseditor.com/ http://www.brickseditor.com/. It uses Bootstrap for the layout but there are plans to support other frameworks. It's built on AngularJS. I'm currently working on it full time. Maybe there could be some way we could collaborate if this Kickstarter isn't successful?
- ishener 13y ago
  looks very nice. I especially like that it's fast
  - sorich87 13y ago
    Thanks. I'm trying to keep it simple, fast and extensible.
- tmikaeld 13y ago
  Very nice! Yours is much more than just a front-end editor, yours create complete apps. EDIT: And yours is not MIT licensed and has separate commercial licenses.
  - sorich87 13y ago
    The goal is to allow make the whole development process, from prototyping to deployment, easier. It's AGPL. The commercial licenses are for people or companies who may want to modify it without releasing their modifications back to the community. If they don't want to contribute their code, they will at least contribute financially.
    - tmikaeld 13y ago
      It really does, just don't over-complicate things and add support for plugins and it will be perfect! Do the commercial license cost 299$ per year? Is it limited per install, or company-wide?
joosters 13y ago
The reward structure is odd. For example, the 'super backer' $1000 level is limited to 200, yet the rewards given (e.g. The memory stick) are unlimited in the previous levels. Why artificially limit yourself to 200?
- marizmelo 13y ago
  You are right Joosters, thank you for your comment. We will work on the rewards.
eonil 13y ago
Looks cool. But nothing related to Photoshop. They can say this something like iWeb or DreamWeaver, but not Photoshop at all.
alco 13y ago
It pains me to see how he repeats the same action for each subtitle-block element, doing the same thing 3 times total. Imagine you had a scrollable area with 20 blocks. If it's a mockup editor, then it should be easy to customize from JS to make anything useful from the mockup. If it's a site builder, better add support for templates, so that one would then be able to drag and drop data (e.g. json) onto the canvas and bind it to a template to automatically populate a whole set of elements at once. P.S. No matter how slick your UI is, if it's not programmable, it's not useful.
- marizmelo 13y ago
  The system has a code editor for your convenience @alco. I will try to make that more clear. Also, you will be able to select multiple elements and parent elements and apply the same actions.
izolate 13y ago
It irks me that this is called Frontend. It's not, it's design. Call it Design. Or Frontpage 2013. Whatever. Frontend is a development skill, which requires intricate knowledge of markup and javascript languages/frameworks.
- skrebbel 13y ago
  Oh come on. "Frontend" isn't a skill. It's a piece of software that makes interfacing with another piece of software easier. There have been frontends long before there was HTML.
  - izolate 13y ago
    That's a fair point. I may have made the assumption that this was named after the skill.
bbx 13y ago
Although Frontend is impressive, the target market is a bit blurry. As a front-end developer, I don't see myself using such a tool. And non tech-savvy people would probably feel a bit overwhelmed and would still have issues designing a decent layout considering it's not their job. For some time, I've had in mind a service where people could easily build their websites. A bit like Squarespace (which is amazing) but with a different interface. For many clients who only need a homepage, a contact page, an about page, and some content pages, I usually end up building a custom WordPress theme because its admin interface is efficient and user-friendly, and because I have much experience in it. But still, I don't consider it the best tool for the job. I'm not a great programmer, but I have UI, UX, and front-end skills. I'll probably try to develop a workable draft of this app I have in mind, but if anyone is interested in building an easy-to-use platform for non tech-savvy people, feel free to contact me. I have some ideas about how the workflow should be and what features it should have.
- coldarchon 13y ago
  Target market? They "ship" their beta access and github only to the US. When they fail at the most basic cognitive skills, I won't waste my time to look deeper into this. About your app, if you are sure it is different from services like WIX and alike, I can help you.
- madoublet 13y ago
  I am working toward a similar goal with my open source project (respondcms.com): allow the developer/designer to focus on design while allowing the end-user to focus on creating content.
  - marveller 13y ago
    I have been watching on this CMS for some time, great job!
    - madoublet 13y ago
      Thank you. It is always a work-in-progress, but it (hopefully) gets better with each release.
kanakiyajay 13y ago
1.How is it different from macaw or Adobe Muse ? 2.I did not understand why are you using a custom web framework xtyle , instead why not go for Bootstrap ?. Its already used by millions and you also save a lot of time. 3.Components feature sounds exciting , but how much similar is it to angular directives. 4.What is target market ? front-end developers or non-tech people?
- dsego 13y ago
  What is so f'ing special about bootstrap?
- marizmelo 13y ago
  Macaw and Muse are commercial tools. Frontend was created as an open-source alternative. We use xtyle by default, but you can for sure use Bootstrap (its your choice). Components are anything you can plugin on the system (including directives if you are an Angular developer). The target market are front-end developer, designers, and non-tech.
incimou 13y ago
What about https://rukzuk.com/en/ https://rukzuk.com/en/ ? Not open source but the only tool I found which has integrated CMS. Website says it's even extendable with custom code.
- pter_s 13y ago
  The video looks promising.
- tmikaeld 13y ago
  It's a really nice tool, but it's a SAAS - no go for us.
brickcap 13y ago
Nice. What technologies are you using to build Frontend?
jwarren 13y ago
Bro, do you even Bootstrap? Edit: Sorry, it's not Bootstrap, it's their own framework. Though visually it's very similar. But seriously, I'm not sure who this is for. It looks like there's quite a technical hurdle to setting it up - node.js and vagrant aren't easy to install for a novice user, and they aren't suitable for any shared hosting environment that I've come across. I imagine (possibly incorrectly) that the market for simple point and click interfaces wouldn't necessarily overlap with that of people who are comfortable setting up complex hosting environments. Now, as an online subscription model, I think it could be quite competitive. That's an entirely different route which definitely has a market.
- marizmelo 13y ago
  Hey jwarren. Thanks for the comment. Online system is definitely an option down the road. About the setup. Basically the only thing you need to install is vagrant. The Frontend VM has all the files and tools required to run the application on your machine. 1. Install Vagrant (with our installer); 2. Run VM 3. You are ready to go.
sycren 13y ago
The product looks amazing but the Kickstarter reward levels need to be rethought.
- marizmelo 13y ago
  I agree sycren. We are first timers on Kickstarter, but we will work on that. Thank you for the comment.
meerita 13y ago
This is Microsoft Frontpage all over again. I'm sure they will have market: people who don't have the money to contract serious developers, and some novel developers who may like this idea, but in the end, I think it's a product with few possibilities.
elsurudo 13y ago
Looks to me like it works pretty much just like Squarespace (except self-hosted and open). The way Squarespace makes it easy for non-web-designer folk to put together nice-looking websites is excellent, so it's a good model to work from.
marizmelo 13y ago
Hey everybody. Please give a second look over the project. We tried to make clear the differences between Frontend and the other options out there. Let us know about anything we can improve on the Kickstarter page. Thank you. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/emoriz/frontend-the-web-visual-editor http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/emoriz/frontend-the-web-...

