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Why is there so little non-porn advertising on porn sites? If CPMs are low, and conversions are good enough, what's up with the ROI gap? Is this really the cost

Why is there so little non-porn advertising on porn sites? If CPMs are low, and conversions are good enough, what's up with the ROI gap? Is this really the cost of social outrage? I'm really curious to see if anyone has any theories/answers...

corin_ 13y ago
A lot of it is "social outrage", but not necessarily actual outrage. I'm a marketing person, I enjoy porn, but I won't advertise on porn sites because a.) I don't want to position brands next to it and b.) Even if I did, people in companies I represent would raise the same issue. But there's no "outrage" from myself, for sure. There are other reasons too. For example, porn sites are known for shitty advertising (popups, popunders, accidental clicks, etc.) so people like me who haven't researched it at all think firstly are these techniques required to get good results from porn sites (I don't want to use them) and secondly will my adverts be assumed to be shitty just by their placement next to other shitty adverts?
- volokoumphetico 13y ago
  if you've spoofed your referral links, how would they ever know?
  - corin_ 13y ago
    I don't lie to my clients about where I spend their money - and even if I wanted to, I wouldn't manage to do it without them noticing.
    - volokoumphetico 13y ago
      that's all good and fine on paper but seriously, how would they ever know that the new add for McDonald's new menu item appeared beside hurrdrurr.com/the-one-with-midget-horse-and-tall-lady.html
      - corin_ 13y ago
        There's a lot of clever tracking tools in the world
  - L_Rahman 13y ago
    There's a possibility that the client may be a user of the porn site where he advertises.
    - dboat 13y ago
      More likely he's referring to the services people use to see where on the internet their ads are being displayed.
    - volokoumphetico 13y ago
      but who would ever admit to it? Gee, I was trying to jerk off to some porn yesterday and I found our ad on the site.
fixxer 13y ago
yeah, I was thinking that too. Must be the fear of negative stigma (we're a bunch of puritans...). Be kind of funny if a mainstream company (McD's) put a hilarious add that only showed on a porn site and suddenly everyone was talking about it in the office environment...
eykanal 13y ago
It's association risk. Coke, IBM, Citibank... name any corporation large enough to buy internet ad space at volume, and you can almost guarantee that the company in question doesn't want to be associated with pornography.
- throwaway2120 13y ago
  Maybe Coke IBM and Citibank are the wrong brands, but why not a brand that tries to eek sex, like Axe, or most beer companies? Am i crazy for thinking that being loosely associated with sex/porn would be great for many businesses?
  - patmcc 13y ago
    Couple things there: Axe is owned by Unilever, who also makes brands like Dove - they might not want the press of "owners of Dove advertise on shock porn sites" or whatever. Axe might be ok with being associated with "two sexy people going at it in a traditional way" type porn, but not "bunch of funny looking people having 'strange' sex" type porn, and discriminating between the two might not be worth their time and effort. Axe is probably bought, at least partly, by moms for their young teenage sons - who might not take kindly to actual sex being that tied to their advertising. Take a look at how they currently advertise - it's sex, but with a goofy/comedic slant. Think the ads with the astronauts - those are legitimately funny.
  - ryanmcbride 13y ago
    Because we still live in a sex negative society that likes to pretend that no one actually likes sex, and porn is only for people unable to find significant others.
jonnathanson 13y ago
A big reason, which the Eat24 article sort of delves into, is use case. If most porn viewers are watching between 7pm and 3am, those are fantastic hours for a food delivery service; they might be shitty hours for a lot of other products or services. (Though I'd imagine they would make great hours, and porn great ad inventory, for impulse-buy products). As others have mentioned, brand association is another big factor. Probably the biggest factor. Most mainstream companies are extremely (ahem) anal about where their brands pop up.
speeder 13y ago
I wanted to, but in my company case we cannot risk it at all, even 4chan was banned by the CEO... We make games for children aged around 5 years old... If we advertise that at a porn site, beside probably missing our target market, we risk people making those huge outraged internet firestorms that after 4 republications by blogs and newspapers will result into people concluding I am a pedophile.
- tekromancr 13y ago
  That was probably a smart call.
- corin_ 13y ago
  So.. why did you want to advertise your game for five year olds on porn sites?
  - dagw 13y ago
    Lots of visitors to porn sites have 5 year old children?
ffn 13y ago
Most companies don't want to be associated with pr0n...especially big companies whose market base depends soccer moms and children
Gustomaximus 13y ago
I was working for a bank and an ad slipped through our list of advertisers to be featured on a porn site. A journalist picked up on this and there was 'outrage' within and outside the bank. It was amazing seeing how upset people were. We had to do a massive audit and white list all future ad sites we used. Personally I felt if you choose to be at a porn site why are you offended at a credit card being there? I'd be more embarrassed being caught watching a Sandra Bullock movie...which of course I've never done. I wished the bank put a tongue in cheek press release saying to the journalist 'what were you doing there'. But in the real world we apologise and pretend these sites don't exist.
- pbhjpbhj 13y ago
  Actually a bank advert offering [pseudo-]anonymous CC payment services would fit in the space well - from an advertising perspective - wouldn't it. I say pseudo because I'm [paranoid and] almost certain that even if you pay cash then someone somewhere has your face connected to that transaction and it's only a security service select query and face-recognition pass away from being ID'ed as you.
steveklabnik 13y ago
It doesn't even need to be straight-up porn: while lots of 4chan is porn, a lot of it isn't, and they've had a hard time finding enough advertisers to keep the lights on.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
nraynaud 13y ago
I think (not sure) there are investor rules too. Like VC -> no link to porn.
rdl 13y ago
Divorce lawyers and maybe holidays to places with presumed-available people might also be popular.

