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This is the exact same kind of shit that got thrown at every person ever who successfully challenged a rusty status quo, especially when job security was at ris

by stiff 13y ago

This is the exact same kind of shit that got thrown at every person ever who successfully challenged a rusty status quo, especially when job security was at risk. Quoting the original piece in Washington Post: We have great respect for the stated goal of Khan Academy — “A free, world-class education for anyone, anywhere.” Yet, we have some serious concerns about the quality of the instruction providing this education. Indeed, if either of us were supervising Khan’s instruction, we would point to some concrete and important gaps in his practice. The key is "if we were supervising". That's the real problem. That someone is making something huge happen, and they are not playing a role in it. Guess what - nobody is stopping this guy or anyone else from producing a few hundred of educational videos with great content and making it available for free. However, some way or another, the people who are capable of a stunt like that are much fewer than those who can hate things on the Internet.

g8oz 13y ago
Exactly. I have no time for those sniping from the sidelines at the doers of the world.
natrius 13y ago
It should be noted that the Washington Post owns Kaplan, which is effectively a Khan Academy competitor.
- qntmfred 13y ago
  Kaplan Test Prep employee here. I of course don't speak officially for anybody but myself, but I will say that everybody I know at Kaplan all the way up to senior management has great admiration and respect for Khan Academy and all the other disruptive players in education these days. In fact, we have been hosting an educational technology startup accelerator with TechStars all summer.
  - badclient 13y ago
    You can admire your competitor but for the simple reason that its your competitor, you always have to try and one up them or keep them from eating your lunch. If senior management is doing its job right than they'd want to take on KA, not merely watch it take over the world.
aswanson 13y ago
Right, the whole tone reads as though he wants to impugn Sal's character and motive, as if he set out when he initially developed the vids as an attempt to pilfer money from the Gates foundation. He was a hedge fund analyst, for god's sake. As if he couldn't find a more financially profitable path through life. He never stated the goal of the Academy was to be the end all and be-all of mathematical education, and anyone acting as though that were his stance is being disingenuous. These are supplemental add-ons to a wide range of important educational topics that I and my children have benefitted from far more than people who claim to have a better method but do nothing but blogbitch about KA.
- chris_wot 13y ago
  For the record, ColinWright has contacted me via email in the past. I want to say that it seems to me that while some of the tone in the blog seemed to be a little exasperated, it wasn't trying to impugn Sal's character. I can say that Colin is very constructive and encouraging to those who are new or trying to learn mathematics - certainly he was like that in the emails we sent back and forth. I think evidence of his motives is on the comments section of his blog where one commentator did go too far, and he shut down the thread. I think that the blog post wasn't "blogbitching" about Khan Academy. Just pointing out some perceived flaws. Criticism is good, and from what I can see Khan Academy are trying to address them.
MikeCapone 13y ago
This. From what I know, teaching is broken in the U.S. (and probably in many other places), and the way incentives and the balance of power is set up, what matters for most decisions on how things work is what is best for teachers, not what is best for students (the documentary Waiting for Superman shows a lot of this). So it's not surprising to see teachers fighting back and trying to discredit KA, because success for them would mean a loss of status quo for teachers. If you get 99 things right and 1 thing wrong, those who feel threatened by you will minimize those 99 things and blow that 1 thing out of proportion.
- yati 13y ago
  > If you get 99 things right and 1 thing wrong, those who feel threatened by you will minimize those 99 things and blow that 1 thing out of proportion. You nailed it perfectly, mate! ॐ
  - geonz 13y ago
    Could you find some things that he got right? Oh. I didn't think so. He also says in his movies that "two plus itself times one" is what "two times one" is. That's right, he gets 2 + 2 wrong.
    - elbear 13y ago
      Are you saying that all of the videos on Khan Academy are wrong?
- ScottBurson 13y ago
  I am thrilled that KA exists. I have read Khan's book and recommended it to others. I don't see anything in this post about "discrediting" KA. I think the author is making a completely valid point and I hope that KA addresses it soon.
  - resu_nimda 13y ago
    > What we see in these two girls’ thinking is precisely the problem you set out to solve with Khan Academy. But you aren’t solving the problem, Mr. Khan. You are perpetuating it. > Mr. Khan, you have a team of teacher advisors. If none of them can identify these gaps for you, you need to ask for help from the larger community (and then to reexamine your hiring practices). > Or you could educate yourself (as we require of all licensed teachers) on what is known about how people learn mathematics. Which of these contributed to his point? The whole thing is just entirely unnecessarily snide and personal. He has a simple and straightforward point that could have been explained in a concise and conciliatory manner, but he chose to use it as a platform to grind an axe. Also the "open letter to Sal Khan" title is confrontational linkbait. This is just not constructive.
ColinWright 13y ago
Look at it another way. You train for years. You spend more years, perhaps decades, working in a classroom. You read the research, you know just how hard it is to get kids to understand decimals. You work and work to find the right way for each child to understand this concept that trips up so many. Then someone else comes along, teaches it badly, and gets lauded for doing wonderful things. Well, it's true that KA is doing fantastic things, but I also have some reservations about some of the things that are said and done. Elsewhere it's been suggested that work is underway to help others contribute their direct working knowledge to help improve them, and I hope that happens. KA can be improved, should be improved. Must be improved. There are places where the way it explains things is in direct contradiction to solid research in pedagogy. I'm sure there are more people being helped by KA than hindered, but I look forward to seeing it acknowledge and absorb modern research.
- 1O0101ll100O 13y ago
  I know it is a hard pill to swallow that such a pedagogical luddite such as Sal Khan is having such a broad and important impact on learning when the professionals are struggling mightily. Maybe, just maybe, he's on to something that despite years of institutional training 'real' teachers are missing. Maybe it's important for a student to be able to interact with a lesson over and over again in order to catch a key point they might have missed the first pass. Maybe it's important for a student to be able to ask other students how they caught on to something on their time scale and in a way that is pseudo-anonymous. Maybe what makes Khan a great teacher is his breadth and depth of knowledge and context thanks to being a triple undergrad from MIT with backgrounds in math, computer science, and electrical engineering AND a Harvard MBA. Maybe the institution of teaching is due for an evolutionary shake-up and Khanacademy is it[or at least a taste of things to come].
  - geonz 13y ago
    How are studnets "interacting" with his videos? It's a hard pill to swallow that maybe he's not on to something; that THE EMPEROR HAS NO CLOTHES.
geonz 13y ago
Khan Academy is putting out really flawed videos and spending millions and millions on 'em. Think VHS / Beta... Guess what -- this is not a letter to you -- it's to the Khan Academy. It's questioning its quality. Since you obviously can't address the well-grounded claim that it is very poor quality, you have to find something else to bring up. It's 'way easier to say "you're a poor loser' than to address the actual claims, isn't it? Much harder stunt.
- rimantas 13y ago
  I am sorry you are downvoted. Alas, a lot of people on HN think technology is the ultimate solver of all the problems in the world. I guess to actually learn how to teach is too much work. Let's go making videos.
  - vdaniuk 13y ago
    Your comment offers no value. Making videos, even if some of them are wrong is valid strategy as current educational system has, arguably, more elements that are wrong.