70 points by marizmelo 13y ago

Kickstart campaign for the most advanced open-source web editor for your browser.

dennyoi 13y ago

If you have no ideas - create secure messenger...or web builder.

duiker101 13y ago

there are many of this apps already, and while there are a couple that are nice my question is: has anyone actually ever used any of this for something serious?

porker 13y ago
Yes but this one is slightly different being open source - it means (rather than everyone re-inventing the wheel) it can be integrated into Drupal, Wordpress, any other CMS... which I for one would be in favour of, as it would level the playing field again.
- tmikaeld 13y ago
  +1 for this excellent argument!
- marizmelo 13y ago
  You have captured the idea porker. Thanks.

korussian 13y ago

This seems to be more or less exactly the same as http://jetstrap.com http://jetstrap.com

ilaksh 13y ago
Looks like its different because its not for building only front ends but actually fully functional websites on Node.us. and its open source.

kayoone 13y ago

The open source part of it is cool, but i still have a couple of issues with it: + why do you need 75K as a minimum ? Sounds a bit high, even for 2 people + They say its built with node, but what about the frontend of frontend ? Only jquery ? + does it support bootstrap or other layouting frameworks? + when will they let people contribute to it ? Id really like something like this being open source, but in that case i feel it would need some more flexibility to be integrated into CMSes and Frameworks. Abstracted reusable components to plug it into existing systems, some kind of Content Repository integration for versioning etc. If thats the plan, ill fund in a heartbeat. If its meant just as a downloadable tool to built basic websites it wouldnt have much appeal to me though.

ilaksh 13y ago
It is a CMS in itself. How is 75k high for two people? Are they supposed to commit to living below the poverty line?
- kayoone 13y ago
  They say its "An open source Photoshop replacement for web design" in which case it would be cool to integrate something like this into existing systems. Starting yet another CMS system from scratch doesn't sound like the best idea.
- BenjaminN 13y ago
  In which country living with $75k is living below the poverty line exactly?
  - simonv3 13y ago
    Developers have completely lost touch with what an average wage is for a single person family.
  - Samuel_Michon 13y ago
    As I understand it, that's for 2 devs. Subtract the Kickstarter fees, sending out the Kickstarter rewards, and various taxes, that leaves them with maybe $20k per person. Of course, that number is meaningless by itself, not knowing how long it will take them to complete the project. If they devote more than a year to the project, depending on where they live that's not a lot of income.

