12 ms·

I quit my job, and I'm excited about a more independent life

170 points by basicallydan 13y ago

ajiang 13y ago
Congrats on making the leap! I've been waiting for the right time as well, and it has been too easy to continue kicking the can with reasons why not. I am curious on the 6 months of runway. Have you found how many months others save up?
- basicallydan 13y ago
  I did read a fair few other peoples' approaches. Some people said, "enough for a year", others said, "enough for 6 months" and some people said "enough for 2 years". To be honest, there's no one amount. I felt comfortable being riskier. My family was very supportive of my decision since they've all done similarly risky things in life. This made me feel comfortable going in knowing that if it all completely went tits-up, I'd probably have a branch to cling to. But this isn't something you should use as a motivator to chill out and be lazy. You need to find ways to support yourself, one way or the other, otherwise you've just moving from one dependence to another. Freelancing is a good place to start because it doesn't require complete dependence on somebody, and you can work on your own terms, and it helps to have a bunch of stuff you can say, "I did this thing" in case the time comes to get a job. Good luck in figuring out the right time for you :)
vikp 13y ago
Congratulations, man! I did this 2 years ago when I quit the US foreign service (really stable job) and decided to learn programming. It worked out really well for me, and I have done some incredible things that I never would have had a chance to do otherwise. It's not the easiest road, but you will have a great time, I am sure. Will definitely watch your blog for updates, and let me know if I can help at all.
- CuriousJack 13y ago
  Can you please elaborate on the programming from the scratch? Of course Codecademy is a great start, but what and how exactly did YOU start? Furthermore, what did you end up doing, where did you move from there and where you currently are? I quit my finance job few months back (hello to everyone) for non-tech related start-up. Not that I have a better pay (almost the same), but I have more free time and finished JS/Python courses on Codecademy. I just feel a little bit lost now and would appreciate some advice or story from the fellow explorer.
  - vikp 13y ago
    Hey, good question. I actually started out building stock prediction algorithms, then realized I had no idea how to do that (~October 2011). I was mainly coding in C# and Ruby, and picking it up from books. I then found Kaggle, which has a lot of great machine learning competitions. They will post something like "predict bond prices accurately", or "score essays automatically", and lots of people get to compete to create the best solution. The leaderboard format really motivated me, and I met some great people and did very well. I learned a lot of the stuff I needed from online books, Khan Academy, etc. Concurrently with Kaggle, I started a consulting business, and got a lot of clients through there. After I spent a lot of time doing machine learning, I was found by edX (edx.org), an online education company that was looking for people to develop ways to grade essays at scale. I thought I knew how to program before, but I actually didn't (I was coding mostly in R for Kaggle, and not using classes or building resuable code, etc). At edX, I actually learned how to test/deploy and develop properly. I also ended up doing 99% web development, which is fine, as I learned that skill, but got a bit bored due to not using machine learning at all. I learned Python, Django (the main web framework), and a lot of server deployment and other skills. I can't emphasize how invaluable working at a startup that did things the right way was in terms of my learning. I recently left edX to work on some of my own projects. Currently, I am working on an android application, Happsee (www.happsee.com) that helps track, visualize, and discover what makes us happy (and can do a lot of cool machine learning with). I have also worked on an open source learning management system, Movide (www.movide.com). The key for me to learn programming is to de-emphasize the programming. I don't actually care much about programming. I care about making things. I get a similar joy from snapping legos together and making something and from coding. So find a problem you want to solve, and start thinking of things you could make to solve that problem. For me, data is insanely cool, and I have done a lot of random explorations on my blog. I just did an analysis of happiness (http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/what-makes-people-happy/ http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/what-makes-people-happy/), but I have also analyzed how much characters on the Simpsons like each other (http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/how-do-simpsons-characters-feel-about-each-other/ http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/how-do-simpsons-characters-feel...). Small projects like that are a great way to learn, and can get you exposure through presentations, blog, etc. If you have any questions, I'm happy to help. vik at equirio dot com.
xwowsersx 13y ago
I'm always interested in reading about how people have managed to gain some personal and financial independence. But I find it hard to relate to this article. I guess if you have the runway to just sit around and discover what it is you really want do, then cool. But there's no real plan here, just "oh maybe I'll do freelancing too..yeah that sounds good." Maybe I've just been fortunate, but I've always worked in jobs where I feel I'm getting paid to learn skills that I know will be highly valuable whenever I decide to do something on my own. And I try to work on my own stuff, putting in 10-15 hours a week while still working a full-time job. I'd love to just leave my job, but I don't see why setting aside some solid hours each week isn't enough to get something off the ground. So, unless you're absolutely miserable in your job you shouldn't just leave it unless there's actually some other "thing" you're working on that actually requires your full-time attention. Again, maybe a lot of this post just reflects a sort of path of personal discovery, but it's hard for me to relate to. To me, the lesson is more about finding a job that is fulfilling enough and still leaves you enough time to work on your other stuff with the hopes that your other projects can eventually become self-sustaining and lead you to greater personal and financial independence.
- basicallydan 13y ago
  Hey xwowsersx! I hear your concerns, thanks for sharing them with me. So, don't worry: I'm not just sitting around. I've been working on a small side project which is nearing completion, and I have another couple that I'd like to start. Plus, there's another long-term project I would like to do as a learning exercise in game design & development over the course of a few weeks. I should be able to get some time for that very soon. Furthermore, I'm a busker on the London Underground, which some people do for a full-time job and I hope to dedicate more time to (I have a financial goal there, too) which includes learning new songs and becoming a better performer. Finally, I do have a short-term (3-4 weeks) freelance project which is looking to be greenlighted coming up, which in itself will also be a learning opportunity. The point is, there's loads of learning happening - and I'm really excited about all of that! "I'd love to just leave my job, but I don't see why setting aside some solid hours each week isn't enough to get something off the ground." - I did this for about a year and a half and I just don't find it satisfying anymore, but I think part of that was because of the job I had. It could be that this is just a short path of personal discovery, and I quickly change my mind - but I kind of want to find out for myself. For a long time, the whole "But Dan, you don't have a startup that is taking up more time than you can handle right now!" thing bugged me but the truth was, a large part of me wanted to quit for a whole multitude of other reasons, which I hope I have expressed somehow, at least between the lines. Anyway, everybody has their own path. Mine, perhaps, seems a bit foolhardy at times, but I've been through some rough patches in life and come out the other side a better person, so even if this turns out to be a huge mistake, I do hope I look back at it and say, "well, that was a useful learning experience." But I don't think it will be a huge mistake ;) Thanks again, I appreciate the realistic viewpoint and honest opinion.
dsowers 13y ago
Loved the post. I'm in the exact same position as you. Have 6 months of runway and I've become an independent consultant. I'm also spending the time on my own ideas, like my newly launched https://www.silvrback.com https://www.silvrback.com I wish you the best of luck. Like you said, life is too short not to take risks.
- basicallydan 13y ago
  That's awesome! Good job with Silvrback, and thanks :)
davidsmith8900 13y ago
- I hope, pray and wish you the best.
- basicallydan 13y ago
  Me too! Thanks David.
dkokelley 13y ago
I'm close to that point at my current job, too. I feel like I learned lots, but that the learning and growth has plateaued for me, so it's time to move on. I would love to just announce my leave and head out in uncertain waters, but I have a rule that I always have to be moving towards something I want, rather than away from something I dislike. Leaving because I am unhappy with the work would break that rule (to my dismay). From one Dan to another (Danny, actually), I wish you luck, and I hope you succeed in finding what you want to move towards!
- basicallydan 13y ago
  That's a good rule, Danny. I hope it serves you well, as mine do me :) Thanks for the kind words!
- crixlet 13y ago
  > moving towards something I want, rather than away from something I dislike. I loved this.
- websitescenes 13y ago
