6 ms·

College grad: "I wish I’d gone to prison instead"

13 points by twism 17y ago

cates 17y ago
what a whiner. there's no place for whiners in this world. no wonder he's stuck at his warehouse job. and yes, i am one to speak. i graduated college in 2001, in the midst of the dot com bust and graduated with no job awaiting me either. i stuck with it, and made it work due to my passion. if i can do it, so can everybody else. i'm sorry, but complainers disgust me. they should go cry to their mommys.
- mononcqc 17y ago
  "if i can do it, so can everybody else." No matter how many people try to become the president, there won't be enough time to let millions of people be the president during their life. Of course the scale is wildly different with education and employment, but one should consider the environment and context of the other when making such a statement. No matter how hard you try, there will always be things you can't control; sometimes, they'll be massive blockers. That "you just don't want enough -- that's why you fail" attitude can be insulting at best. Edit: I'm not advocating dropping out of college. I'm currently working as a web dev during the day and studying on weeknights, specifically because I believe in education leading to better conditions (and I love learning as a whole). I just believe it's wrong to assume that if the formula works for me, it should work for everybody else.
maukdaddy 17y ago
What a stupid article. What's with the sudden rash of "Don't Go to College" articles? It is a WELL proven fact that people with college degrees earn far more during their lifetimes than those without degrees. See the second page of this report for a great graph: http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/p23-210.pdf http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/p23-210.pdf
- sp332 17y ago
  A bunch of disaffected college students just got out for the summer, and have more time to read and submit articles here.
- swombat 17y ago
  It's not all that sudden... they keep surfacing every once in a while it seems.
- gustavo_duarte 17y ago
  Not to mention, you know, the bit about 'education' and 'refining your mind', which is supposed to be the purpose of the whole thing.
- lethain 17y ago
  What that reports shows is that historically college has paid off, but even with adjustment for inflation the cost of college has increased by 2.5 times over the past 70 years ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_tuition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_tuition has a great chart showing how that varies across institutions, in some schools the adjusted increase is much lower). Combined with the increased percentage of Americans attending college (from <%5 circa 1940 to nearly 30% now, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Educational_attainment.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Educational_attainment.jpg), I think it's disingenuous to rely on data based on the relative success of those who attended college 40 or 50 year s ago to someone who is graduating from college today. College is more expensive and having a degree is much more common. Because of these factors, although I do think lifetime wage for college graduates will continue to outpace non-graduates, I also think that the relative payoff will decrease. Apologies for over-reliance on wikipedia, it is remarkably hard to find quality sources in a minute or two. ;)
  - abyssknight 17y ago
    My bachelors degree was paid for by the Florida lottery, and the school paid me an extra $8,000 just to choose them. The cost of college is relative to the effort you put in prior to applying. I honestly enjoyed college, and the experience I gained by going through it was invaluable. I didn't party. I didn't drink. I went to class every day, worked at a small web development shop when I wasn't in class, and I took it all in. I graduated on time, and with the knowledge that it had all been well worth it. That was college for me. College is what you make of it. If you go into it hating the establishment, you're going to drop out. The school I went to had a foundation exam for CS students after their first 2 years. Basically, it filters out those who knew the material (or were passionate enough to study and take it 3 times, yes that was me) and those who were just doing the degree for a piece of paper. It works.
edw519 17y ago
"landing a job as an accountant" "I wish I had gone to prison" What's the difference?
- kyro 17y ago
  What a stupid comment. Where I come from, accounting is a fairly semi-successful occupation. Lots of people I know in my community are accountants, who love it, and are leading really happy lives. Just because there are people who don't aspire to be independent, let's run the show, I am my own boss, entrepreneurs, and would opt out for something a bit safer and more stable, doesn't mean they're accepting a prison-like lifestyle. Your childish, baseless, and condescending comment is actually quite offensive. You'd think someone as old as yourself would know that there's more to life than a job. And you'd think these types of garbage comments wouldn't get upvoted. To be honest, it's not even that witty.
  - edw519 17y ago
    Lighten up, kyro. It was a little witty, wasn't it?
- ajju 17y ago
  My brother really loved accounting as a subject in college. He found something else he likes more now, but if he had become an accountant, I don't think he would have felt his job was like prison. Just because something might feel like prison to you, does not mean it feels the same way to everyone.
  - hko 17y ago
    He wasn't saying college felt like prison, just that it was a worse financial deal.
    - ajju 17y ago
      I am responding to edw519 who, as far as I can tell, is implying that having an accounting job is like prison, not the guy quoted in the article.
swombat 17y ago
Going to prison can still be arranged if Mr Castillo really wants to give it a try. I can think of a few ways he could make his way there, and none of them require any qualifications.
phn1x 17y ago
I'm getting tired of people bitching about not coming out of school with a 6 figure job and a house. You chose the wrong degree You are too lazy to network and find another job You'll be stuck in the warehouse forever Stop bitching and change your own situation if you don't like it. And he's 30, wtf? How long did he wait to go to college? or should I dare to inquire, how long did it take to finish?
rdj 17y ago
Yes, he's whining. But the undertone seems to be that he is crushed by debt to the point his life feels worthless. Therefore instead of spending those years only to accumulate debt, he is feeling he could have done just as well sitting in prison, for free. I think the bigger issue is that people assume going to college leads to getting a job which leads to making more money. In this case, the whiner is stuck because the formula failed for him. If we could somehow flip the conventional thinking into, going to college leads to building a solid foundation of perseverance and problem solving which can then be applied and traded for something you value, then things would be different. The whiner would then have a new formula which is observe the situation, solve the problem using a vast array of possible solutions and trade for something of value. The problem in this case.. he can't seem to figure out how to get out of a warehousing job in a down market. Sad.
- phn1x 17y ago
  not for nothing, but if he's crushed by debt why is he only working a warehouse job. Deliver pizza or work a second job, use that extra income to rapidly pay down the debt.
  - rdj 17y ago
    Because he is applying formula #1: go to college -> get A job -> make money Nowhere in there does it say he can get more than one job, start a side business, etc. He's stuck using a broken ideology, but that is apparently all he was taught during those years in college. Poor soul just doesn't know any better. But you are leaning towards a more logical, reasoned formula. Formula #2.
  - marcusbooster 17y ago
    Working at a warehouse and delivering pizza to pay off $35,200 would take years, and effectively make his degree worthless by the time he finished. Declare bankruptcy, bootstrap your own biz, and wait out the next 7 years and he'll be good to go.
    - phn1x 17y ago
rml 17y ago
I think we shouldn't underestimate the fact that kids are told over and over by teachers, guidance counselors, etc., "Go to college." These (well-meaning) people often don't realize that what worked for them twenty years ago might not be relevant anymore. In many parts of the U.S., there just isn't that much productive industry (of whatever kind) to support all these new graduates.
menloparkbum 17y ago
At the end of the article it reveals that the guy is 30. Unless he went to school very late, there are probably other reasons he's underemployed. It's hard to believe he couldn't have found an accounting job over the past 7 years.
keefe 17y ago
It's not colleges fault this guy is an idiot. Shame on msnbc trolling.