ilaksh 13y ago

Do the components include back-end Node.is code also? If so I really hope your project becomes popular and is open source. Because I think that developers should code components not UIs or reinventing Crud or email sign up forms. So this is the right direction for developers not just designers or novices. The popular approach with a lot of manual code for basic things like layout and other things is very dumb. Components are the way to go.

marizmelo 13y ago
Components should be easy to plugin on the system using any available APIs out there. Facebook Login, Twitter Feeds, Database integration, etc. Our goal is not to build a simple visual editor. We want to create an ecosystems for developers, designers, and regular users. This is just a "kickstart".

glazskunrukitis 13y ago

Have you seen Webflow[0] and Froont[1]? [0] https://webflow.com/ https://webflow.com/ [1] http://froont.com/ http://froont.com/

tmikaeld 13y ago
Yes, but they are not open source. Have you seen divshot, jetstrap or easel? You probably have, are they open source? NO!
marizmelo 13y ago
Yes, they are great. I have met with the Webflow team (great guys). The differences: 1. Frontend is open-source; 2. Database integration; 3. Plugins (components) create by users; Other differences will appear on the stretch goals.

mooted1 13y ago

Webflow, an existing product, is much more powerful and pretty affordable. Macaw, if it's as awesome as it looks in the demo, may be better than Webflow. This, this is thoroughly underwhelming. Sorry. If open source is your biggest differentiator, I think you should emphasize this. Being able to use this as a part of other environments would make it much more compelling. Maybe change up the kickstarter page?

marizmelo 13y ago
Webflow is great and Macaw seems amazing, but let me try to make the difference clear here: Frontend vs Webflow: 1. Frontend is open-source (as you mention); 2. Frontend has a databased integration (ORM); 3. Frontend let users create their own components and templates and plugin on the system; 4. You can develop locally (for speed) and push projects to the web whenever you are done; 6. You can host frontend on your own server online and deploy projects from there; Frontend vs Macaw: 1. Frontend runs on the browser, there is not "preview" process; 2. Frontend is open-source; 3. Frontend let users plug their own components and templates; 4. You can develop locally and push projects whenever you are done; 5. You can host frontend on your own server online and deploy projects from there; 6. Frontend is responsive (mobile ready), with Macaw you need to check if your project will work on mobile first (and on tablet); More differences will appear on the stretch goals. Thank you for the comment.

sorich87 13y ago

A shameless plug for my own similar open source project with an already functional version http://www.brickseditor.com/ http://www.brickseditor.com/. It uses Bootstrap for the layout but there are plans to support other frameworks. It's built on AngularJS. I'm currently working on it full time. Maybe there could be some way we could collaborate if this Kickstarter isn't successful?

ishener 13y ago
looks very nice. I especially like that it's fast
- sorich87 13y ago
  Thanks. I'm trying to keep it simple, fast and extensible.
tmikaeld 13y ago
Very nice! Yours is much more than just a front-end editor, yours create complete apps. EDIT: And yours is not MIT licensed and has separate commercial licenses.
- sorich87 13y ago
  The goal is to allow make the whole development process, from prototyping to deployment, easier. It's AGPL. The commercial licenses are for people or companies who may want to modify it without releasing their modifications back to the community. If they don't want to contribute their code, they will at least contribute financially.
  - tmikaeld 13y ago
    It really does, just don't over-complicate things and add support for plugins and it will be perfect! Do the commercial license cost 299$ per year? Is it limited per install, or company-wide?

joosters 13y ago

The reward structure is odd. For example, the 'super backer' $1000 level is limited to 200, yet the rewards given (e.g. The memory stick) are unlimited in the previous levels. Why artificially limit yourself to 200?

marizmelo 13y ago
You are right Joosters, thank you for your comment. We will work on the rewards.

eonil 13y ago

Looks cool. But nothing related to Photoshop. They can say this something like iWeb or DreamWeaver, but not Photoshop at all.

alco 13y ago

It pains me to see how he repeats the same action for each subtitle-block element, doing the same thing 3 times total. Imagine you had a scrollable area with 20 blocks. If it's a mockup editor, then it should be easy to customize from JS to make anything useful from the mockup. If it's a site builder, better add support for templates, so that one would then be able to drag and drop data (e.g. json) onto the canvas and bind it to a template to automatically populate a whole set of elements at once. P.S. No matter how slick your UI is, if it's not programmable, it's not useful.

marizmelo 13y ago
The system has a code editor for your convenience @alco. I will try to make that more clear. Also, you will be able to select multiple elements and parent elements and apply the same actions.

izolate 13y ago

It irks me that this is called Frontend. It's not, it's design. Call it Design. Or Frontpage 2013. Whatever. Frontend is a development skill, which requires intricate knowledge of markup and javascript languages/frameworks.

