8 ms·

While eating my second dinner plate of something delicious on the campus I looked around and saw how many children and families were around. The company provid

While eating my second dinner plate of something delicious on the campus I looked around and saw how many children and families were around. The company provides, so much, for you, for your family. You wouldn't to ever lose what you have now gotten used to, for yourself, for your family. So now you become a company man. What's good for the company must be good for you. What's good about knowing more people, how they think, how they behave, what they want, must be good for the company, which turn must be good for you, good for your family. It's just a series of intricate goodness being passed around from group to group, people to people. No one inherently is evil, but the system can end up be directed towards evil inevitably. Either way, it just was damn good pork chops with quinoa. We didn't get this kind of chow in the Marine Corps, and I would have killed for it.

chii 13y ago
tldr; the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
- DerpDerpDerp 13y ago
  Good intentions and creature comforts.
- ihsw 13y ago
  It's simpler than that -- bread and circuses. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bread_and_circuses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bread_and_circuses Calling it Hell detracts from the pragmatism of bread and circuses -- we are quite happy to compromise logic, ethics, and even our own personal feelings. Or, more interestingly, artificially creating public approval through diversion, distraction, and the satisfaction of immediate and shallow desires.
- Amadou 13y ago
  To add to the list of restatements: "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." --Upton Sinclair
davidgay 13y ago
From one of those googlers with children: I have to say I read a bit of the classic "people with children aren't like us" here - likely not intentional, but you may want to reread what you write more carefully for subtext.
- alaskamiller 13y ago
  Not sure what you mean but to your point, you are not like us. In a fire I grab my laptop and get out. You have your family. We're very much different. And likewise are taxed differently.
chrissnell 13y ago
I don't know if you served or if you were just alluding to it but your last point got me thinking: In the Army, I lived the most barebones kind of lifestyle and did a job that often put my family through hell but was buoyed by the feeling that I was part of the most noble of professions. In this industry, I've provided incredible privilege, comfort, and stability for my family but have always felt that this industry principally serves those who are a part of it.
- jcbrand 13y ago
  > always felt that this industry principally serves those who are a part of it So kinda like the Army as well? (i.e. Military-Industrial complex)
- vdaniuk 13y ago
  Is this sarcasm? Do you really consider being in the Army a noble profession? And do you think that the software industry serves humanity in general less than military industry?
  - Khaine 13y ago
    Serving one's country, and being willing to sacrifice oneself for the protection of others is noble. Did chat roulette enhance humanity? Was all the software thats been developed to enable spying and subjugation enhancing humanity?
  - nhangen 13y ago
    It's sad that the Armed Forces are now looked upon with disdain by hackers mere decades after the West wrested the world from Germany's grasp. Say what you want about the military industrial complex, but lets not forget that should any of our countries be invaded, we will be very grateful that those guns pointing at the invaders.
    - CWuestefeld 13y ago
      On the other hand, there's good reason to believe that terrorism is directed against us because we're continually pointing guns in their direction. Can it be that the military is both the problem and its own solution?
raverbashing 13y ago
