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Michael Hastings - 911 callers and new video confirm large explosions

125 points by teamgb 13y ago

CoachRufus87 13y ago
What does the LAPD have to gain by denying all requests for information by the reporter? Seems suspicious imo.
- meepmorp 13y ago
  Knowing nothing about the department, maybe just because they don't give statements on things they're investigating unless they're looking for the public's help. It seems suspicious if you're inclined to find it so.
- fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
  Lots of good reasons to deny requests such as not poisoning a potential jury pool in case charges might be made against someone. But, "because some Fed told us not to" is probably good enough too.
FedRegister 13y ago
Is it really a surprise to anybody that this "loose end" was "tied up"?
- spoiledtechie 13y ago
  Huge fucking surprise... This is fucking tragic. It shouldn't be happening in this damn country.
  - javert 13y ago
    The US is becoming more like the USSR or East Germany every day. edit: Dangerously going in that direction. I realize things are still way, way, way better.
    - aet 13y ago
      A statement without any supporting evidence...
      - fiblye 13y ago
        NSA's spy network, indefinite detention without a trial, considering anybody who reveals details of questionable government actions an enemy of the state, encouraging citizen spying and be on the lookout for "suspicious behavior", courts recently saying journalists have zero right to protect a source's anonymity, and having machines patrol the skies "for our safety" are among a few issues that kind of align us with the USSR's widespread spying. Our system is probably even more refined since most people still deny it, while it was well known in Soviet states.
        javert 13y ago
        Plus the fact that corporations and government are merging (especially in telecom, and if the trends continue, finance). That is _literally_ the Nazi model.
- fixxer 13y ago
  Yes.
- gre 13y ago
  It's a surprise there's a video of it.
  - orokusaki 13y ago
    I'd say it's ironic, considering that he stood against surveillance. I'd also say that it's interesting that his fiancee was killed in Iraq... Nah, all just coincidental, and I'm sure the reason the police won't release any information is just out of good taste. (sarcasm intended) If it is true that this man was killed by the state or related interests - history suggests that this could certainly be the case - that's pretty damn scary. I mean, a man is blown up in his car while driving down the highway.
- tootie 13y ago
  When is the last time the US government was so much as credibly suspected of assasinating absolutely anyone - journalist or otherwise - on American soil?
e3pi 13y ago
"...just hours before his death Hastings sent the following email to close friends: “Subject: FBI Investigation, re: NSA -Hey (redacted names) — the Feds are interviewing my “close friends and associates.” Perhaps if the authorities arrive “BuzzFeed GQ,” er HQ, may be wise to immediately request legal counsel before any conversations or interviews about our news gathering practices or related journalism issues. Also: I’m onto a big story, and need to go off the rada[r] for a bit. Notice the symmetry/irony of: "...The SURVEILLANCE VIDEO ...captures the final moments of Hastings life and provides intriguing details of the "crash.... We should hope ES and Glen Greenwald have this.
conductor 13y ago
Relevant: "Gaining wireless access to a car’s network is old news. A team of researchers at the University of Washington and the University of California, San Diego, experimenting on a sedan from an unnamed company in 2010, found that they could wirelessly penetrate the same critical systems Miller and Valasek targeted using the car’s OnStar-like cellular connection, Bluetooth bugs, a rogue Android app that synched with the car’s network from the driver’s smartphone or even a malicious audio file on a CD in the car’s stereo system. “Academics have shown you can get remote code execution,” says Valasek, using hacker jargon for the ability to start running commands on a system. “We showed you can do a lot of crazy things once you’re inside.” [1] [1] - http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/07/24/hackers-reveal-nasty-new-car-attacks-with-me-behind-the-wheel-video/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/07/24/hackers...
mikeash 13y ago
HN just wouldn't be the same without a conspiracy theory on the front page.
- patrickg_zill 13y ago
  LIBOR manipulation, PRISM, FBI deliverately poisoning alcohol during Prohibition Tuskegee Syphilis Study all believed to be just "crazy conspiracy theories" and now proven to be the case. In the case of LIBOR, anywhere from a few hundred to a couple thousand people kept the secret of the manipulation for about 10 years - it only came to light due to a slightly-related investigation of one of the banks involved.
  - mikeash 13y ago
    They laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at Bozo the Clown. Maybe this crash was an assassination. But if you want to not be called a conspiracy nut, you need evidence to back it up. So far there is none. Without evidence, there's no way to distinguish between something like LIBOR and the idea that Apollo 11 was filmed on a Hollywood sound stage. So far, every single article on this guy's crash has been of the fake moon landing genre, not the LIBOR genre. Maybe it happened. But as long as people keep posting conspiracy theories about it, I'm going to keep calling them exactly that.