13 points by twism 17y ago

cates 17y ago

what a whiner. there's no place for whiners in this world. no wonder he's stuck at his warehouse job. and yes, i am one to speak. i graduated college in 2001, in the midst of the dot com bust and graduated with no job awaiting me either. i stuck with it, and made it work due to my passion. if i can do it, so can everybody else. i'm sorry, but complainers disgust me. they should go cry to their mommys.

mononcqc 17y ago
"if i can do it, so can everybody else." No matter how many people try to become the president, there won't be enough time to let millions of people be the president during their life. Of course the scale is wildly different with education and employment, but one should consider the environment and context of the other when making such a statement. No matter how hard you try, there will always be things you can't control; sometimes, they'll be massive blockers. That "you just don't want enough -- that's why you fail" attitude can be insulting at best. Edit: I'm not advocating dropping out of college. I'm currently working as a web dev during the day and studying on weeknights, specifically because I believe in education leading to better conditions (and I love learning as a whole). I just believe it's wrong to assume that if the formula works for me, it should work for everybody else.

maukdaddy 17y ago

What a stupid article. What's with the sudden rash of "Don't Go to College" articles? It is a WELL proven fact that people with college degrees earn far more during their lifetimes than those without degrees. See the second page of this report for a great graph: http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/p23-210.pdf http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/p23-210.pdf

sp332 17y ago
A bunch of disaffected college students just got out for the summer, and have more time to read and submit articles here.
swombat 17y ago
It's not all that sudden... they keep surfacing every once in a while it seems.
gustavo_duarte 17y ago
Not to mention, you know, the bit about 'education' and 'refining your mind', which is supposed to be the purpose of the whole thing.
lethain 17y ago
What that reports shows is that historically college has paid off, but even with adjustment for inflation the cost of college has increased by 2.5 times over the past 70 years ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_tuition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_tuition has a great chart showing how that varies across institutions, in some schools the adjusted increase is much lower). Combined with the increased percentage of Americans attending college (from <%5 circa 1940 to nearly 30% now, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Educational_attainment.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Educational_attainment.jpg), I think it's disingenuous to rely on data based on the relative success of those who attended college 40 or 50 year s ago to someone who is graduating from college today. College is more expensive and having a degree is much more common. Because of these factors, although I do think lifetime wage for college graduates will continue to outpace non-graduates, I also think that the relative payoff will decrease. Apologies for over-reliance on wikipedia, it is remarkably hard to find quality sources in a minute or two. ;)
- abyssknight 17y ago
  My bachelors degree was paid for by the Florida lottery, and the school paid me an extra $8,000 just to choose them. The cost of college is relative to the effort you put in prior to applying. I honestly enjoyed college, and the experience I gained by going through it was invaluable. I didn't party. I didn't drink. I went to class every day, worked at a small web development shop when I wasn't in class, and I took it all in. I graduated on time, and with the knowledge that it had all been well worth it. That was college for me. College is what you make of it. If you go into it hating the establishment, you're going to drop out. The school I went to had a foundation exam for CS students after their first 2 years. Basically, it filters out those who knew the material (or were passionate enough to study and take it 3 times, yes that was me) and those who were just doing the degree for a piece of paper. It works.