"The company provides, so much, for you, for your family. You wouldn't to ever lose what you have now gotten used to, for yourself, for your family" Ah, the infamous golden cage At times like this I'm so glad I didn't join Google. And by join I mean I wasn't approved in their dysfunctional interview system.
- petercooper 13y ago
  We all live in cages, all that varies is how golden they are and how big they are.
  - raverbashing 13y ago
    Sure. But yeah, I'll take money and a healthier work/life balance than free laundry so I could stay 12h a day making something that people will hate but will drive their agenda.
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
  - coldtea 13y ago
    Which doesn't say much, if anything at all. Because if the cage has the area of Earth, then it might as well not exist at all. And if it's not gold at all, then you don't have any remorse trying to leave it behind (which is what "golden cage" conveys).
  - pron 13y ago
    Well, everything comes at a price, too.
- crusso 13y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fox_and_the_Grapes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fox_and_the_Grapes
  - raverbashing 13y ago
pron 13y ago
Google fascinates me. I think it is possibly the first organization in history that embodies concepts from dystopic fiction. Putting a real face to those dystopic ideas can give us a sense of what a true dystopia looks like (short answer: it looks deceptively nice; the horror reveals itself only on close inspection). You mention work. As you say, Google does not just want their employees' time. They want their complete identification with the company. In a way, they want their souls. As for business, Google is a company whose business model is tricking people into sharing as much private information with the company, and then using this information for profit. One of the most interesting things about Google is their "don't be evil" motto. I want to write a complete literary interpretation of it some other time, but here are the highlights. Obviously, it's a short and catchy motto that is not intended to be taken too seriously, but that does not preclude literary interpretation. First, let's consider the motto as a whole. It could be a motto for anyone, but how come it's Google's and not mine (or yours)? The reason is that they accept the premise that corporations do often turn out to be "evil" (whatever that means). This is analogous to the reason physicians swear to "do no harm"; they swear it because doctors can easily do harm. Now let's take the motto apart and analyze it word by word. First, the word "evil". The word assumes such a thing exists and can be recognizable. Second, the word "be". It implies that evil is something you are, not something you do. Lastly, the word "don't". It assumes that you can choose not to "be" "evil", and implies that those who "are" "evil" are so because they chose to be that way. If a motto can guide a corporation, and if this motto guides Google, we can see why they've become so monstrously terrifying. Evil is not always easily recognizable. Often, it's in the eyes of the beholder. Second, evil is rarely something you are, and almost always something you do. Third, "evil" creeps up on you, and is often the result of the best intentions. People other than James Bond villains don't choose to be evil. Similarly you can't simply choose not to be. To abstain from "evil" you must be vigilant. You must constantly analyze your actions and their consequences separately from your intentions, and listen to other viewpoints. Going back to dystopias, well known ones, like Orwell's 1984, insist that the masses love their oppressors rather than fear them. This is a crucial point that is largely overlooked when people discuss the NSA surveillance scandal. It is crucial because true power, absolute oppression, cannot exist if its wielder is generally considered suspect. When I read 1984 many years ago I couldn't understand that. Do people not notice that they're being manipulated and exploited? Can they actually enjoy being exploited? Now we have the answer.