by stiff 13y ago

g8oz 13y ago

Exactly. I have no time for those sniping from the sidelines at the doers of the world.

natrius 13y ago

It should be noted that the Washington Post owns Kaplan, which is effectively a Khan Academy competitor.

qntmfred 13y ago
Kaplan Test Prep employee here. I of course don't speak officially for anybody but myself, but I will say that everybody I know at Kaplan all the way up to senior management has great admiration and respect for Khan Academy and all the other disruptive players in education these days. In fact, we have been hosting an educational technology startup accelerator with TechStars all summer.
- badclient 13y ago
  You can admire your competitor but for the simple reason that its your competitor, you always have to try and one up them or keep them from eating your lunch. If senior management is doing its job right than they'd want to take on KA, not merely watch it take over the world.

aswanson 13y ago

Right, the whole tone reads as though he wants to impugn Sal's character and motive, as if he set out when he initially developed the vids as an attempt to pilfer money from the Gates foundation. He was a hedge fund analyst, for god's sake. As if he couldn't find a more financially profitable path through life. He never stated the goal of the Academy was to be the end all and be-all of mathematical education, and anyone acting as though that were his stance is being disingenuous. These are supplemental add-ons to a wide range of important educational topics that I and my children have benefitted from far more than people who claim to have a better method but do nothing but blogbitch about KA.

chris_wot 13y ago
For the record, ColinWright has contacted me via email in the past. I want to say that it seems to me that while some of the tone in the blog seemed to be a little exasperated, it wasn't trying to impugn Sal's character. I can say that Colin is very constructive and encouraging to those who are new or trying to learn mathematics - certainly he was like that in the emails we sent back and forth. I think evidence of his motives is on the comments section of his blog where one commentator did go too far, and he shut down the thread. I think that the blog post wasn't "blogbitching" about Khan Academy. Just pointing out some perceived flaws. Criticism is good, and from what I can see Khan Academy are trying to address them.