- adventured 13y ago
  What conspiracy? The US Government has the authority to assassinate US citizens. I don't see how speculation about the circumstances of Hastings death need involve much of a conspiracy theory. It's not like we're talking about JFK here. His life was directly threatened over and over again due to his previous writings; and it was threatened by someone close to McChrystal.
  - patrickg_zill 13y ago
    A "nit" ... the US Government "claims" to have the authority to assassinate US citizens. My view of the Constitution says the US Gov't does NOT have the authority to execute someone without a trial.
mturmon 13y ago
"Inexplicably, the palm tree Hastings’ car hit has scorched bark and slightly wounded base --approximately 16"W x 4.5" H x 1"D-- seemingly minimal damage for a 3,538 pound car striking the tree at a reportedly 100 mph." Here's a data point. A street race on a street where I live got out of hand and a mid-size sedan went at an estimated 80mph into the trunk of a magnolia tree in the median. The car body was literally torn in half, and four of the five occupants were killed. That magnolia has a chunk out of its bark about the size indicated in the quote. It is still very much alive, and five years later, people forget which tree to put memorial candles underneath. I live about 150 meters from the site of that accident. It also sounded like an explosion (big "thump", that brought me and my neighbors out of our houses at around 10 or 11 at night). I don't know one way or another about the specific crash in the OP -- just pointing out that armchair forensics is prone to error.
- sp332 13y ago
  Second sentence: "A new surveillance video from a nearby business obtained by San Diego 6 News and posted by LA Weekly graphically shows multiple explosions consuming his 2013 Mercedes Benz." Did you see the video?
  - knowaveragejoe 13y ago
    Did you? There really aren't multiple explosions visible, it's grainy and from pretty far away(not to mention, not actually newly released surveillance video). We see one continuous light source, consistent with an explosion and a fire recorded by a grainy, B/W COTS security camera at night.
  - jlgreco 13y ago
    I saw the video and it is about as clear as the videos that show "multiple explosions" during the collapse of the WTC towers. Maybe there is actually something there, but I don't think a layman can see it from the provided copy of that video.
  - mturmon 13y ago
    I did see the video. I'm not trying to explain all the facts surrounding the incident, I'm just taking issue with the interpretation of one fact, and extrapolating to say none of this is obvious. Part of the reason I felt a need to chime in, is that I used to live not far from where the accident in the OP took place (north Highland in LA), and the accident I referred to in my comment happened very close to where I live now, again in LA, and the median and curb construction are quite similar. Just for definiteness, here is a link to the crash that I saw (http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/29/local/me-fatalcrash29 http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/29/local/me-fatalcrash2... ); one other person later died from their injuries bringing the total to four from the three reported in the article.
InclinedPlane 13y ago
People: don't speculate, don't buy into conspiracies, rely on hard evidence. The more you veer into conspiracy territory the more anything else you say will fail to be taken seriously. Remember that.
- adventured 13y ago
  His life was repeatedly threatened. What conspiracy? If a dozen people threaten to kill you over five years, and you die in an even remotely suspicious manner, where's the conspiracy in that? There's a line of people that apparently would have liked to kill Hastings.
  - knowaveragejoe 13y ago
    Even being pedantic, that would be a conspiracy... now, does that mean it's the kind of conspiracy theory that belongs on David Icke forums or InfoWars? Maybe not, but right now there is no logical consistency behind the theory that he was killed in a hit given the time, place and manner it occurred.
    - adventured 13y ago
      His death should be treated as suspicious because he was under regular threat by people that apparently wanted him dead, some of which were very powerful people. What it shouldn't be treated as, is an open and shut case. Skepticism given the circumstances, is in my opinion valuable here. There's very little to be lost from making absolutely sure that this wasn't foul play.
      - knowaveragejoe 13y ago
        Sure, I agree, it's important to be skeptical. But, one wonders why they would choose to kill him in such an open manner, after he sent an email saying that he was being investigated by the FBI to Wikileaks' lawyers among other folks. Surely he could be dealt with in a much quieter fashion that isn't so open to being discovered. We can also confirm that he was indeed traveling very fast, certainly fast enough for things to go as wrong as they did very quickly.
AsymetricCom 13y ago
What would cause a car to blow up 3 times in such a short period of time? If there were any kind of explosive, they would probably know immediately.
davidw 13y ago
You guys had me scared that something big was happening in San Diego until the name clicked. I think it was the Mayflowers that were really behind it.
Charos 13y ago
To say that this is extremely suspicious is an understatement. I'll be very interested to see what comes of this. If it comes out that someone carried out a hit on a fairly renowned journalist in order to cover up some dirty laundry, there will be hell to pay.