corin_ 13y ago

A lot of it is "social outrage", but not necessarily actual outrage. I'm a marketing person, I enjoy porn, but I won't advertise on porn sites because a.) I don't want to position brands next to it and b.) Even if I did, people in companies I represent would raise the same issue. But there's no "outrage" from myself, for sure. There are other reasons too. For example, porn sites are known for shitty advertising (popups, popunders, accidental clicks, etc.) so people like me who haven't researched it at all think firstly are these techniques required to get good results from porn sites (I don't want to use them) and secondly will my adverts be assumed to be shitty just by their placement next to other shitty adverts?

volokoumphetico 13y ago
if you've spoofed your referral links, how would they ever know?
- corin_ 13y ago
  I don't lie to my clients about where I spend their money - and even if I wanted to, I wouldn't manage to do it without them noticing.
  - volokoumphetico 13y ago
    that's all good and fine on paper but seriously, how would they ever know that the new add for McDonald's new menu item appeared beside hurrdrurr.com/the-one-with-midget-horse-and-tall-lady.html
    - corin_ 13y ago
      There's a lot of clever tracking tools in the world
- L_Rahman 13y ago
  There's a possibility that the client may be a user of the porn site where he advertises.
  - dboat 13y ago
    More likely he's referring to the services people use to see where on the internet their ads are being displayed.
  - volokoumphetico 13y ago
    but who would ever admit to it? Gee, I was trying to jerk off to some porn yesterday and I found our ad on the site.

fixxer 13y ago

yeah, I was thinking that too. Must be the fear of negative stigma (we're a bunch of puritans...). Be kind of funny if a mainstream company (McD's) put a hilarious add that only showed on a porn site and suddenly everyone was talking about it in the office environment...

eykanal 13y ago

It's association risk. Coke, IBM, Citibank... name any corporation large enough to buy internet ad space at volume, and you can almost guarantee that the company in question doesn't want to be associated with pornography.

throwaway2120 13y ago
Maybe Coke IBM and Citibank are the wrong brands, but why not a brand that tries to eek sex, like Axe, or most beer companies? Am i crazy for thinking that being loosely associated with sex/porn would be great for many businesses?
- patmcc 13y ago
  Couple things there: Axe is owned by Unilever, who also makes brands like Dove - they might not want the press of "owners of Dove advertise on shock porn sites" or whatever. Axe might be ok with being associated with "two sexy people going at it in a traditional way" type porn, but not "bunch of funny looking people having 'strange' sex" type porn, and discriminating between the two might not be worth their time and effort. Axe is probably bought, at least partly, by moms for their young teenage sons - who might not take kindly to actual sex being that tied to their advertising. Take a look at how they currently advertise - it's sex, but with a goofy/comedic slant. Think the ads with the astronauts - those are legitimately funny.
- ryanmcbride 13y ago
  Because we still live in a sex negative society that likes to pretend that no one actually likes sex, and porn is only for people unable to find significant others.

jonnathanson 13y ago

A big reason, which the Eat24 article sort of delves into, is use case. If most porn viewers are watching between 7pm and 3am, those are fantastic hours for a food delivery service; they might be shitty hours for a lot of other products or services. (Though I'd imagine they would make great hours, and porn great ad inventory, for impulse-buy products). As others have mentioned, brand association is another big factor. Probably the biggest factor. Most mainstream companies are extremely (ahem) anal about where their brands pop up.

speeder 13y ago

I wanted to, but in my company case we cannot risk it at all, even 4chan was banned by the CEO... We make games for children aged around 5 years old... If we advertise that at a porn site, beside probably missing our target market, we risk people making those huge outraged internet firestorms that after 4 republications by blogs and newspapers will result into people concluding I am a pedophile.

tekromancr 13y ago
That was probably a smart call.
corin_ 13y ago
So.. why did you want to advertise your game for five year olds on porn sites?
- dagw 13y ago
  Lots of visitors to porn sites have 5 year old children?

ffn 13y ago

Most companies don't want to be associated with pr0n...especially big companies whose market base depends soccer moms and children

Gustomaximus 13y ago

I was working for a bank and an ad slipped through our list of advertisers to be featured on a porn site. A journalist picked up on this and there was 'outrage' within and outside the bank. It was amazing seeing how upset people were. We had to do a massive audit and white list all future ad sites we used. Personally I felt if you choose to be at a porn site why are you offended at a credit card being there? I'd be more embarrassed being caught watching a Sandra Bullock movie...which of course I've never done. I wished the bank put a tongue in cheek press release saying to the journalist 'what were you doing there'. But in the real world we apologise and pretend these sites don't exist.

pbhjpbhj 13y ago
Actually a bank advert offering [pseudo-]anonymous CC payment services would fit in the space well - from an advertising perspective - wouldn't it. I say pseudo because I'm [paranoid and] almost certain that even if you pay cash then someone somewhere has your face connected to that transaction and it's only a security service select query and face-recognition pass away from being ID'ed as you.

steveklabnik 13y ago

It doesn't even need to be straight-up porn: while lots of 4chan is porn, a lot of it isn't, and they've had a hard time finding enough advertisers to keep the lights on.

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]

nraynaud 13y ago

I think (not sure) there are investor rules too. Like VC -> no link to porn.

rdl 13y ago

Divorce lawyers and maybe holidays to places with presumed-available people might also be popular.