MikeCapone 13y ago

This. From what I know, teaching is broken in the U.S. (and probably in many other places), and the way incentives and the balance of power is set up, what matters for most decisions on how things work is what is best for teachers, not what is best for students (the documentary Waiting for Superman shows a lot of this). So it's not surprising to see teachers fighting back and trying to discredit KA, because success for them would mean a loss of status quo for teachers. If you get 99 things right and 1 thing wrong, those who feel threatened by you will minimize those 99 things and blow that 1 thing out of proportion.

yati 13y ago
> If you get 99 things right and 1 thing wrong, those who feel threatened by you will minimize those 99 things and blow that 1 thing out of proportion. You nailed it perfectly, mate! ॐ
- geonz 13y ago
  Could you find some things that he got right? Oh. I didn't think so. He also says in his movies that "two plus itself times one" is what "two times one" is. That's right, he gets 2 + 2 wrong.
  - elbear 13y ago
    Are you saying that all of the videos on Khan Academy are wrong?
ScottBurson 13y ago
I am thrilled that KA exists. I have read Khan's book and recommended it to others. I don't see anything in this post about "discrediting" KA. I think the author is making a completely valid point and I hope that KA addresses it soon.
- resu_nimda 13y ago
  > What we see in these two girls’ thinking is precisely the problem you set out to solve with Khan Academy. But you aren’t solving the problem, Mr. Khan. You are perpetuating it. > Mr. Khan, you have a team of teacher advisors. If none of them can identify these gaps for you, you need to ask for help from the larger community (and then to reexamine your hiring practices). > Or you could educate yourself (as we require of all licensed teachers) on what is known about how people learn mathematics. Which of these contributed to his point? The whole thing is just entirely unnecessarily snide and personal. He has a simple and straightforward point that could have been explained in a concise and conciliatory manner, but he chose to use it as a platform to grind an axe. Also the "open letter to Sal Khan" title is confrontational linkbait. This is just not constructive.

ColinWright 13y ago

Look at it another way. You train for years. You spend more years, perhaps decades, working in a classroom. You read the research, you know just how hard it is to get kids to understand decimals. You work and work to find the right way for each child to understand this concept that trips up so many. Then someone else comes along, teaches it badly, and gets lauded for doing wonderful things. Well, it's true that KA is doing fantastic things, but I also have some reservations about some of the things that are said and done. Elsewhere it's been suggested that work is underway to help others contribute their direct working knowledge to help improve them, and I hope that happens. KA can be improved, should be improved. Must be improved. There are places where the way it explains things is in direct contradiction to solid research in pedagogy. I'm sure there are more people being helped by KA than hindered, but I look forward to seeing it acknowledge and absorb modern research.

1O0101ll100O 13y ago
I know it is a hard pill to swallow that such a pedagogical luddite such as Sal Khan is having such a broad and important impact on learning when the professionals are struggling mightily. Maybe, just maybe, he's on to something that despite years of institutional training 'real' teachers are missing. Maybe it's important for a student to be able to interact with a lesson over and over again in order to catch a key point they might have missed the first pass. Maybe it's important for a student to be able to ask other students how they caught on to something on their time scale and in a way that is pseudo-anonymous. Maybe what makes Khan a great teacher is his breadth and depth of knowledge and context thanks to being a triple undergrad from MIT with backgrounds in math, computer science, and electrical engineering AND a Harvard MBA. Maybe the institution of teaching is due for an evolutionary shake-up and Khanacademy is it[or at least a taste of things to come].
- geonz 13y ago
  How are studnets "interacting" with his videos? It's a hard pill to swallow that maybe he's not on to something; that THE EMPEROR HAS NO CLOTHES.

geonz 13y ago

Khan Academy is putting out really flawed videos and spending millions and millions on 'em. Think VHS / Beta... Guess what -- this is not a letter to you -- it's to the Khan Academy. It's questioning its quality. Since you obviously can't address the well-grounded claim that it is very poor quality, you have to find something else to bring up. It's 'way easier to say "you're a poor loser' than to address the actual claims, isn't it? Much harder stunt.

rimantas 13y ago
I am sorry you are downvoted. Alas, a lot of people on HN think technology is the ultimate solver of all the problems in the world. I guess to actually learn how to teach is too much work. Let's go making videos.
- vdaniuk 13y ago
  Your comment offers no value. Making videos, even if some of them are wrong is valid strategy as current educational system has, arguably, more elements that are wrong.