jlgreco 13y ago
I'm going to preface this by saying that I am very open to the possibility that the US government is assassinating people that cause it trouble. No, I'm not open to it per se, rather I am sure it is happening. This Michael Hastings stuff is getting pretty silly though. A careful, transparent, investigation is probably warranted, but some of the stuff seemingly being used to indicate foul play is just silly. Take for example this: "Inexplicably, the palm tree Hastings’ car hit has scorched bark and slightly wounded base --approximately 16"W x 4.5" H x 1"D-- seemingly minimal damage for a 3,538 pound car striking the tree at a reportedly 100 mph. Also pictures taken by San Diego 6 News show the curb has a small scratch, but no major chipping or fractures and the rear tires resting against the curb." They are careful to not actually say it, but the implication here seems to be that perhaps the car did not actually hit the tree, or perhaps did not even burn there. Didn't I just watch video footage of the car smacking the hell out of the tree, and then bursting into flames? Even if we go with "radio controlled car with a fire bomb", it is very clear that a collision and fire did happen with that tree. You find it odd that a tree survived? It's a fucking tree. If car accidents are the sort of thing that you don't mind viewing, you can google "Car split in half by a tree at high speed reddit". Car literally split in half by a tree. The bark was knocked off the tree and part of the car was wrapped around it, but otherwise it was fine (though the tree will eventually die without the bark)
- EliRivers 13y ago
  I'm going to preface this by saying that I am very open to the possibility that the US government is assassinating people that cause it trouble. No, I'm not open to it per se, rather I am sure it is happening. The current US administration is already on record as acknowledging that they already kill US citizens without trial.
  - jlgreco 13y ago
    In a drone-ish fashion, yes. I am sure they are doing it in a more clandestine "ricin umbrella" way too, which to my knowledge they haven't admitted to. The sort of assassination that is being suggested here is the sort that I very suspect they are doing, but I cannot say that it is clear to me that it happened here.
knowaveragejoe 13y ago
There's nothing new here as far as I can tell. This video has been out for a while, and some of the claims made in the article are unsupported. Also, the woman in the interview has been wrong about several things regarding the case, so personally I'd take what she says with a grain of salt. See these threads over on the popular debunking forum Metabunk: http://metabunk.org/threads/debunked-michael-hastings-crash-engine-found-north-of-crash-going-south.1964/ http://metabunk.org/threads/debunked-michael-hastings-crash-... http://metabunk.org/threads/michael-hastings-death-brings-about-conspiracy-theories-reporters-deadly-car-crash.1819 http://metabunk.org/threads/michael-hastings-death-brings-ab... It's still a quite mysterious case, sure, but it leaves one to wonder why some nefarious actor would choose to kill the guy after he'd already been in contact with wikileaks(among others) for some time beforehand.
sschueller 13y ago
Doesn't this vehicle have a black box. Where is it? The black box might reveal if the vehicle was hacked.
- speeder 13y ago
  It is with the government, and requests were made asking it to hand it over, the requests were ignored.
smegel 13y ago
I would like to see how the White House press office would have responded if this had happened in Russia to a journalist critical of Putin, hours after he said he thought he was being followed by the KGB.
dubyah 13y ago
Please take Kimberly Dvorak's analysis with a grain of salt. Her previous analysis cited the engine being behind the crash instead of being thrown forward and then citing that as suspicious (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4ujFHr0ZLI8&t=119 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4uj...) and her other article cited Hasting's body as being cremated without consent as the lede, a fact refuted by her source (https://twitter.com/Rambobiggs/status/357352728499978240 https://twitter.com/Rambobiggs/status/357352728499978240). The 911 calls aren't necessarily indicative of an explosive device as she seem to be implying. Just because it sounds like an explosion doesn't mean it's an explosion, especially to initial responders. Think about the difference between shots fired and fireworks. This witness saw the entire event and per his interview, it doesn't seem like foul play (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fweyFCFKcp0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fweyFCFKcp0). Michael Krikorian (aka, the source of this surveilance video) wrote an article about the whole thing and it tracks closer to the eyewitness's telling of events(http://krikorianwrites.com/blog/2013/7/16/x9pujjqlzq6bbc0kvdkm1ff9f1mhjl http://krikorianwrites.com/blog/2013/7/16/x9pujjqlzq6bbc0kvd...). One valuable insight Krikorian mentions in his article pertaining to the behavior of the recording device: “That type of surveillance camera has auto exposure so it can change what it sees based by the ambient exposure day or night,” Anderson explained. “This camera is set at night and anything that happens very quickly, be it a flash light or a big ball of fire, the camera won’t react fast enough, so the first flash of light is going to appear much bigger in the viewing. So the initial explosion would always look bigger than it is.” He suggested a simple demonstration using a cellphone video app: Strike a match in a dark room and it will flare up on camera much more than in reality.
