4 ms·

As a former chemical engineer, I agree with your gf's classmates. In late 90s, I was working on an advanced chemical manufacturing process control project with

by akg_67 13y ago

As a former chemical engineer, I agree with your gf's classmates. In late 90s, I was working on an advanced chemical manufacturing process control project with a team of software developers. I found out they were getting paid twice as much as me and they were half as productive as me (they knew nothing about manufacturing, chemicals and process control) and I was twice as stressed as them. The best decision I made was to dump chemical industry for technology industry soon after ... Never regretted.

chii 13y ago
lol, so what were those software engineers being paid for!?
chetanahuja 13y ago
"technology industry"?
kabouseng 13y ago
Or you could have moved to the petrochemical industry, where you would have been paid more than any software engineer anywhere...
- nostrademons 13y ago
  Is that really true? This article [1] lists a top 10% petrochemical engineer's salary as $146,000. A fairly skilled senior software engineer at, say, Google can easily pull in $250-300K in total comp, and a programmer on Wall Street or independent consultant with good domain knowledge in wealthy industries like banking can pull in $300-500K/year. That's not even counting talent acquisitions, which can go for $1M/engineer/year. [1] http://work.chron.com/salary-petrochemical-engineer-4334.html http://work.chron.com/salary-petrochemical-engineer-4334.htm...
  - eof 13y ago
    yeah but those wallst and google jobs are not top 10%.. probably closer to top .5%
- kabouseng 13y ago
  @Nostrademons Ok clearly I am out of touch then. But seriously, how many SE really gets paid 250k+, even at Google? Quants is in my mind the same as the petrochemical industry tough, rediculous salaries so that one I can believe.
  - gohrt 13y ago
    Ones with about ~10 years good industry experience, or with several years of good Google experience+equity.
- akg_67 13y ago
  Actually, it was petrochemical company, one of the largest. And no, petrochemical industry doesn't pay much more than software profession. Comparing with my friends who are still doing ChE jobs, If I was still in petrochemical, I most probably be getting paid little less than what I am being paid now, but working much more harder, longer and more stressed.
bonemachine 13y ago
Our salaries aren't a scam, per se. Just a reflection of a market equilibrium condition driven by classic rent-seeking dynamics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent-seeking which don't apply as much to lower-demand professional categories. Which isn't to say we aren't worth it; I'd like to think we are. Just that we often delude ourselves into thinking that our salary differential is linearly correlated with the economic "value" we generate. It isn't. Or rather: the "value" of an engineer is a lot like the value of an apartment in a high-rent neighborhood: the price holds in the market because, well, you have to have it, and at (almost) any cost in order to do all the other stuff you need to do, like get around the city and be close to your job. You also have to have access to food and safe drinking water -- even much more than you need a convenient or semi-stylish apartment. The priority for these isn't just a bit higher: it's categorically higher. Yet their base cost (i.e. the cost to obtain them at nominally satisfactory level) is an order of magnitude less than the cost of your rent. The distinguishing factor between the two classes of goods is, of course, scarcity. That is why your rent is damn high.[1] And that's why an average software developer can earn twice as much as a decent chemical engineer, and an ungodly multiple of what a great public school teacher makes. [1] Along with the fact that high-demand apartments -- like high-demand engineers -- are also, arguably, Veblen goods in some markets: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good

by akg_67 13y ago

chii 13y ago

lol, so what were those software engineers being paid for!?

chetanahuja 13y ago

"technology industry"?

kabouseng 13y ago

Or you could have moved to the petrochemical industry, where you would have been paid more than any software engineer anywhere...

nostrademons 13y ago
Is that really true? This article [1] lists a top 10% petrochemical engineer's salary as $146,000. A fairly skilled senior software engineer at, say, Google can easily pull in $250-300K in total comp, and a programmer on Wall Street or independent consultant with good domain knowledge in wealthy industries like banking can pull in $300-500K/year. That's not even counting talent acquisitions, which can go for $1M/engineer/year. [1] http://work.chron.com/salary-petrochemical-engineer-4334.html http://work.chron.com/salary-petrochemical-engineer-4334.htm...
- eof 13y ago
  yeah but those wallst and google jobs are not top 10%.. probably closer to top .5%
kabouseng 13y ago
@Nostrademons Ok clearly I am out of touch then. But seriously, how many SE really gets paid 250k+, even at Google? Quants is in my mind the same as the petrochemical industry tough, rediculous salaries so that one I can believe.
- gohrt 13y ago
  Ones with about ~10 years good industry experience, or with several years of good Google experience+equity.
akg_67 13y ago
Actually, it was petrochemical company, one of the largest. And no, petrochemical industry doesn't pay much more than software profession. Comparing with my friends who are still doing ChE jobs, If I was still in petrochemical, I most probably be getting paid little less than what I am being paid now, but working much more harder, longer and more stressed.

bonemachine 13y ago

Our salaries aren't a scam, per se. Just a reflection of a market equilibrium condition driven by classic rent-seeking dynamics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent-seeking which don't apply as much to lower-demand professional categories. Which isn't to say we aren't worth it; I'd like to think we are. Just that we often delude ourselves into thinking that our salary differential is linearly correlated with the economic "value" we generate. It isn't. Or rather: the "value" of an engineer is a lot like the value of an apartment in a high-rent neighborhood: the price holds in the market because, well, you have to have it, and at (almost) any cost in order to do all the other stuff you need to do, like get around the city and be close to your job. You also have to have access to food and safe drinking water -- even much more than you need a convenient or semi-stylish apartment. The priority for these isn't just a bit higher: it's categorically higher. Yet their base cost (i.e. the cost to obtain them at nominally satisfactory level) is an order of magnitude less than the cost of your rent. The distinguishing factor between the two classes of goods is, of course, scarcity. That is why your rent is damn high.[1] And that's why an average software developer can earn twice as much as a decent chemical engineer, and an ungodly multiple of what a great public school teacher makes. [1] Along with the fact that high-demand apartments -- like high-demand engineers -- are also, arguably, Veblen goods in some markets: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good