skrebbel 13y ago
Oh come on. "Frontend" isn't a skill. It's a piece of software that makes interfacing with another piece of software easier. There have been frontends long before there was HTML.
- izolate 13y ago
  That's a fair point. I may have made the assumption that this was named after the skill.

bbx 13y ago

Although Frontend is impressive, the target market is a bit blurry. As a front-end developer, I don't see myself using such a tool. And non tech-savvy people would probably feel a bit overwhelmed and would still have issues designing a decent layout considering it's not their job. For some time, I've had in mind a service where people could easily build their websites. A bit like Squarespace (which is amazing) but with a different interface. For many clients who only need a homepage, a contact page, an about page, and some content pages, I usually end up building a custom WordPress theme because its admin interface is efficient and user-friendly, and because I have much experience in it. But still, I don't consider it the best tool for the job. I'm not a great programmer, but I have UI, UX, and front-end skills. I'll probably try to develop a workable draft of this app I have in mind, but if anyone is interested in building an easy-to-use platform for non tech-savvy people, feel free to contact me. I have some ideas about how the workflow should be and what features it should have.

coldarchon 13y ago
Target market? They "ship" their beta access and github only to the US. When they fail at the most basic cognitive skills, I won't waste my time to look deeper into this. About your app, if you are sure it is different from services like WIX and alike, I can help you.
madoublet 13y ago
I am working toward a similar goal with my open source project (respondcms.com): allow the developer/designer to focus on design while allowing the end-user to focus on creating content.
- marveller 13y ago
  I have been watching on this CMS for some time, great job!
  - madoublet 13y ago
    Thank you. It is always a work-in-progress, but it (hopefully) gets better with each release.

kanakiyajay 13y ago

1.How is it different from macaw or Adobe Muse ? 2.I did not understand why are you using a custom web framework xtyle , instead why not go for Bootstrap ?. Its already used by millions and you also save a lot of time. 3.Components feature sounds exciting , but how much similar is it to angular directives. 4.What is target market ? front-end developers or non-tech people?

dsego 13y ago
What is so f'ing special about bootstrap?
marizmelo 13y ago
Macaw and Muse are commercial tools. Frontend was created as an open-source alternative. We use xtyle by default, but you can for sure use Bootstrap (its your choice). Components are anything you can plugin on the system (including directives if you are an Angular developer). The target market are front-end developer, designers, and non-tech.

incimou 13y ago

What about https://rukzuk.com/en/ https://rukzuk.com/en/ ? Not open source but the only tool I found which has integrated CMS. Website says it's even extendable with custom code.

pter_s 13y ago
The video looks promising.
tmikaeld 13y ago
It's a really nice tool, but it's a SAAS - no go for us.

brickcap 13y ago

Nice. What technologies are you using to build Frontend?

jwarren 13y ago

Bro, do you even Bootstrap? Edit: Sorry, it's not Bootstrap, it's their own framework. Though visually it's very similar. But seriously, I'm not sure who this is for. It looks like there's quite a technical hurdle to setting it up - node.js and vagrant aren't easy to install for a novice user, and they aren't suitable for any shared hosting environment that I've come across. I imagine (possibly incorrectly) that the market for simple point and click interfaces wouldn't necessarily overlap with that of people who are comfortable setting up complex hosting environments. Now, as an online subscription model, I think it could be quite competitive. That's an entirely different route which definitely has a market.

marizmelo 13y ago
Hey jwarren. Thanks for the comment. Online system is definitely an option down the road. About the setup. Basically the only thing you need to install is vagrant. The Frontend VM has all the files and tools required to run the application on your machine. 1. Install Vagrant (with our installer); 2. Run VM 3. You are ready to go.

sycren 13y ago

The product looks amazing but the Kickstarter reward levels need to be rethought.

marizmelo 13y ago
I agree sycren. We are first timers on Kickstarter, but we will work on that. Thank you for the comment.

meerita 13y ago

This is Microsoft Frontpage all over again. I'm sure they will have market: people who don't have the money to contract serious developers, and some novel developers who may like this idea, but in the end, I think it's a product with few possibilities.

elsurudo 13y ago

Looks to me like it works pretty much just like Squarespace (except self-hosted and open). The way Squarespace makes it easy for non-web-designer folk to put together nice-looking websites is excellent, so it's a good model to work from.

marizmelo 13y ago

Hey everybody. Please give a second look over the project. We tried to make clear the differences between Frontend and the other options out there. Let us know about anything we can improve on the Kickstarter page. Thank you. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/emoriz/frontend-the-web-visual-editor http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/emoriz/frontend-the-web-...