- anigbrowl 13y ago
  Just because it sounds like an explosion doesn't mean it's an explosion, especially to initial responders. True that. I live near a busy intersection and they closed one lane of a main road that's also a freeway feeder for most of last year while they were upgrading light rail tracks. There were a lot of accidents thanks to the combination of impatient drivers, fewer lanes, and temporary traffic lights in a different position from usual - about one major crash (ie with at least one car on its side) every 6-8 weeks, so I learned more than I wanted to about being first on the scene of an auto accident. A high speed impact makes a hell of a bang just by itself; it's a big, big uncontrolled release of kenetic energy even if there's no fire.
smoyer 13y ago
If someone in the government wanted to be rid of Hastings wouldn't it be far simpler to have him "just disappear"? You could always claim you didn't know where he was and there's nothing to investigate. Since he claimed to be going underground for a while, no one would even start asking soon enough to gather evidence. So I'm skeptical of this crash being an assassination simply because it's one of the harder ways to pull it off and it's inviting investigation. This crash being a way for Hastings to disappear would be much more plausible.
- jlgreco 13y ago
  This is exactly the sort of analysis that conspiracy theorists often never do. "Drones the size of 747's and several tons of thermite"? Why not just actually hijack a plane? "More reliable backup shooter on the grassy knoll"? Why not just put that shooter in the book depository in the first place? "Pacifying the masses by systematically poisoning the air with 'chemtrails' and the water with fluorine"? Why not just reality television, and cushy lives?
  - smoyer 13y ago
    Most of us here are software engineers and are used to analyzing a problem and finding the least complicated method of achieving a goal to solve that problem. Yet conspiracy theorists seem to think that no one else in the world solves problems. I think your examples above are perfectly reasonable "easier" solutions.
- ellisd 13y ago
  Hastings' "own baggage as a recovering drunk/addict/screw-up"[1] is free cover for late night car crash to not be properly investigated. [1] http://trueslant.com/michaelhastings/2009/04/28/a-case-of-the-relapse-for-young-addictauthor/ http://trueslant.com/michaelhastings/2009/04/28/a-case-of-th...
- leot 13y ago
  It depends on whether people would talk more, and more inquisitively, about "disappear" as compared with talking about a "car crash" one. It also depends on the relative practical difficulties in orchestrating the two kinds of hits. Making a paranoid journalist vanish might be tricky, since they'd presumably be pretty cautious about meeting shady characters in out-of-the-way locations. I suspect an orchestrated car crash, which provides lots of possible counter-conspiracy narrative bits to grab on to, and for which the practicalities might have been thoroughly worked out ahead of time, could be an attractive approach for eliminating a domestic "threat to national security".
j2d3 13y ago
"But the most significant missing evidence was the absence of any skid marks—even though the car made a 60-degree turn into a palm tree. Research of this topic reveals a new angle to this story, namely —Boston Brakes. This theory was explained by a former Marine Gordon Duff who refers to the “Boston Brakes” technique, in which “drive by wire” cars, specifically a Mercedes Benz, can be manipulated remotely to simulate an out-of-control accident, according to his Veterans Today story (The 2010 story is a must read). The story details are eerily similar to Hastings fiery accident scene as there were no skid marks. Adding credence to the possible car-hacking scenario is former U.S. National Coordinator for Security, Infrastructure Protection, and Counter-terrorism Richard Clarke. After news broke on the Hastings car accident, he confirmed the “drive by wire” concept. Clarke told The Huffington Post that a single-vehicle crash is “consistent with a car cyber attack. There is reason to believe that intelligence agencies for major powers — including the United States — know how to remotely seize control of a car.” Another significant detail pointed out by some members of law enforcement, is the intensity of the fire inside the car. It’s highly unusual since gasoline generally doesn’t burn that hot. Reviewing video footage from the scene, the intensity of the fire resembles a “thermite” burn. Despite the LAPD’s categorization of the Hasting fatal accident as a “no (evidence of) foul play” accident, LAPD refuses to release the accident and toxicology reports, or make the Mercedes available for inspection which only fuels speculation. LAPD on the case as usual." from this: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-07-09/elusive-details-michael-hastings-death http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-07-09/elusive-details-mic...
- j2d3 13y ago
  maybe he was onto the story that broke over the weekend about the DEA spying on people: http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2013/08/05/more-surveillance-abuse-exposed-special-dea-unit-is-spying-on-americans-and-covering-it-up/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2013/08/05/more-survei...