  Such an important and hard lesson to learn.
kamakazizuru 13y ago
congratulations :) good luck with whatever comes next!
enraged_camel 13y ago
What makes me bitter is not having this type of freedom as an H1B worker. For all intents and purposes, I'm a slave to my employer. Sure, I could quit at any time, but that would mean having to go back to my home country, which I have no intention of doing. The USA is just a better place for all sorts of things. Will I be able to maintain my sanity until I get my green card? I have no idea. I've already become quite bitter and cynical about my job. I don't have anyone to look up to, the work is not challenging and the company is grossly mismanaged. If anyone has any advice, I'm all ears...
- auctiontheory 13y ago
  Start a company on the side. There's never been a better (easier) time. Can you start a company while you are in the US on an H1B? (Obviously, many people do.) There seem to be two schools of thought about whether this is legal with the IRS - research it, and maybe talk to a street smart immigration lawyer. What if the company you start isn't actually incorporated, but is a side project allowing you to expand the skills you will need as a startup CEO - funded by the cash flow from your job? Or perhaps your company is incorporated outside the US? Also, for anyone dissatisfied at work, I highly recommend the test at JOCRF.org. It's well worth the money. Source: I've been in your shoes, and this is the advice I wish someone had given to the younger me.
  - NhanH 13y ago
    Do you have any more specific resources on the matter? I've got a lot of hearsay from researching but it's quite hard to know exactly what's wrong and what's not - it seems like there are more speculation than advices from people who have actually done it. And why would it be a problem with the IRS? I would have thought the main road block would be from USCIS.
  - enraged_camel 13y ago
    I looked into this and it is illegal. Basically the law quite specifically says that while you can start a company, you cannot work for it, because your H1B explicitly prohibits income streams outside of the company that sponsored your visa. So if you start a company, you can only be a completely passive investor (meaning you would need a co-founder to act as managing partner/CEO). At first I thought the "income" part is a potential loophole, but then I asked around and was told that doing the work at no pay (under the guise of "volunteering") is also not allowed. Trust me, starting a company is my plan when I get my Green Card. Until then, I'm trapped.
stana 13y ago
Good luck. It could be 6 months you will never forget regardless of what happens in 6 months. Many work really hard chasing elusive goals and forget to enjoy today.
ux-app 13y ago
It's great that the author has taken the plunge and I hope things work out well for him. I'd caution others away from such a drastic move though. 6 Months is an incredibly short amount of runway to go from 0 to paying your bills by "starting, and finishing new projects". My own experience was similar. I had a secure job with a good salary, but something was missing (first world problems). I was looking for new challenges and quitting my day job seemed like the best way to live the dream. I'm risk averse, so instead of quitting, I talked to my boss and arranged 6 months leave without pay. It turned out to be the best decision I could have made. Even though I had experience with building a couple of larger side projects in the past, I drastically underestimated how long it would take to finish my first project. The 80/20 rule is no joke (might even be closer to 90/10). To top things off our hot water heater needed replacing and a roof leak led to some emergency renovation work. By the end of my 6months leave I had a 90% finished product (great!!) and a $10k credit card debt (not great). It's been a year since I took leave, and even though development has slowed down, I shudder to think how things would have turned out if I had quit.
- basicallydan 13y ago
  I'm sorry to hear about your debt and hot water heater. I do hope that such stuff doesn't happen to me, and believe me I did not take this decision lightly. I think even if shit hits the fan, I hopefully will still be okay. Thanks for your good wishes.
- lhnz 13y ago
  This was fairly similar to my experience - 4 months into my time off I received a letter from the government saying that due to a problem with my employer last year I owed them thousands of pounds of tax. I might not be that risk adverse but this shocked me, and as soon as you see the end of your runway it becomes difficult to concentrate on a startup. Also, London is expensive, remember that. Edit: I will rinse and repeat but I definitely recommend getting a product to MVP stage before cutting your cord, as well as also having the necessary funds for this funemployment strategy to make sense - are you expecting to immediately start making enough money from the project to bootstrap it or are you going to go and get investment with your team? Also I recommend getting into the habit of being honest and quantitative with yourself, which means getting into the habit of knocking out an excel document for your own living expenses and the commercial viability of any ideas you have. Personally, I found myself ultimately fighting far too many battles many of which I was untested in, creating an iOS prototype while: sitting in cafes running customer development (I spoke to at least 50+ people), arranging meetings with people in the industry I wanted to disrupt, trying to attract the attention of Angels that I had connections to, getting my friends to help out with design/tech work, etc. It's a hard game and probably worth it for the experience. Something I realised was that you can't be perfectly self-sufficient - you might be an A player at a couple of things and a quick learner in others (which is how I felt) but you're going to be trying to hold so many things together that you will need a structure that supports you: finance, friendship, focus, partners. I fragilized myself by not being fully prepared for this - and also didn't have the financial situation to bide my time. There are pools of water in the desert but you need enough water to reach them.
MichaelTieso 13y ago
That's awesome. I can relate to this story. I quit my job around 5 years ago because I was unhappy with what I was doing. I took the planning very serious and paid off all my debt and saved enough money to travel around the world for a year while just working freelance and running various businesses I was starting. After five years though I'm finding that I work way harder and much longer hours than I was working at an office. It's almost impossible to ever open my laptop and not work. I miss that when I got to work, I worked, and when I went home, I didn't. I don't have that luxury anymore. But I have a ton of other awesome perks. I can live anywhere in the world so I generally live in places where the dollar goes a long way. It's been a pretty incredible experience.
robbiea 13y ago
Congratulations! I made a similar jump about 20 months ago. My only advice to you is to keep doing the freelance gig thing on the side, as I see you are doing based on your comments. The things I've learned about surviving: 1) As one commenter said, 6 months is basically no time at all. It will FLY by. Launching your side project to a state where you are comfortable with the project or can at least try it out in the market will take about 6 months. 2) For Freelance gigs - People will only pay you for what you're good at and you have experience in. It's no different than finding a real job. No one will pay you for what you think you are good at, if you don't have proven experience in it. This is good to know if you get in a money crunch. Always go back to your real strengths and the money will follow. 3) Always plan for Plan B. Build your professional network weekly if not daily in the industry where companies are willing to hire you if this venture doesn't work out for you. 4) It will take you at least 3 months to find a job once you start looking, assuming you have the right marketable skills. It shouldn't take that long, but it does. Plan accordingly. 5) You will need help about 3 months from now. You'll be lost as you try to find yourself. Don't be afraid to ask someone for guidance. You could be asking someone you met in Austin or someone you met recently. You never know. 6) Start a personal / professional mailing list. Allow people to have an insight into what you are doing. People like this kind of stuff. This allows you to stay in touch with lots of people fairly easily. 7) You never know. Jason fried wrote an inc article I believe about how he ended up writing for inc through a series of events & connections. Keep an open mind as I think you are doing now, and keep your relationships up to date.
steveridout 13y ago
Congratulations! I quit my job about 19 months ago and had the luck to get immediately re-hired by my former employer as a freelancer for a few months on a much higher rate (http://steveridout.com/2012/12/30/a-welcome-delay.html http://steveridout.com/2012/12/30/a-welcome-delay.html). This, combined with living in Madrid now instead of London, has given me enough runway to live cheaply for another 2 years if needed. I've been working on my current SAAS project http://readlang.com http://readlang.com for 11 months now and despite showing a lot of promise it's still not even ramen profitable. I'm still feeling very hopeful about it though and while it's looking promising have every intention to follow through to see where it leads. May write a blog post about this as it approaches it's 1st birthday. I'd say your 6 months is on the short side for creating and selling a product of your own, and would recommend you try to find consulting gigs to save up some more money first if this is the road you're considering. If you just meander and hop between a bunch of projects for a few months I fear that in 5 months time you'll be looking to take for a normal job again, perhaps running back to your old company! (I've actually done this before - I took a year off with no plan, didn't focus on a project, and ended up re-joining the same job I'd left.) Anyway, good luck, look forward to see what you can create!
