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Another problem with people conflating "UX Designer" with "UI Designer" is that if you put "UX" in a job title hoping to get "UI" folks, you will get the wrong

Another problem with people conflating "UX Designer" with "UI Designer" is that if you put "UX" in a job title hoping to get "UI" folks, you will get the wrong people. I have seen this first-hand now with two companies: the job title was set by someone who didn't really understand the difference and instead of getting qualified visual/interface designers applying for the role we got people who draw boxes and arrows, extremely low-fidelity wireframes, and user researchers. Not people who cranked hard on the actual product, but people who did a lot of "meta" work that only affected the product in passing. In larger companies there may be a need for "UX" designers like that, but at small companies when people all need to wear multiple hats, you don't just want a wireframer or flow diagrammer... you want a designer who can think about the overall experience, then design it, then create the actual pixels, then hopefully write some front-end code as well. I have yet to meet anyone who considers themselves a "UX Designer" to be able to do any of that.

seanmcdirmid 13y ago
You mean, you got real designers when what you really wanted were production art technicians? Sounds even worse than that: you got interaction designers when you might have been happy with visual designers. Most good designers don't have time to write code, but some bad/mediocre ones are ok at with it as they are less specialized. It's rare that designers would even have time to write code even if they could or wanted to; usually developers are blocked on them, not vice versa. So what you want is an interaction+visual designer who can also do production and on top of that can write code. And you probably want them also to be good. Your company is screwed.
- nahname 13y ago
  The best designers I have worked with write code or wrote code at one point in their career. It is difficult working in a medium you do not understand.
  - seanmcdirmid 13y ago
    The worst designers I've worked with were the ones who knew how to write code and picked up illustrator by playing with CS...hey look I can draw! Really, the training and practice that goes into a good designer is huge, if they also learn writing code, something has to give. Visual designers are much more difficult in this regard than interaction designers, who are often just former programmers anyways (though the best ones I've worked with schooled as...architects).
    - nmcfarl 13y ago
      I've worked with really truly horrible designers who started as coders. But the worst UI designer I ever worked with knew how to draw pretty pictures and utterly refused to view the web as a separate media from print. Technical constraints were utterly ignored as were, frankly, a number of business constraints (Which is what really got him in trouble). A total failure. Knowing the stuff that goes on around your UI is actually an asset. And knowing the tech deeply enough to code it is of immense value. Of course you still have to be good at your core craft.
      - seanmcdirmid 13y ago
        If you are a front end programmer, do you think knowing how to sketch and design grids helps you implement good designs? Perhaps, but can you actually hire those people and have them be the best programmers at the same time? Much harder. Why would you expect from designers what you don't expect from designers? Keep in mind that good designers are as hard, if not harder, to hire than good programmers. Designers do understand the domains they are working in, otherwise they aren't very good. The developers are not that far away, so there is interaction if the spec goes somewhere where they can't (hardware constraints for phone UI, for example). On the other hand, knowing how to program would help a designer check the dev's bullsh*t that something can't be implemented, and they are just being lazy or toxic.
        nmcfarl 13y ago
        A good question. The reason I expect a good designer know something about the media they are working in is because this is been very traditionally part of the job. Designers have been expected know what inks can and can't be reproduced on which materials. Or which printing process will be most economical etc. As you point out only the truly bad ones don’t know the baseline capabilities of their platform be it app or web design... But for as for the good ones, that do know their media, - well, I don't find it odd that some would find the best way that they could learn the constraints of their media was to play around with HTML and CSS directly (or Interface Builder). And I do think that people who have of done that are actually a bigger asset that's than people who have just read up. I assume this is because they have a more visceral feel for the costs of their designs. This does not mean that I expect my designers to code, or do production work. It just means that those designers who are capable of hacking out a toy system seem to be more capable of designing things that implement easily. And that saves me money.
mmatants 13y ago
> "meta" work that only affected the product in passing UX is basically a continuation of the project manager role (depending on what a given shop interprets that as). It is meant to steer the entire product design (and I don't mean PSD files) from the ground up, so it's not really "in passing". Also, most UX people I know do have a decent skill at PS, so I guess they are listening to that concern.

seanmcdirmid 13y ago

You mean, you got real designers when what you really wanted were production art technicians? Sounds even worse than that: you got interaction designers when you might have been happy with visual designers. Most good designers don't have time to write code, but some bad/mediocre ones are ok at with it as they are less specialized. It's rare that designers would even have time to write code even if they could or wanted to; usually developers are blocked on them, not vice versa. So what you want is an interaction+visual designer who can also do production and on top of that can write code. And you probably want them also to be good. Your company is screwed.

nahname 13y ago
The best designers I have worked with write code or wrote code at one point in their career. It is difficult working in a medium you do not understand.
- seanmcdirmid 13y ago
  The worst designers I've worked with were the ones who knew how to write code and picked up illustrator by playing with CS...hey look I can draw! Really, the training and practice that goes into a good designer is huge, if they also learn writing code, something has to give. Visual designers are much more difficult in this regard than interaction designers, who are often just former programmers anyways (though the best ones I've worked with schooled as...architects).
  - nmcfarl 13y ago
    I've worked with really truly horrible designers who started as coders. But the worst UI designer I ever worked with knew how to draw pretty pictures and utterly refused to view the web as a separate media from print. Technical constraints were utterly ignored as were, frankly, a number of business constraints (Which is what really got him in trouble). A total failure. Knowing the stuff that goes on around your UI is actually an asset. And knowing the tech deeply enough to code it is of immense value. Of course you still have to be good at your core craft.
    - seanmcdirmid 13y ago
      If you are a front end programmer, do you think knowing how to sketch and design grids helps you implement good designs? Perhaps, but can you actually hire those people and have them be the best programmers at the same time? Much harder. Why would you expect from designers what you don't expect from designers? Keep in mind that good designers are as hard, if not harder, to hire than good programmers. Designers do understand the domains they are working in, otherwise they aren't very good. The developers are not that far away, so there is interaction if the spec goes somewhere where they can't (hardware constraints for phone UI, for example). On the other hand, knowing how to program would help a designer check the dev's bullsh*t that something can't be implemented, and they are just being lazy or toxic.
      - nmcfarl 13y ago
        A good question. The reason I expect a good designer know something about the media they are working in is because this is been very traditionally part of the job. Designers have been expected know what inks can and can't be reproduced on which materials. Or which printing process will be most economical etc. As you point out only the truly bad ones don’t know the baseline capabilities of their platform be it app or web design... But for as for the good ones, that do know their media, - well, I don't find it odd that some would find the best way that they could learn the constraints of their media was to play around with HTML and CSS directly (or Interface Builder). And I do think that people who have of done that are actually a bigger asset that's than people who have just read up. I assume this is because they have a more visceral feel for the costs of their designs. This does not mean that I expect my designers to code, or do production work. It just means that those designers who are capable of hacking out a toy system seem to be more capable of designing things that implement easily. And that saves me money.

mmatants 13y ago

> "meta" work that only affected the product in passing UX is basically a continuation of the project manager role (depending on what a given shop interprets that as). It is meant to steer the entire product design (and I don't mean PSD files) from the ground up, so it's not really "in passing". Also, most UX people I know do have a decent skill at PS, so I guess they are listening to that concern.