125 points by teamgb 13y ago

CoachRufus87 13y ago

What does the LAPD have to gain by denying all requests for information by the reporter? Seems suspicious imo.

meepmorp 13y ago
Knowing nothing about the department, maybe just because they don't give statements on things they're investigating unless they're looking for the public's help. It seems suspicious if you're inclined to find it so.
fnordfnordfnord 13y ago
Lots of good reasons to deny requests such as not poisoning a potential jury pool in case charges might be made against someone. But, "because some Fed told us not to" is probably good enough too.

FedRegister 13y ago

Is it really a surprise to anybody that this "loose end" was "tied up"?

spoiledtechie 13y ago
Huge fucking surprise... This is fucking tragic. It shouldn't be happening in this damn country.
- javert 13y ago
  The US is becoming more like the USSR or East Germany every day. edit: Dangerously going in that direction. I realize things are still way, way, way better.
  - aet 13y ago
    A statement without any supporting evidence...
    - fiblye 13y ago
      NSA's spy network, indefinite detention without a trial, considering anybody who reveals details of questionable government actions an enemy of the state, encouraging citizen spying and be on the lookout for "suspicious behavior", courts recently saying journalists have zero right to protect a source's anonymity, and having machines patrol the skies "for our safety" are among a few issues that kind of align us with the USSR's widespread spying. Our system is probably even more refined since most people still deny it, while it was well known in Soviet states.
      - javert 13y ago
        Plus the fact that corporations and government are merging (especially in telecom, and if the trends continue, finance). That is _literally_ the Nazi model.
fixxer 13y ago
Yes.
gre 13y ago
It's a surprise there's a video of it.
- orokusaki 13y ago
  I'd say it's ironic, considering that he stood against surveillance. I'd also say that it's interesting that his fiancee was killed in Iraq... Nah, all just coincidental, and I'm sure the reason the police won't release any information is just out of good taste. (sarcasm intended) If it is true that this man was killed by the state or related interests - history suggests that this could certainly be the case - that's pretty damn scary. I mean, a man is blown up in his car while driving down the highway.
tootie 13y ago
When is the last time the US government was so much as credibly suspected of assasinating absolutely anyone - journalist or otherwise - on American soil?

e3pi 13y ago

"...just hours before his death Hastings sent the following email to close friends: “Subject: FBI Investigation, re: NSA -Hey (redacted names) — the Feds are interviewing my “close friends and associates.” Perhaps if the authorities arrive “BuzzFeed GQ,” er HQ, may be wise to immediately request legal counsel before any conversations or interviews about our news gathering practices or related journalism issues. Also: I’m onto a big story, and need to go off the rada[r] for a bit. Notice the symmetry/irony of: "...The SURVEILLANCE VIDEO ...captures the final moments of Hastings life and provides intriguing details of the "crash.... We should hope ES and Glen Greenwald have this.

conductor 13y ago

Relevant: "Gaining wireless access to a car’s network is old news. A team of researchers at the University of Washington and the University of California, San Diego, experimenting on a sedan from an unnamed company in 2010, found that they could wirelessly penetrate the same critical systems Miller and Valasek targeted using the car’s OnStar-like cellular connection, Bluetooth bugs, a rogue Android app that synched with the car’s network from the driver’s smartphone or even a malicious audio file on a CD in the car’s stereo system. “Academics have shown you can get remote code execution,” says Valasek, using hacker jargon for the ability to start running commands on a system. “We showed you can do a lot of crazy things once you’re inside.” [1] [1] - http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/07/24/hackers-reveal-nasty-new-car-attacks-with-me-behind-the-wheel-video/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/07/24/hackers...

mikeash 13y ago

HN just wouldn't be the same without a conspiracy theory on the front page.

patrickg_zill 13y ago
LIBOR manipulation, PRISM, FBI deliverately poisoning alcohol during Prohibition Tuskegee Syphilis Study all believed to be just "crazy conspiracy theories" and now proven to be the case. In the case of LIBOR, anywhere from a few hundred to a couple thousand people kept the secret of the manipulation for about 10 years - it only came to light due to a slightly-related investigation of one of the banks involved.
- mikeash 13y ago
  They laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at Bozo the Clown. Maybe this crash was an assassination. But if you want to not be called a conspiracy nut, you need evidence to back it up. So far there is none. Without evidence, there's no way to distinguish between something like LIBOR and the idea that Apollo 11 was filmed on a Hollywood sound stage. So far, every single article on this guy's crash has been of the fake moon landing genre, not the LIBOR genre. Maybe it happened. But as long as people keep posting conspiracy theories about it, I'm going to keep calling them exactly that.
adventured 13y ago
What conspiracy? The US Government has the authority to assassinate US citizens. I don't see how speculation about the circumstances of Hastings death need involve much of a conspiracy theory. It's not like we're talking about JFK here. His life was directly threatened over and over again due to his previous writings; and it was threatened by someone close to McChrystal.
- patrickg_zill 13y ago
  A "nit" ... the US Government "claims" to have the authority to assassinate US citizens. My view of the Constitution says the US Gov't does NOT have the authority to execute someone without a trial.