- vendakka 13y ago
  This is exactly what I was looking for! I recently moved to Germany and I'm learning German and I'd love to do it through reading. I was about to sit down and patch together an epub reader to do this, but now I don't have to. Here's some feedback if you'd like it :) I just subscribed to the $9.99 per year version. However, I was mentally preparing myself to pay more, since it was very useful. I would have liked to try it out for longer though. The most useful part of it were the multi-word/phrase translations and I could only try out a very small number before it popped up the "subscribe" notification. So to sum up, I signed up because it was just $10 a year, but would have paid more if I'd gotten to try it out for a short while longer. All the best!
  - steveridout 13y ago
    Thanks, yes I'm always very happy to get feedback, especially from paying customers :) The current pricing is partly an experiment to see if people will pay, and it turns out that 1 in 30 of those who sign up do at the moment. It's also to ensure that if the site explodes in popularity I won't lose money through Google Translate API costs. I plan to increase the price at some point (but not for current subscribers) although not sure what it should be exactly. What would you think of $4/month or $30/year options? I'll think about increasing the 20/day phrase limit, I really need to dig into my analytics a bit more to see what the usage patterns are on this. Roughly how long did it take you to reach the limit and how much longer would you have liked? Thanks again!
mtgx 13y ago
Any chance we'll see Android support Go officially in the next 2-3 years?
- dualogy 13y ago
  Wrong thread, huh?
josscrowcroft 13y ago
Congrats on taking the leap, enjoyed the post a lot. I did this almost 2 years ago, and never looked back - as soon as I fully committed myself to life without a job, https://openexchangerates.org https://openexchangerates.org took on a life of its own and remains my primary focus. FYI, it took about 8 months to start making money (could have been much sooner, but I dragged my feet a lot) and another 6 months from first paying customer to totally covering my lifestyle and making enough to reinvest. If you'd be interested, we have some freelance engineering tasks coming up - shoot me an email (josscrowcroft at gmail) and we can discuss further. I'm in London for a few more weeks at least.
kimonos 13y ago
Great! Life is about risk-taking and discovering the things you love to do. When you follow your passion, then you become more inspired and more satisfied in life..
iblaine 13y ago
>I wasn’t totally happy with the way my job was going. This needs more clarification. Everyone, as in every single person on this planet, has reservations from time to time about their job. That is normal. What is not normal is quitting for fleeting reasons. And I think that's a symptom of hipsters the days. More kids are growing up with helicopter parents and told they are the best at everything they do. Those same kids get a mid life crisis at 25. Quitting your job because I am not 'totally happy' with your job sounds like an irresponsible decision.
- thebigkick 13y ago
  In many ways, I totally agree with this. It is very dangerous advice to go around and tell people to "work less, live more", or "quit your job, go live life". This isn't a one size fits all message (I'm not saying the OP is giving out advice. Or saying he thinks everyone should follow suit. He is simply telling his story, which I found to be a very interesting and enjoyable read.) I got where I am at because I work(ed) my balls off. Late, Late nights and grinding out solutions to problems in coffee shops and hours and hours of reading and hacking. The "Rework" approach comes with a huge caveat lector! However, I wish this guy the best of luck. More jobs for the poor, smart, and hungry...
- JoeAltmaier 13y ago
  If they are responsible only to themselves, and have money in the bank, then there is no 'irresponsibility' in the equation at all. Some folks value 'safe' corporate jobs. Others make their own way. In America, 50% of us work for ourselves. Its not crazy or irresponsible; its normal here to not have a corporate job.
  - cag_ii 13y ago
    > In America, 50% of us work for ourselves. Do you have a citation for this? It sounds very high to me, and the most recent info. I could find with the BLS[1] puts that number closer to 11%. [1] PDF - 2009: http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2010/09/art2full.pdf http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2010/09/art2full.pdf
moron4hire 13y ago
So, you're going to go through some changes. Be ready to forget what weekends mean. You'll probably start getting frustrated with weekends, because you'll wonder "where the hell did all of these people come from?". I highly suggest adopting an alternate wake/sleep schedule. Or rather, I highly suggest not resisting the change away from the "normal" 9-to-5 schedule that everyone else accepts upon them. I personally went to bed at sunrise and got up around noon. I also put work at the end of my day, rather than the beginning, which allowed me to pay attention to my health in a way I've never been able to accomplish otherwise. You have no reason to work their schedule, yet you'll end up A) getting stuck in their lines and traffic, B) paying their restaurant/bar/movie rates, and C) missing out on one of two amazing worlds: extreme late night or extreme early morning. The people you will meet there will be the most fascinatingly unconventional people in the world and they will inspire you to do great things. The fact that you are on this journey probably means you're one of them anyway. Go find your people. The people of the night are a close-knit community and help each other out in ways you can't imagine. Now that I'm married, that doesn't work out too well, but I'm working on getting her to eventually be able to take the night as well :P You'll probably end up working constantly. Learn how to take a day off: honest-to-goodness unproductive time (it takes you out of the fight-or-flight mode and gives your body a chance to recover). You probably won't be able to stand more than one day of it, as you'll get antsy and start feeling a need to make something. But it's necessary to unwind. Play video games all day. Go to the zoo. Watch movies. See your friends. Don't think you can extend your runway with credit cards. You can't extend a blanket by cutting off the tail and sewing it to the top. Stay open to opportunities. Make sure you keep meeting people. People are where the opportunities come from. Nobody is going to hunt you down and give you a chance. It's better to take part-time work that pays the bills than it is to take full-time work that gives you lots of disposable income. Your time is far more valuable than anything any employer will be willing to give you. That's kind of the point, if your time were actually worth $80,000/yr, then they'd probably only hire you at minimum wage. Keep your time for yourself. If you live in a big city, you might be able to get by on bartending in a popular place on weekends. It's better than sitting in a cubicle farm. You probably won't make it. Unfortunately, 6 months just isn't that much time. Oh, I think it's enough time to build just about anything, if the resolve is there and the freedom to work however you want (work tends to fill the time you give it, and most slowness in projects is the bureaucracy from which you are now free). But you'll learn that there is a lot more to making a project happen than the build phase. For example, if you haven't done any marketing yet, before the product is complete, you're already very behind schedule. You'll have to learn how to do all of those things that aren't programming, because otherwise you won't know what to look for to hire an effective person to do it for real. That doesn't mean the time isn't worth while, but you need to know how to use it wisely and not become despondent if/when you finally cave and get a "real job." Use this time to learn as much as you can. Specifically, try to learn about yourself, i.e. how to motivate yourself to work on a consistent and regular schedule, how to get yourself out of ruts. You'll learn what you're capable of pulling off, even when you weren't sure what to do at the beginning. And if you do "fail", pick up the pieces, dust yourself off, and get ready to try again. This experience will change you. Try to let it change you as much as possible.
avalaunch 13y ago
As many others mentioned, six months isn't a lot of time so my actionable advice is to do everything you can to increase that runway while maintaining the independence you crave. I suggest ranking your ideas based on three criteria: how long they'll take to build, the likelihood that they'll produce an income stream, and the amount of ongoing maintenance and effort it'll take from you if the idea seems to be working. Find the one with the best ratio of the 3 (easy to build and likely to make passive money) and build that first. Also, I recommend you give yourself a hard deadline for launching each idea you work on. It's incredibly hard to launch. It's much easier to push back the launch date so that you can put in just one more killer feature, tweak the look and feel just a little bit, and get that copy perfect. It's much better however to just launch and improve as you go. It's a lot easier to determine which features are actually the killer features when you introduce them one at a time instead of all at once. Once you set a date and time to launch, stick to it no matter what. You can always improve on your idea and launch again. The generally held belief that you only get 1 launch is a fallacy. If the first launch goes poorly, nobody will realize you launched twice anyway. Obviously how long you should give yourself to launch your idea varies on the idea itself but I highly recommend something absurdly short - like this time tomorrow. That's enough time to put together an minimally viable product. Plus it would make for a catchy title when submitting to HN. Good luck with your adventure!