edw519 17y ago

"landing a job as an accountant" "I wish I had gone to prison" What's the difference?

kyro 17y ago
What a stupid comment. Where I come from, accounting is a fairly semi-successful occupation. Lots of people I know in my community are accountants, who love it, and are leading really happy lives. Just because there are people who don't aspire to be independent, let's run the show, I am my own boss, entrepreneurs, and would opt out for something a bit safer and more stable, doesn't mean they're accepting a prison-like lifestyle. Your childish, baseless, and condescending comment is actually quite offensive. You'd think someone as old as yourself would know that there's more to life than a job. And you'd think these types of garbage comments wouldn't get upvoted. To be honest, it's not even that witty.
- edw519 17y ago
  Lighten up, kyro. It was a little witty, wasn't it?
ajju 17y ago
My brother really loved accounting as a subject in college. He found something else he likes more now, but if he had become an accountant, I don't think he would have felt his job was like prison. Just because something might feel like prison to you, does not mean it feels the same way to everyone.
- hko 17y ago
  He wasn't saying college felt like prison, just that it was a worse financial deal.
  - ajju 17y ago
    I am responding to edw519 who, as far as I can tell, is implying that having an accounting job is like prison, not the guy quoted in the article.

swombat 17y ago

Going to prison can still be arranged if Mr Castillo really wants to give it a try. I can think of a few ways he could make his way there, and none of them require any qualifications.

phn1x 17y ago

I'm getting tired of people bitching about not coming out of school with a 6 figure job and a house. You chose the wrong degree You are too lazy to network and find another job You'll be stuck in the warehouse forever Stop bitching and change your own situation if you don't like it. And he's 30, wtf? How long did he wait to go to college? or should I dare to inquire, how long did it take to finish?

rdj 17y ago

Yes, he's whining. But the undertone seems to be that he is crushed by debt to the point his life feels worthless. Therefore instead of spending those years only to accumulate debt, he is feeling he could have done just as well sitting in prison, for free. I think the bigger issue is that people assume going to college leads to getting a job which leads to making more money. In this case, the whiner is stuck because the formula failed for him. If we could somehow flip the conventional thinking into, going to college leads to building a solid foundation of perseverance and problem solving which can then be applied and traded for something you value, then things would be different. The whiner would then have a new formula which is observe the situation, solve the problem using a vast array of possible solutions and trade for something of value. The problem in this case.. he can't seem to figure out how to get out of a warehousing job in a down market. Sad.

phn1x 17y ago
not for nothing, but if he's crushed by debt why is he only working a warehouse job. Deliver pizza or work a second job, use that extra income to rapidly pay down the debt.
- rdj 17y ago
  Because he is applying formula #1: go to college -> get A job -> make money Nowhere in there does it say he can get more than one job, start a side business, etc. He's stuck using a broken ideology, but that is apparently all he was taught during those years in college. Poor soul just doesn't know any better. But you are leaning towards a more logical, reasoned formula. Formula #2.
- marcusbooster 17y ago
  Working at a warehouse and delivering pizza to pay off $35,200 would take years, and effectively make his degree worthless by the time he finished. Declare bankruptcy, bootstrap your own biz, and wait out the next 7 years and he'll be good to go.
  - phn1x 17y ago

rml 17y ago

I think we shouldn't underestimate the fact that kids are told over and over by teachers, guidance counselors, etc., "Go to college." These (well-meaning) people often don't realize that what worked for them twenty years ago might not be relevant anymore. In many parts of the U.S., there just isn't that much productive industry (of whatever kind) to support all these new graduates.

menloparkbum 17y ago

At the end of the article it reveals that the guy is 30. Unless he went to school very late, there are probably other reasons he's underemployed. It's hard to believe he couldn't have found an accounting job over the past 7 years.

keefe 17y ago

It's not colleges fault this guy is an idiot. Shame on msnbc trolling.