mturmon 13y ago

"Inexplicably, the palm tree Hastings’ car hit has scorched bark and slightly wounded base --approximately 16"W x 4.5" H x 1"D-- seemingly minimal damage for a 3,538 pound car striking the tree at a reportedly 100 mph." Here's a data point. A street race on a street where I live got out of hand and a mid-size sedan went at an estimated 80mph into the trunk of a magnolia tree in the median. The car body was literally torn in half, and four of the five occupants were killed. That magnolia has a chunk out of its bark about the size indicated in the quote. It is still very much alive, and five years later, people forget which tree to put memorial candles underneath. I live about 150 meters from the site of that accident. It also sounded like an explosion (big "thump", that brought me and my neighbors out of our houses at around 10 or 11 at night). I don't know one way or another about the specific crash in the OP -- just pointing out that armchair forensics is prone to error.

sp332 13y ago
Second sentence: "A new surveillance video from a nearby business obtained by San Diego 6 News and posted by LA Weekly graphically shows multiple explosions consuming his 2013 Mercedes Benz." Did you see the video?
- knowaveragejoe 13y ago
  Did you? There really aren't multiple explosions visible, it's grainy and from pretty far away(not to mention, not actually newly released surveillance video). We see one continuous light source, consistent with an explosion and a fire recorded by a grainy, B/W COTS security camera at night.
- jlgreco 13y ago
  I saw the video and it is about as clear as the videos that show "multiple explosions" during the collapse of the WTC towers. Maybe there is actually something there, but I don't think a layman can see it from the provided copy of that video.
- mturmon 13y ago
  I did see the video. I'm not trying to explain all the facts surrounding the incident, I'm just taking issue with the interpretation of one fact, and extrapolating to say none of this is obvious. Part of the reason I felt a need to chime in, is that I used to live not far from where the accident in the OP took place (north Highland in LA), and the accident I referred to in my comment happened very close to where I live now, again in LA, and the median and curb construction are quite similar. Just for definiteness, here is a link to the crash that I saw (http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/29/local/me-fatalcrash29 http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/29/local/me-fatalcrash2... ); one other person later died from their injuries bringing the total to four from the three reported in the article.

InclinedPlane 13y ago

People: don't speculate, don't buy into conspiracies, rely on hard evidence. The more you veer into conspiracy territory the more anything else you say will fail to be taken seriously. Remember that.

adventured 13y ago
His life was repeatedly threatened. What conspiracy? If a dozen people threaten to kill you over five years, and you die in an even remotely suspicious manner, where's the conspiracy in that? There's a line of people that apparently would have liked to kill Hastings.
- knowaveragejoe 13y ago
  Even being pedantic, that would be a conspiracy... now, does that mean it's the kind of conspiracy theory that belongs on David Icke forums or InfoWars? Maybe not, but right now there is no logical consistency behind the theory that he was killed in a hit given the time, place and manner it occurred.
  - adventured 13y ago
    His death should be treated as suspicious because he was under regular threat by people that apparently wanted him dead, some of which were very powerful people. What it shouldn't be treated as, is an open and shut case. Skepticism given the circumstances, is in my opinion valuable here. There's very little to be lost from making absolutely sure that this wasn't foul play.
    - knowaveragejoe 13y ago
      Sure, I agree, it's important to be skeptical. But, one wonders why they would choose to kill him in such an open manner, after he sent an email saying that he was being investigated by the FBI to Wikileaks' lawyers among other folks. Surely he could be dealt with in a much quieter fashion that isn't so open to being discovered. We can also confirm that he was indeed traveling very fast, certainly fast enough for things to go as wrong as they did very quickly.

AsymetricCom 13y ago

What would cause a car to blow up 3 times in such a short period of time? If there were any kind of explosive, they would probably know immediately.

davidw 13y ago

You guys had me scared that something big was happening in San Diego until the name clicked. I think it was the Mayflowers that were really behind it.