pjbrunet 13y ago
Be excited. Call me after 10 years of that ;-)
- dualogy 13y ago
  Truth. One does get used to this, once you got it working, fairly quickly. Still wouldn't go back to a regular 9-5 but that's because they're 80% not really more interesting than going it alone + some fair amount of travelling.
eriksank 13y ago
You have made a devastating OPSEC mistake. You have disclosed that you have around 6 months left of money. You have probably also stored it in just one bank account. If some weird transactions end up siphoning off your balance, you will have no money left to defend yourself. The secret service guys know this. The freelance crook at the bank knows this too. Be careful or you will be toast.
- semjacobs 13y ago
  Good luck
- Tyrannosaurs 13y ago
  Tinfoil hat on a little tight this morning?
- sebkomianos 13y ago
  Can someone explain the above to me? My english fails me.
jlees 13y ago
I did exactly this in July. My colleagues and friends were surprised that I didn't have something else lined up, but I needed to take a full break from the 9-5 world. Funnily enough I had about 6 months of runway too. Several comments in this thread have mentioned how it's hard to get a side project to profitability in 6 months, but that's really not the only route to a sustainable lifestyle. Freelancing, consulting and other income streams (hurrah for busking!) are all perfectly good ways to try out new projects, learn or improve skills, and bring in some cold hard cash. I've personally found that far more doors are opening for me now I'm open-minded, available, and willing to have conversations. When I was equated with the tech company I worked for, people would not have approached me about the things they do now, and I certainly wouldn't have considered some of the things I'm considering! It's taken a few months but I'm happy with where things are going, excited about the various projects I'm doing, perfectly satisfied not to have a complete prototype of a fundable startup idea yet, and definitely still overwhelmed at the sheer amount of branching futures ahead of me. Good luck!
- basicallydan 13y ago
  Hey jlees, I totally agree about being open-minded and not being attached to a company. It could (and already has) opened up doors for me which I didn't realise were there, which is hugely exciting. I think the mistake a few people in this thread are making (although I do really appreciate the advice) is that I am trying ti build a business. I may end up trying to do that, but that is not the goal in mind here :) Thanks for the good luck!
durkie 13y ago
wow -- surprised at all the folks that just quit their jobs recently. We've got quite an HN job-quitting support group. i also just quit in june of this year and it's a big change. i've always been motivated to work on projects on my own, but going to absolutely zero supervision (and zero income) took a lot of getting used to. it's easy to get paralyzed thinking that you need to work constantly and you end up not having fun even though you're super free (for a little bit) and have a really flexible schedule. we're personally having our official launch at a trade show next week...it's going to be a real moment of truth for us and i'm kind of terrified. good luck!
wiradikusuma 13y ago
"Now, here I am, sitting in a coffee shop in Islington with no fixed income, no employer, and no startup which I’ve just received seed funding for: just me, my laptop, and a bunch of ideas" Where did you receive the seed funding from? I was hoping your post would be some sort of roadmap, but I miss that part.
- guynamedloren 13y ago
  I could be mistaken, but I believe he's saying he doesn't have a seed funded startup.
  - wiradikusuma 13y ago
    You're right. I read too fast and I thought "I have roughly 6 months of runway funds" means "I have seed funding for 6 months." Thanks for the correction.
    - basicallydan 13y ago
      Aw, crap. Word fail from me there. Thank you Loren.
altero 13y ago
I did this and it was great way to fuck myself. My wife was sick, so I have no other option but to quit and bootstrapped my consultancy business from home. - most of my friends were in work, so I lost those - zero unemployment support + paying health insurance from your own pocket. If you are bootstrapping and need some decent runway, this matters (especially in EU) - Big hole in your CV - if you stay in metropolitan expensive area, your savings will run out fast... - traveling while bootstrapping? you can pick only one - if you never worked from home, your productivity and working habits will sink like a rock I think better way is to gradually prepare yourself while working. Start some open-source stuff. Learn new language at your work. Do standup comedy over evenings, whatever. Also try to bargain with (or blackmail) your boss. Workers who are actually qualified, are rare and generally underpaid. Retention is HUGE problem. You could start side project at work, with silent agreement from your boss. You could get work from home (and build working habits for your startup). You could even get location independence for reduced salary.
- dualogy 13y ago
  > traveling while bootstrapping? you can pick only one Decidedly not true. Probably you feel that way due to your situation, sick wife etc.
- sebkomianos 13y ago
  - You only socialised with your friends when at work? - I am sure you can have some, even minimal, support as an unemployed person in the UK. - Big hole in his CV, one of the most exciting times in his real life? - True, but he knows what he wants to do so he 'll have to play with those rules. - Maybe true. - You can't say, he might be more productive from home. Hope your wife is okay now or getting better!
pearjuice 13y ago
So what if you don't have any ideas about a different life but hate 9 to 5? When I would take off I would immediately miss the feeling of doing something actually productive because I have nothing else but my job. Does this make me stupid or just uninspired?
- basicallydan 13y ago
  Neither, really - it just means you haven't tried doing other things with your life. You might find that once you have that freedom you do all sorts of cool and fun stuff with you time which you, ultimately, consider productive.
tnjm 13y ago
I did precisely the same thing last month. I had a great job, challenging and meaningful work, but there was something missing. Here's my experience six weeks in. I found enough freelance work pretty much immediately to pay my bills, and didn't have to drop my rates. That said, my wife has a successful small business, and I have over a year's runway, so there's much less pressure. It forced me to become more 'social', and attend meetups (including HN London) and other events. Although I'm getting some work through meetups, the major benefit is in staving off the loneliness you may get from working remotely/at home/from a coffee shop. Coming from working in a great team, my experience is this hits you hard. Meeting lots of new clients and potential clients has been seriously fun. I wasn't expecting that. I even dipped my toe in Elance, which has been a surprisingly positive experience so far. I've never been busier or more motivated. I wake at 5.30am but now walk the dog, make time for my wife and take time out to explicitly learn new things when I like, not when a schedule dictates. That alone was worth quitting. My advice, for whatever it's worth, is to be rigid about dedicating 'off' time. (No mobile!) Even just half a day a week has safeguarded my mental health so far, and it's very, very easy to skip it. I've been able to work on my startup[0] a good three days a week, as well as launching a couple of other smaller side projects already. If possible, I strongly recommend having a big project so you feel like you've got an anchor, and can make forward progress whenever you're at a loose end and you might otherwise be checking HN. Quitting full-time work has been the best decision I've ever made. [0] http://databasify.com http://databasify.com
SideburnsOfDoom 13y ago
On the one hand I feel a gut reaction "you fool!" for leaving a secure, stable paying job with good people (Huddle are just around the corner from here, I know some of them). On the other hand, I hope you do something great with it!
benmorris 13y ago
I left my job a good paying job a little over a year ago after building up about a year of savings. The work environment had deteriorated a lot since starting there and honestly I was to the point the money wasn't even worth it. So probably worse off than the author says. A year later I can say I haven't regretted it at all. Keeping up on freelancing has really been my key to keeping a positive cash flow while working on my long term projects. I rarely turn down any web/consulting work, unless it has serious red flags. The thing is about a startup project is that it might take a while to get going. Some things I launched a year ago have just now really shown the work I put into them was worth it. Balancing time where work stops and relaxing starts can be difficult when you are on your own. There is always something to do hanging over your head. I've had to be disciplined on this to avoid burning out. I spent a fair amount of time doing accounting, projects bringing in money, clients paying, monthly invoices, etc, it does consume a non trivial amount of time each week. My one concern in the article though is quitting without a plan. I had a pretty concrete plan which I'm still moving towards.
known 13y ago
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man." --George Bernard Shaw