chii 13y ago

tldr; the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

DerpDerpDerp 13y ago
Good intentions and creature comforts.
ihsw 13y ago
It's simpler than that -- bread and circuses. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bread_and_circuses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bread_and_circuses Calling it Hell detracts from the pragmatism of bread and circuses -- we are quite happy to compromise logic, ethics, and even our own personal feelings. Or, more interestingly, artificially creating public approval through diversion, distraction, and the satisfaction of immediate and shallow desires.
Amadou 13y ago
To add to the list of restatements: "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." --Upton Sinclair

davidgay 13y ago

From one of those googlers with children: I have to say I read a bit of the classic "people with children aren't like us" here - likely not intentional, but you may want to reread what you write more carefully for subtext.

alaskamiller 13y ago
Not sure what you mean but to your point, you are not like us. In a fire I grab my laptop and get out. You have your family. We're very much different. And likewise are taxed differently.

chrissnell 13y ago

I don't know if you served or if you were just alluding to it but your last point got me thinking: In the Army, I lived the most barebones kind of lifestyle and did a job that often put my family through hell but was buoyed by the feeling that I was part of the most noble of professions. In this industry, I've provided incredible privilege, comfort, and stability for my family but have always felt that this industry principally serves those who are a part of it.

jcbrand 13y ago
> always felt that this industry principally serves those who are a part of it So kinda like the Army as well? (i.e. Military-Industrial complex)
vdaniuk 13y ago
Is this sarcasm? Do you really consider being in the Army a noble profession? And do you think that the software industry serves humanity in general less than military industry?
- Khaine 13y ago
  Serving one's country, and being willing to sacrifice oneself for the protection of others is noble. Did chat roulette enhance humanity? Was all the software thats been developed to enable spying and subjugation enhancing humanity?
- nhangen 13y ago
  It's sad that the Armed Forces are now looked upon with disdain by hackers mere decades after the West wrested the world from Germany's grasp. Say what you want about the military industrial complex, but lets not forget that should any of our countries be invaded, we will be very grateful that those guns pointing at the invaders.
  - CWuestefeld 13y ago
    On the other hand, there's good reason to believe that terrorism is directed against us because we're continually pointing guns in their direction. Can it be that the military is both the problem and its own solution?

raverbashing 13y ago

"The company provides, so much, for you, for your family. You wouldn't to ever lose what you have now gotten used to, for yourself, for your family" Ah, the infamous golden cage At times like this I'm so glad I didn't join Google. And by join I mean I wasn't approved in their dysfunctional interview system.

petercooper 13y ago
We all live in cages, all that varies is how golden they are and how big they are.
- raverbashing 13y ago
  Sure. But yeah, I'll take money and a healthier work/life balance than free laundry so I could stay 12h a day making something that people will hate but will drive their agenda.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- coldtea 13y ago
  Which doesn't say much, if anything at all. Because if the cage has the area of Earth, then it might as well not exist at all. And if it's not gold at all, then you don't have any remorse trying to leave it behind (which is what "golden cage" conveys).
- pron 13y ago
  Well, everything comes at a price, too.
crusso 13y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fox_and_the_Grapes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fox_and_the_Grapes
- raverbashing 13y ago

pron 13y ago

Google fascinates me. I think it is possibly the first organization in history that embodies concepts from dystopic fiction. Putting a real face to those dystopic ideas can give us a sense of what a true dystopia looks like (short answer: it looks deceptively nice; the horror reveals itself only on close inspection). You mention work. As you say, Google does not just want their employees' time. They want their complete identification with the company. In a way, they want their souls. As for business, Google is a company whose business model is tricking people into sharing as much private information with the company, and then using this information for profit. One of the most interesting things about Google is their "don't be evil" motto. I want to write a complete literary interpretation of it some other time, but here are the highlights. Obviously, it's a short and catchy motto that is not intended to be taken too seriously, but that does not preclude literary interpretation. First, let's consider the motto as a whole. It could be a motto for anyone, but how come it's Google's and not mine (or yours)? The reason is that they accept the premise that corporations do often turn out to be "evil" (whatever that means). This is analogous to the reason physicians swear to "do no harm"; they swear it because doctors can easily do harm. Now let's take the motto apart and analyze it word by word. First, the word "evil". The word assumes such a thing exists and can be recognizable. Second, the word "be". It implies that evil is something you are, not something you do. Lastly, the word "don't". It assumes that you can choose not to "be" "evil", and implies that those who "are" "evil" are so because they chose to be that way. If a motto can guide a corporation, and if this motto guides Google, we can see why they've become so monstrously terrifying. Evil is not always easily recognizable. Often, it's in the eyes of the beholder. Second, evil is rarely something you are, and almost always something you do. Third, "evil" creeps up on you, and is often the result of the best intentions. People other than James Bond villains don't choose to be evil. Similarly you can't simply choose not to be. To abstain from "evil" you must be vigilant. You must constantly analyze your actions and their consequences separately from your intentions, and listen to other viewpoints. Going back to dystopias, well known ones, like Orwell's 1984, insist that the masses love their oppressors rather than fear them. This is a crucial point that is largely overlooked when people discuss the NSA surveillance scandal. It is crucial because true power, absolute oppression, cannot exist if its wielder is generally considered suspect. When I read 1984 many years ago I couldn't understand that. Do people not notice that they're being manipulated and exploited? Can they actually enjoy being exploited? Now we have the answer.