Charos 13y ago

To say that this is extremely suspicious is an understatement. I'll be very interested to see what comes of this. If it comes out that someone carried out a hit on a fairly renowned journalist in order to cover up some dirty laundry, there will be hell to pay.

jlgreco 13y ago

I'm going to preface this by saying that I am very open to the possibility that the US government is assassinating people that cause it trouble. No, I'm not open to it per se, rather I am sure it is happening. This Michael Hastings stuff is getting pretty silly though. A careful, transparent, investigation is probably warranted, but some of the stuff seemingly being used to indicate foul play is just silly. Take for example this: "Inexplicably, the palm tree Hastings’ car hit has scorched bark and slightly wounded base --approximately 16"W x 4.5" H x 1"D-- seemingly minimal damage for a 3,538 pound car striking the tree at a reportedly 100 mph. Also pictures taken by San Diego 6 News show the curb has a small scratch, but no major chipping or fractures and the rear tires resting against the curb." They are careful to not actually say it, but the implication here seems to be that perhaps the car did not actually hit the tree, or perhaps did not even burn there. Didn't I just watch video footage of the car smacking the hell out of the tree, and then bursting into flames? Even if we go with "radio controlled car with a fire bomb", it is very clear that a collision and fire did happen with that tree. You find it odd that a tree survived? It's a fucking tree. If car accidents are the sort of thing that you don't mind viewing, you can google "Car split in half by a tree at high speed reddit". Car literally split in half by a tree. The bark was knocked off the tree and part of the car was wrapped around it, but otherwise it was fine (though the tree will eventually die without the bark)

EliRivers 13y ago
I'm going to preface this by saying that I am very open to the possibility that the US government is assassinating people that cause it trouble. No, I'm not open to it per se, rather I am sure it is happening. The current US administration is already on record as acknowledging that they already kill US citizens without trial.
- jlgreco 13y ago
  In a drone-ish fashion, yes. I am sure they are doing it in a more clandestine "ricin umbrella" way too, which to my knowledge they haven't admitted to. The sort of assassination that is being suggested here is the sort that I very suspect they are doing, but I cannot say that it is clear to me that it happened here.

knowaveragejoe 13y ago

There's nothing new here as far as I can tell. This video has been out for a while, and some of the claims made in the article are unsupported. Also, the woman in the interview has been wrong about several things regarding the case, so personally I'd take what she says with a grain of salt. See these threads over on the popular debunking forum Metabunk: http://metabunk.org/threads/debunked-michael-hastings-crash-engine-found-north-of-crash-going-south.1964/ http://metabunk.org/threads/debunked-michael-hastings-crash-... http://metabunk.org/threads/michael-hastings-death-brings-about-conspiracy-theories-reporters-deadly-car-crash.1819 http://metabunk.org/threads/michael-hastings-death-brings-ab... It's still a quite mysterious case, sure, but it leaves one to wonder why some nefarious actor would choose to kill the guy after he'd already been in contact with wikileaks(among others) for some time beforehand.

sschueller 13y ago

Doesn't this vehicle have a black box. Where is it? The black box might reveal if the vehicle was hacked.

speeder 13y ago
It is with the government, and requests were made asking it to hand it over, the requests were ignored.

smegel 13y ago

I would like to see how the White House press office would have responded if this had happened in Russia to a journalist critical of Putin, hours after he said he thought he was being followed by the KGB.

dubyah 13y ago

Please take Kimberly Dvorak's analysis with a grain of salt. Her previous analysis cited the engine being behind the crash instead of being thrown forward and then citing that as suspicious (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4ujFHr0ZLI8&t=119 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4uj...) and her other article cited Hasting's body as being cremated without consent as the lede, a fact refuted by her source (https://twitter.com/Rambobiggs/status/357352728499978240 https://twitter.com/Rambobiggs/status/357352728499978240). The 911 calls aren't necessarily indicative of an explosive device as she seem to be implying. Just because it sounds like an explosion doesn't mean it's an explosion, especially to initial responders. Think about the difference between shots fired and fireworks. This witness saw the entire event and per his interview, it doesn't seem like foul play (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fweyFCFKcp0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fweyFCFKcp0). Michael Krikorian (aka, the source of this surveilance video) wrote an article about the whole thing and it tracks closer to the eyewitness's telling of events(http://krikorianwrites.com/blog/2013/7/16/x9pujjqlzq6bbc0kvdkm1ff9f1mhjl http://krikorianwrites.com/blog/2013/7/16/x9pujjqlzq6bbc0kvd...). One valuable insight Krikorian mentions in his article pertaining to the behavior of the recording device: “That type of surveillance camera has auto exposure so it can change what it sees based by the ambient exposure day or night,” Anderson explained. “This camera is set at night and anything that happens very quickly, be it a flash light or a big ball of fire, the camera won’t react fast enough, so the first flash of light is going to appear much bigger in the viewing. So the initial explosion would always look bigger than it is.” He suggested a simple demonstration using a cellphone video app: Strike a match in a dark room and it will flare up on camera much more than in reality.