170 points by basicallydan 13y ago

Congrats on making the leap! I've been waiting for the right time as well, and it has been too easy to continue kicking the can with reasons why not. I am curious on the 6 months of runway. Have you found how many months others save up?

basicallydan 13y ago
I did read a fair few other peoples' approaches. Some people said, "enough for a year", others said, "enough for 6 months" and some people said "enough for 2 years". To be honest, there's no one amount. I felt comfortable being riskier. My family was very supportive of my decision since they've all done similarly risky things in life. This made me feel comfortable going in knowing that if it all completely went tits-up, I'd probably have a branch to cling to. But this isn't something you should use as a motivator to chill out and be lazy. You need to find ways to support yourself, one way or the other, otherwise you've just moving from one dependence to another. Freelancing is a good place to start because it doesn't require complete dependence on somebody, and you can work on your own terms, and it helps to have a bunch of stuff you can say, "I did this thing" in case the time comes to get a job. Good luck in figuring out the right time for you :)

vikp 13y ago

Congratulations, man! I did this 2 years ago when I quit the US foreign service (really stable job) and decided to learn programming. It worked out really well for me, and I have done some incredible things that I never would have had a chance to do otherwise. It's not the easiest road, but you will have a great time, I am sure. Will definitely watch your blog for updates, and let me know if I can help at all.

CuriousJack 13y ago
Can you please elaborate on the programming from the scratch? Of course Codecademy is a great start, but what and how exactly did YOU start? Furthermore, what did you end up doing, where did you move from there and where you currently are? I quit my finance job few months back (hello to everyone) for non-tech related start-up. Not that I have a better pay (almost the same), but I have more free time and finished JS/Python courses on Codecademy. I just feel a little bit lost now and would appreciate some advice or story from the fellow explorer.
- vikp 13y ago
  Hey, good question. I actually started out building stock prediction algorithms, then realized I had no idea how to do that (~October 2011). I was mainly coding in C# and Ruby, and picking it up from books. I then found Kaggle, which has a lot of great machine learning competitions. They will post something like "predict bond prices accurately", or "score essays automatically", and lots of people get to compete to create the best solution. The leaderboard format really motivated me, and I met some great people and did very well. I learned a lot of the stuff I needed from online books, Khan Academy, etc. Concurrently with Kaggle, I started a consulting business, and got a lot of clients through there. After I spent a lot of time doing machine learning, I was found by edX (edx.org), an online education company that was looking for people to develop ways to grade essays at scale. I thought I knew how to program before, but I actually didn't (I was coding mostly in R for Kaggle, and not using classes or building resuable code, etc). At edX, I actually learned how to test/deploy and develop properly. I also ended up doing 99% web development, which is fine, as I learned that skill, but got a bit bored due to not using machine learning at all. I learned Python, Django (the main web framework), and a lot of server deployment and other skills. I can't emphasize how invaluable working at a startup that did things the right way was in terms of my learning. I recently left edX to work on some of my own projects. Currently, I am working on an android application, Happsee (www.happsee.com) that helps track, visualize, and discover what makes us happy (and can do a lot of cool machine learning with). I have also worked on an open source learning management system, Movide (www.movide.com). The key for me to learn programming is to de-emphasize the programming. I don't actually care much about programming. I care about making things. I get a similar joy from snapping legos together and making something and from coding. So find a problem you want to solve, and start thinking of things you could make to solve that problem. For me, data is insanely cool, and I have done a lot of random explorations on my blog. I just did an analysis of happiness (http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/what-makes-people-happy/ http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/what-makes-people-happy/), but I have also analyzed how much characters on the Simpsons like each other (http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/how-do-simpsons-characters-feel-about-each-other/ http://vikparuchuri.com/blog/how-do-simpsons-characters-feel...). Small projects like that are a great way to learn, and can get you exposure through presentations, blog, etc. If you have any questions, I'm happy to help. vik at equirio dot com.

xwowsersx 13y ago

I'm always interested in reading about how people have managed to gain some personal and financial independence. But I find it hard to relate to this article. I guess if you have the runway to just sit around and discover what it is you really want do, then cool. But there's no real plan here, just "oh maybe I'll do freelancing too..yeah that sounds good." Maybe I've just been fortunate, but I've always worked in jobs where I feel I'm getting paid to learn skills that I know will be highly valuable whenever I decide to do something on my own. And I try to work on my own stuff, putting in 10-15 hours a week while still working a full-time job. I'd love to just leave my job, but I don't see why setting aside some solid hours each week isn't enough to get something off the ground. So, unless you're absolutely miserable in your job you shouldn't just leave it unless there's actually some other "thing" you're working on that actually requires your full-time attention. Again, maybe a lot of this post just reflects a sort of path of personal discovery, but it's hard for me to relate to. To me, the lesson is more about finding a job that is fulfilling enough and still leaves you enough time to work on your other stuff with the hopes that your other projects can eventually become self-sustaining and lead you to greater personal and financial independence.

basicallydan 13y ago
Hey xwowsersx! I hear your concerns, thanks for sharing them with me. So, don't worry: I'm not just sitting around. I've been working on a small side project which is nearing completion, and I have another couple that I'd like to start. Plus, there's another long-term project I would like to do as a learning exercise in game design & development over the course of a few weeks. I should be able to get some time for that very soon. Furthermore, I'm a busker on the London Underground, which some people do for a full-time job and I hope to dedicate more time to (I have a financial goal there, too) which includes learning new songs and becoming a better performer. Finally, I do have a short-term (3-4 weeks) freelance project which is looking to be greenlighted coming up, which in itself will also be a learning opportunity. The point is, there's loads of learning happening - and I'm really excited about all of that! "I'd love to just leave my job, but I don't see why setting aside some solid hours each week isn't enough to get something off the ground." - I did this for about a year and a half and I just don't find it satisfying anymore, but I think part of that was because of the job I had. It could be that this is just a short path of personal discovery, and I quickly change my mind - but I kind of want to find out for myself. For a long time, the whole "But Dan, you don't have a startup that is taking up more time than you can handle right now!" thing bugged me but the truth was, a large part of me wanted to quit for a whole multitude of other reasons, which I hope I have expressed somehow, at least between the lines. Anyway, everybody has their own path. Mine, perhaps, seems a bit foolhardy at times, but I've been through some rough patches in life and come out the other side a better person, so even if this turns out to be a huge mistake, I do hope I look back at it and say, "well, that was a useful learning experience." But I don't think it will be a huge mistake ;) Thanks again, I appreciate the realistic viewpoint and honest opinion.

dsowers 13y ago

Loved the post. I'm in the exact same position as you. Have 6 months of runway and I've become an independent consultant. I'm also spending the time on my own ideas, like my newly launched https://www.silvrback.com https://www.silvrback.com I wish you the best of luck. Like you said, life is too short not to take risks.

basicallydan 13y ago
That's awesome! Good job with Silvrback, and thanks :)

davidsmith8900 13y ago

- I hope, pray and wish you the best.

basicallydan 13y ago
Me too! Thanks David.

dkokelley 13y ago

I'm close to that point at my current job, too. I feel like I learned lots, but that the learning and growth has plateaued for me, so it's time to move on. I would love to just announce my leave and head out in uncertain waters, but I have a rule that I always have to be moving towards something I want, rather than away from something I dislike. Leaving because I am unhappy with the work would break that rule (to my dismay). From one Dan to another (Danny, actually), I wish you luck, and I hope you succeed in finding what you want to move towards!

basicallydan 13y ago
That's a good rule, Danny. I hope it serves you well, as mine do me :) Thanks for the kind words!
crixlet 13y ago
> moving towards something I want, rather than away from something I dislike. I loved this.
websitescenes 13y ago
Such an important and hard lesson to learn.

kamakazizuru 13y ago

congratulations :) good luck with whatever comes next!

enraged_camel 13y ago

What makes me bitter is not having this type of freedom as an H1B worker. For all intents and purposes, I'm a slave to my employer. Sure, I could quit at any time, but that would mean having to go back to my home country, which I have no intention of doing. The USA is just a better place for all sorts of things. Will I be able to maintain my sanity until I get my green card? I have no idea. I've already become quite bitter and cynical about my job. I don't have anyone to look up to, the work is not challenging and the company is grossly mismanaged. If anyone has any advice, I'm all ears...

auctiontheory 13y ago
Start a company on the side. There's never been a better (easier) time. Can you start a company while you are in the US on an H1B? (Obviously, many people do.) There seem to be two schools of thought about whether this is legal with the IRS - research it, and maybe talk to a street smart immigration lawyer. What if the company you start isn't actually incorporated, but is a side project allowing you to expand the skills you will need as a startup CEO - funded by the cash flow from your job? Or perhaps your company is incorporated outside the US? Also, for anyone dissatisfied at work, I highly recommend the test at JOCRF.org. It's well worth the money. Source: I've been in your shoes, and this is the advice I wish someone had given to the younger me.
- NhanH 13y ago
  Do you have any more specific resources on the matter? I've got a lot of hearsay from researching but it's quite hard to know exactly what's wrong and what's not - it seems like there are more speculation than advices from people who have actually done it. And why would it be a problem with the IRS? I would have thought the main road block would be from USCIS.
- enraged_camel 13y ago
  I looked into this and it is illegal. Basically the law quite specifically says that while you can start a company, you cannot work for it, because your H1B explicitly prohibits income streams outside of the company that sponsored your visa. So if you start a company, you can only be a completely passive investor (meaning you would need a co-founder to act as managing partner/CEO). At first I thought the "income" part is a potential loophole, but then I asked around and was told that doing the work at no pay (under the guise of "volunteering") is also not allowed. Trust me, starting a company is my plan when I get my Green Card. Until then, I'm trapped.

stana 13y ago

Good luck. It could be 6 months you will never forget regardless of what happens in 6 months. Many work really hard chasing elusive goals and forget to enjoy today.

ux-app 13y ago

It's great that the author has taken the plunge and I hope things work out well for him. I'd caution others away from such a drastic move though. 6 Months is an incredibly short amount of runway to go from 0 to paying your bills by "starting, and finishing new projects". My own experience was similar. I had a secure job with a good salary, but something was missing (first world problems). I was looking for new challenges and quitting my day job seemed like the best way to live the dream. I'm risk averse, so instead of quitting, I talked to my boss and arranged 6 months leave without pay. It turned out to be the best decision I could have made. Even though I had experience with building a couple of larger side projects in the past, I drastically underestimated how long it would take to finish my first project. The 80/20 rule is no joke (might even be closer to 90/10). To top things off our hot water heater needed replacing and a roof leak led to some emergency renovation work. By the end of my 6months leave I had a 90% finished product (great!!) and a $10k credit card debt (not great). It's been a year since I took leave, and even though development has slowed down, I shudder to think how things would have turned out if I had quit.

basicallydan 13y ago
I'm sorry to hear about your debt and hot water heater. I do hope that such stuff doesn't happen to me, and believe me I did not take this decision lightly. I think even if shit hits the fan, I hopefully will still be okay. Thanks for your good wishes.
lhnz 13y ago
This was fairly similar to my experience - 4 months into my time off I received a letter from the government saying that due to a problem with my employer last year I owed them thousands of pounds of tax. I might not be that risk adverse but this shocked me, and as soon as you see the end of your runway it becomes difficult to concentrate on a startup. Also, London is expensive, remember that. Edit: I will rinse and repeat but I definitely recommend getting a product to MVP stage before cutting your cord, as well as also having the necessary funds for this funemployment strategy to make sense - are you expecting to immediately start making enough money from the project to bootstrap it or are you going to go and get investment with your team? Also I recommend getting into the habit of being honest and quantitative with yourself, which means getting into the habit of knocking out an excel document for your own living expenses and the commercial viability of any ideas you have. Personally, I found myself ultimately fighting far too many battles many of which I was untested in, creating an iOS prototype while: sitting in cafes running customer development (I spoke to at least 50+ people), arranging meetings with people in the industry I wanted to disrupt, trying to attract the attention of Angels that I had connections to, getting my friends to help out with design/tech work, etc. It's a hard game and probably worth it for the experience. Something I realised was that you can't be perfectly self-sufficient - you might be an A player at a couple of things and a quick learner in others (which is how I felt) but you're going to be trying to hold so many things together that you will need a structure that supports you: finance, friendship, focus, partners. I fragilized myself by not being fully prepared for this - and also didn't have the financial situation to bide my time. There are pools of water in the desert but you need enough water to reach them.

MichaelTieso 13y ago

That's awesome. I can relate to this story. I quit my job around 5 years ago because I was unhappy with what I was doing. I took the planning very serious and paid off all my debt and saved enough money to travel around the world for a year while just working freelance and running various businesses I was starting. After five years though I'm finding that I work way harder and much longer hours than I was working at an office. It's almost impossible to ever open my laptop and not work. I miss that when I got to work, I worked, and when I went home, I didn't. I don't have that luxury anymore. But I have a ton of other awesome perks. I can live anywhere in the world so I generally live in places where the dollar goes a long way. It's been a pretty incredible experience.

robbiea 13y ago

Congratulations! I made a similar jump about 20 months ago. My only advice to you is to keep doing the freelance gig thing on the side, as I see you are doing based on your comments. The things I've learned about surviving: 1) As one commenter said, 6 months is basically no time at all. It will FLY by. Launching your side project to a state where you are comfortable with the project or can at least try it out in the market will take about 6 months. 2) For Freelance gigs - People will only pay you for what you're good at and you have experience in. It's no different than finding a real job. No one will pay you for what you think you are good at, if you don't have proven experience in it. This is good to know if you get in a money crunch. Always go back to your real strengths and the money will follow. 3) Always plan for Plan B. Build your professional network weekly if not daily in the industry where companies are willing to hire you if this venture doesn't work out for you. 4) It will take you at least 3 months to find a job once you start looking, assuming you have the right marketable skills. It shouldn't take that long, but it does. Plan accordingly. 5) You will need help about 3 months from now. You'll be lost as you try to find yourself. Don't be afraid to ask someone for guidance. You could be asking someone you met in Austin or someone you met recently. You never know. 6) Start a personal / professional mailing list. Allow people to have an insight into what you are doing. People like this kind of stuff. This allows you to stay in touch with lots of people fairly easily. 7) You never know. Jason fried wrote an inc article I believe about how he ended up writing for inc through a series of events & connections. Keep an open mind as I think you are doing now, and keep your relationships up to date.

steveridout 13y ago

Congratulations! I quit my job about 19 months ago and had the luck to get immediately re-hired by my former employer as a freelancer for a few months on a much higher rate (http://steveridout.com/2012/12/30/a-welcome-delay.html http://steveridout.com/2012/12/30/a-welcome-delay.html). This, combined with living in Madrid now instead of London, has given me enough runway to live cheaply for another 2 years if needed. I've been working on my current SAAS project http://readlang.com http://readlang.com for 11 months now and despite showing a lot of promise it's still not even ramen profitable. I'm still feeling very hopeful about it though and while it's looking promising have every intention to follow through to see where it leads. May write a blog post about this as it approaches it's 1st birthday. I'd say your 6 months is on the short side for creating and selling a product of your own, and would recommend you try to find consulting gigs to save up some more money first if this is the road you're considering. If you just meander and hop between a bunch of projects for a few months I fear that in 5 months time you'll be looking to take for a normal job again, perhaps running back to your old company! (I've actually done this before - I took a year off with no plan, didn't focus on a project, and ended up re-joining the same job I'd left.) Anyway, good luck, look forward to see what you can create!