anigbrowl 13y ago
Just because it sounds like an explosion doesn't mean it's an explosion, especially to initial responders. True that. I live near a busy intersection and they closed one lane of a main road that's also a freeway feeder for most of last year while they were upgrading light rail tracks. There were a lot of accidents thanks to the combination of impatient drivers, fewer lanes, and temporary traffic lights in a different position from usual - about one major crash (ie with at least one car on its side) every 6-8 weeks, so I learned more than I wanted to about being first on the scene of an auto accident. A high speed impact makes a hell of a bang just by itself; it's a big, big uncontrolled release of kenetic energy even if there's no fire.

smoyer 13y ago

If someone in the government wanted to be rid of Hastings wouldn't it be far simpler to have him "just disappear"? You could always claim you didn't know where he was and there's nothing to investigate. Since he claimed to be going underground for a while, no one would even start asking soon enough to gather evidence. So I'm skeptical of this crash being an assassination simply because it's one of the harder ways to pull it off and it's inviting investigation. This crash being a way for Hastings to disappear would be much more plausible.

jlgreco 13y ago
This is exactly the sort of analysis that conspiracy theorists often never do. "Drones the size of 747's and several tons of thermite"? Why not just actually hijack a plane? "More reliable backup shooter on the grassy knoll"? Why not just put that shooter in the book depository in the first place? "Pacifying the masses by systematically poisoning the air with 'chemtrails' and the water with fluorine"? Why not just reality television, and cushy lives?
- smoyer 13y ago
  Most of us here are software engineers and are used to analyzing a problem and finding the least complicated method of achieving a goal to solve that problem. Yet conspiracy theorists seem to think that no one else in the world solves problems. I think your examples above are perfectly reasonable "easier" solutions.
ellisd 13y ago
Hastings' "own baggage as a recovering drunk/addict/screw-up"[1] is free cover for late night car crash to not be properly investigated. [1] http://trueslant.com/michaelhastings/2009/04/28/a-case-of-the-relapse-for-young-addictauthor/ http://trueslant.com/michaelhastings/2009/04/28/a-case-of-th...
leot 13y ago
It depends on whether people would talk more, and more inquisitively, about "disappear" as compared with talking about a "car crash" one. It also depends on the relative practical difficulties in orchestrating the two kinds of hits. Making a paranoid journalist vanish might be tricky, since they'd presumably be pretty cautious about meeting shady characters in out-of-the-way locations. I suspect an orchestrated car crash, which provides lots of possible counter-conspiracy narrative bits to grab on to, and for which the practicalities might have been thoroughly worked out ahead of time, could be an attractive approach for eliminating a domestic "threat to national security".

j2d3 13y ago

"But the most significant missing evidence was the absence of any skid marks—even though the car made a 60-degree turn into a palm tree. Research of this topic reveals a new angle to this story, namely —Boston Brakes. This theory was explained by a former Marine Gordon Duff who refers to the “Boston Brakes” technique, in which “drive by wire” cars, specifically a Mercedes Benz, can be manipulated remotely to simulate an out-of-control accident, according to his Veterans Today story (The 2010 story is a must read). The story details are eerily similar to Hastings fiery accident scene as there were no skid marks. Adding credence to the possible car-hacking scenario is former U.S. National Coordinator for Security, Infrastructure Protection, and Counter-terrorism Richard Clarke. After news broke on the Hastings car accident, he confirmed the “drive by wire” concept. Clarke told The Huffington Post that a single-vehicle crash is “consistent with a car cyber attack. There is reason to believe that intelligence agencies for major powers — including the United States — know how to remotely seize control of a car.” Another significant detail pointed out by some members of law enforcement, is the intensity of the fire inside the car. It’s highly unusual since gasoline generally doesn’t burn that hot. Reviewing video footage from the scene, the intensity of the fire resembles a “thermite” burn. Despite the LAPD’s categorization of the Hasting fatal accident as a “no (evidence of) foul play” accident, LAPD refuses to release the accident and toxicology reports, or make the Mercedes available for inspection which only fuels speculation. LAPD on the case as usual." from this: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-07-09/elusive-details-michael-hastings-death http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-07-09/elusive-details-mic...

j2d3 13y ago
maybe he was onto the story that broke over the weekend about the DEA spying on people: http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2013/08/05/more-surveillance-abuse-exposed-special-dea-unit-is-spying-on-americans-and-covering-it-up/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2013/08/05/more-survei...