vendakka 13y ago
This is exactly what I was looking for! I recently moved to Germany and I'm learning German and I'd love to do it through reading. I was about to sit down and patch together an epub reader to do this, but now I don't have to. Here's some feedback if you'd like it :) I just subscribed to the $9.99 per year version. However, I was mentally preparing myself to pay more, since it was very useful. I would have liked to try it out for longer though. The most useful part of it were the multi-word/phrase translations and I could only try out a very small number before it popped up the "subscribe" notification. So to sum up, I signed up because it was just $10 a year, but would have paid more if I'd gotten to try it out for a short while longer. All the best!
- steveridout 13y ago
  Thanks, yes I'm always very happy to get feedback, especially from paying customers :) The current pricing is partly an experiment to see if people will pay, and it turns out that 1 in 30 of those who sign up do at the moment. It's also to ensure that if the site explodes in popularity I won't lose money through Google Translate API costs. I plan to increase the price at some point (but not for current subscribers) although not sure what it should be exactly. What would you think of $4/month or $30/year options? I'll think about increasing the 20/day phrase limit, I really need to dig into my analytics a bit more to see what the usage patterns are on this. Roughly how long did it take you to reach the limit and how much longer would you have liked? Thanks again!

mtgx 13y ago

Any chance we'll see Android support Go officially in the next 2-3 years?

dualogy 13y ago
Wrong thread, huh?

josscrowcroft 13y ago

Congrats on taking the leap, enjoyed the post a lot. I did this almost 2 years ago, and never looked back - as soon as I fully committed myself to life without a job, https://openexchangerates.org https://openexchangerates.org took on a life of its own and remains my primary focus. FYI, it took about 8 months to start making money (could have been much sooner, but I dragged my feet a lot) and another 6 months from first paying customer to totally covering my lifestyle and making enough to reinvest. If you'd be interested, we have some freelance engineering tasks coming up - shoot me an email (josscrowcroft at gmail) and we can discuss further. I'm in London for a few more weeks at least.

kimonos 13y ago

Great! Life is about risk-taking and discovering the things you love to do. When you follow your passion, then you become more inspired and more satisfied in life..

iblaine 13y ago

>I wasn’t totally happy with the way my job was going. This needs more clarification. Everyone, as in every single person on this planet, has reservations from time to time about their job. That is normal. What is not normal is quitting for fleeting reasons. And I think that's a symptom of hipsters the days. More kids are growing up with helicopter parents and told they are the best at everything they do. Those same kids get a mid life crisis at 25. Quitting your job because I am not 'totally happy' with your job sounds like an irresponsible decision.

thebigkick 13y ago
In many ways, I totally agree with this. It is very dangerous advice to go around and tell people to "work less, live more", or "quit your job, go live life". This isn't a one size fits all message (I'm not saying the OP is giving out advice. Or saying he thinks everyone should follow suit. He is simply telling his story, which I found to be a very interesting and enjoyable read.) I got where I am at because I work(ed) my balls off. Late, Late nights and grinding out solutions to problems in coffee shops and hours and hours of reading and hacking. The "Rework" approach comes with a huge caveat lector! However, I wish this guy the best of luck. More jobs for the poor, smart, and hungry...
JoeAltmaier 13y ago
If they are responsible only to themselves, and have money in the bank, then there is no 'irresponsibility' in the equation at all. Some folks value 'safe' corporate jobs. Others make their own way. In America, 50% of us work for ourselves. Its not crazy or irresponsible; its normal here to not have a corporate job.
- cag_ii 13y ago
  > In America, 50% of us work for ourselves. Do you have a citation for this? It sounds very high to me, and the most recent info. I could find with the BLS[1] puts that number closer to 11%. [1] PDF - 2009: http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2010/09/art2full.pdf http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2010/09/art2full.pdf

moron4hire 13y ago

So, you're going to go through some changes. Be ready to forget what weekends mean. You'll probably start getting frustrated with weekends, because you'll wonder "where the hell did all of these people come from?". I highly suggest adopting an alternate wake/sleep schedule. Or rather, I highly suggest not resisting the change away from the "normal" 9-to-5 schedule that everyone else accepts upon them. I personally went to bed at sunrise and got up around noon. I also put work at the end of my day, rather than the beginning, which allowed me to pay attention to my health in a way I've never been able to accomplish otherwise. You have no reason to work their schedule, yet you'll end up A) getting stuck in their lines and traffic, B) paying their restaurant/bar/movie rates, and C) missing out on one of two amazing worlds: extreme late night or extreme early morning. The people you will meet there will be the most fascinatingly unconventional people in the world and they will inspire you to do great things. The fact that you are on this journey probably means you're one of them anyway. Go find your people. The people of the night are a close-knit community and help each other out in ways you can't imagine. Now that I'm married, that doesn't work out too well, but I'm working on getting her to eventually be able to take the night as well :P You'll probably end up working constantly. Learn how to take a day off: honest-to-goodness unproductive time (it takes you out of the fight-or-flight mode and gives your body a chance to recover). You probably won't be able to stand more than one day of it, as you'll get antsy and start feeling a need to make something. But it's necessary to unwind. Play video games all day. Go to the zoo. Watch movies. See your friends. Don't think you can extend your runway with credit cards. You can't extend a blanket by cutting off the tail and sewing it to the top. Stay open to opportunities. Make sure you keep meeting people. People are where the opportunities come from. Nobody is going to hunt you down and give you a chance. It's better to take part-time work that pays the bills than it is to take full-time work that gives you lots of disposable income. Your time is far more valuable than anything any employer will be willing to give you. That's kind of the point, if your time were actually worth $80,000/yr, then they'd probably only hire you at minimum wage. Keep your time for yourself. If you live in a big city, you might be able to get by on bartending in a popular place on weekends. It's better than sitting in a cubicle farm. You probably won't make it. Unfortunately, 6 months just isn't that much time. Oh, I think it's enough time to build just about anything, if the resolve is there and the freedom to work however you want (work tends to fill the time you give it, and most slowness in projects is the bureaucracy from which you are now free). But you'll learn that there is a lot more to making a project happen than the build phase. For example, if you haven't done any marketing yet, before the product is complete, you're already very behind schedule. You'll have to learn how to do all of those things that aren't programming, because otherwise you won't know what to look for to hire an effective person to do it for real. That doesn't mean the time isn't worth while, but you need to know how to use it wisely and not become despondent if/when you finally cave and get a "real job." Use this time to learn as much as you can. Specifically, try to learn about yourself, i.e. how to motivate yourself to work on a consistent and regular schedule, how to get yourself out of ruts. You'll learn what you're capable of pulling off, even when you weren't sure what to do at the beginning. And if you do "fail", pick up the pieces, dust yourself off, and get ready to try again. This experience will change you. Try to let it change you as much as possible.

avalaunch 13y ago

As many others mentioned, six months isn't a lot of time so my actionable advice is to do everything you can to increase that runway while maintaining the independence you crave. I suggest ranking your ideas based on three criteria: how long they'll take to build, the likelihood that they'll produce an income stream, and the amount of ongoing maintenance and effort it'll take from you if the idea seems to be working. Find the one with the best ratio of the 3 (easy to build and likely to make passive money) and build that first. Also, I recommend you give yourself a hard deadline for launching each idea you work on. It's incredibly hard to launch. It's much easier to push back the launch date so that you can put in just one more killer feature, tweak the look and feel just a little bit, and get that copy perfect. It's much better however to just launch and improve as you go. It's a lot easier to determine which features are actually the killer features when you introduce them one at a time instead of all at once. Once you set a date and time to launch, stick to it no matter what. You can always improve on your idea and launch again. The generally held belief that you only get 1 launch is a fallacy. If the first launch goes poorly, nobody will realize you launched twice anyway. Obviously how long you should give yourself to launch your idea varies on the idea itself but I highly recommend something absurdly short - like this time tomorrow. That's enough time to put together an minimally viable product. Plus it would make for a catchy title when submitting to HN. Good luck with your adventure!

pjbrunet 13y ago

Be excited. Call me after 10 years of that ;-)

dualogy 13y ago
Truth. One does get used to this, once you got it working, fairly quickly. Still wouldn't go back to a regular 9-5 but that's because they're 80% not really more interesting than going it alone + some fair amount of travelling.

eriksank 13y ago

You have made a devastating OPSEC mistake. You have disclosed that you have around 6 months left of money. You have probably also stored it in just one bank account. If some weird transactions end up siphoning off your balance, you will have no money left to defend yourself. The secret service guys know this. The freelance crook at the bank knows this too. Be careful or you will be toast.

semjacobs 13y ago
Good luck
Tyrannosaurs 13y ago
Tinfoil hat on a little tight this morning?
sebkomianos 13y ago
Can someone explain the above to me? My english fails me.

jlees 13y ago

I did exactly this in July. My colleagues and friends were surprised that I didn't have something else lined up, but I needed to take a full break from the 9-5 world. Funnily enough I had about 6 months of runway too. Several comments in this thread have mentioned how it's hard to get a side project to profitability in 6 months, but that's really not the only route to a sustainable lifestyle. Freelancing, consulting and other income streams (hurrah for busking!) are all perfectly good ways to try out new projects, learn or improve skills, and bring in some cold hard cash. I've personally found that far more doors are opening for me now I'm open-minded, available, and willing to have conversations. When I was equated with the tech company I worked for, people would not have approached me about the things they do now, and I certainly wouldn't have considered some of the things I'm considering! It's taken a few months but I'm happy with where things are going, excited about the various projects I'm doing, perfectly satisfied not to have a complete prototype of a fundable startup idea yet, and definitely still overwhelmed at the sheer amount of branching futures ahead of me. Good luck!

basicallydan 13y ago
Hey jlees, I totally agree about being open-minded and not being attached to a company. It could (and already has) opened up doors for me which I didn't realise were there, which is hugely exciting. I think the mistake a few people in this thread are making (although I do really appreciate the advice) is that I am trying ti build a business. I may end up trying to do that, but that is not the goal in mind here :) Thanks for the good luck!

durkie 13y ago

wow -- surprised at all the folks that just quit their jobs recently. We've got quite an HN job-quitting support group. i also just quit in june of this year and it's a big change. i've always been motivated to work on projects on my own, but going to absolutely zero supervision (and zero income) took a lot of getting used to. it's easy to get paralyzed thinking that you need to work constantly and you end up not having fun even though you're super free (for a little bit) and have a really flexible schedule. we're personally having our official launch at a trade show next week...it's going to be a real moment of truth for us and i'm kind of terrified. good luck!

wiradikusuma 13y ago

"Now, here I am, sitting in a coffee shop in Islington with no fixed income, no employer, and no startup which I’ve just received seed funding for: just me, my laptop, and a bunch of ideas" Where did you receive the seed funding from? I was hoping your post would be some sort of roadmap, but I miss that part.

guynamedloren 13y ago
I could be mistaken, but I believe he's saying he doesn't have a seed funded startup.
- wiradikusuma 13y ago
  You're right. I read too fast and I thought "I have roughly 6 months of runway funds" means "I have seed funding for 6 months." Thanks for the correction.
  - basicallydan 13y ago
    Aw, crap. Word fail from me there. Thank you Loren.

altero 13y ago

I did this and it was great way to fuck myself. My wife was sick, so I have no other option but to quit and bootstrapped my consultancy business from home. - most of my friends were in work, so I lost those - zero unemployment support + paying health insurance from your own pocket. If you are bootstrapping and need some decent runway, this matters (especially in EU) - Big hole in your CV - if you stay in metropolitan expensive area, your savings will run out fast... - traveling while bootstrapping? you can pick only one - if you never worked from home, your productivity and working habits will sink like a rock I think better way is to gradually prepare yourself while working. Start some open-source stuff. Learn new language at your work. Do standup comedy over evenings, whatever. Also try to bargain with (or blackmail) your boss. Workers who are actually qualified, are rare and generally underpaid. Retention is HUGE problem. You could start side project at work, with silent agreement from your boss. You could get work from home (and build working habits for your startup). You could even get location independence for reduced salary.

dualogy 13y ago
> traveling while bootstrapping? you can pick only one Decidedly not true. Probably you feel that way due to your situation, sick wife etc.
sebkomianos 13y ago
- You only socialised with your friends when at work? - I am sure you can have some, even minimal, support as an unemployed person in the UK. - Big hole in his CV, one of the most exciting times in his real life? - True, but he knows what he wants to do so he 'll have to play with those rules. - Maybe true. - You can't say, he might be more productive from home. Hope your wife is okay now or getting better!

pearjuice 13y ago

So what if you don't have any ideas about a different life but hate 9 to 5? When I would take off I would immediately miss the feeling of doing something actually productive because I have nothing else but my job. Does this make me stupid or just uninspired?

basicallydan 13y ago
Neither, really - it just means you haven't tried doing other things with your life. You might find that once you have that freedom you do all sorts of cool and fun stuff with you time which you, ultimately, consider productive.

tnjm 13y ago

I did precisely the same thing last month. I had a great job, challenging and meaningful work, but there was something missing. Here's my experience six weeks in. I found enough freelance work pretty much immediately to pay my bills, and didn't have to drop my rates. That said, my wife has a successful small business, and I have over a year's runway, so there's much less pressure. It forced me to become more 'social', and attend meetups (including HN London) and other events. Although I'm getting some work through meetups, the major benefit is in staving off the loneliness you may get from working remotely/at home/from a coffee shop. Coming from working in a great team, my experience is this hits you hard. Meeting lots of new clients and potential clients has been seriously fun. I wasn't expecting that. I even dipped my toe in Elance, which has been a surprisingly positive experience so far. I've never been busier or more motivated. I wake at 5.30am but now walk the dog, make time for my wife and take time out to explicitly learn new things when I like, not when a schedule dictates. That alone was worth quitting. My advice, for whatever it's worth, is to be rigid about dedicating 'off' time. (No mobile!) Even just half a day a week has safeguarded my mental health so far, and it's very, very easy to skip it. I've been able to work on my startup[0] a good three days a week, as well as launching a couple of other smaller side projects already. If possible, I strongly recommend having a big project so you feel like you've got an anchor, and can make forward progress whenever you're at a loose end and you might otherwise be checking HN. Quitting full-time work has been the best decision I've ever made. [0] http://databasify.com http://databasify.com

SideburnsOfDoom 13y ago

On the one hand I feel a gut reaction "you fool!" for leaving a secure, stable paying job with good people (Huddle are just around the corner from here, I know some of them). On the other hand, I hope you do something great with it!

benmorris 13y ago

I left my job a good paying job a little over a year ago after building up about a year of savings. The work environment had deteriorated a lot since starting there and honestly I was to the point the money wasn't even worth it. So probably worse off than the author says. A year later I can say I haven't regretted it at all. Keeping up on freelancing has really been my key to keeping a positive cash flow while working on my long term projects. I rarely turn down any web/consulting work, unless it has serious red flags. The thing is about a startup project is that it might take a while to get going. Some things I launched a year ago have just now really shown the work I put into them was worth it. Balancing time where work stops and relaxing starts can be difficult when you are on your own. There is always something to do hanging over your head. I've had to be disciplined on this to avoid burning out. I spent a fair amount of time doing accounting, projects bringing in money, clients paying, monthly invoices, etc, it does consume a non trivial amount of time each week. My one concern in the article though is quitting without a plan. I had a pretty concrete plan which I'm still moving towards.

known 13y ago

"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man." --George Bernard Shaw