8 ms·

Just for a little context for those unfamiliar with Malibu. Some beaches are public, some are private and open only to those who live in particular neighbourhoo

Just for a little context for those unfamiliar with Malibu. Some beaches are public, some are private and open only to those who live in particular neighbourhoods. The residents here are remarkably wealthy, we're talking Speilberg, Streisand, Geffen, and at times have hired their own private security to check people's ID to ensure they belong there. Broad Beach (I think) is public, but there's gates that block access to it requiring a key. So this app informs people which gates are legit and which ones are erected under false premise. Malibu problems.

joonix 13y ago
This is great. One day I was exploring Malibu and found one of these small narrow entranceways. They had a "guard" (guy in a yellow t-shirt) sitting on a foldable chair telling people it was a private beach. Pay these people no regard. Walk on to any beach you want. If the sand really belongs to the homeowner, they would have a fence surrounding it. Even if it happens to be private, the public should still have an easement to pass through. Remember, if they want to kick you out of their private beach, they need to call the police. They can't eject you with force.
- gknoy 13y ago
  I imagine they CAN eject you with force, but if they do you will be able to sue them and probably also call the police. Recent events should help us remain mindful of the fact that ability and legality do not always go hand in hand -- be mindful of what can happen, not just what is legal, and you'll be safer. The same goes for being a pedestrian near cars. Physics trumps right of way.
  - jdmichal 13y ago
    I always phrase this as, 3000 pounds of steel always has right of way over 200 pounds of flesh.
    - jlarocco 13y ago
      I always keep this in mind when riding my bike. Just because I may legally have the right of way, it's not worth getting hit by a car to prove the point.
      - anakha 13y ago
        Bein' right is not a bulletproof vest, Freddy. - Cop Land
- adrr 13y ago
  Some of the private communities have fences that extend into the water line. I just walk past them. Fished surf in Malibu for 10 years, never had issues with people telling me i couldn't be there. Don't know why people want to hangout on Malibu beaches, the water smell like sewage since they lack a sewer system so everything is on septic tanks that overflow every time it rains. Also all the home owners let their dogs run free and they defecate everywhere without picking it up.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- grumps 13y ago
  That's completely dependent on state a local laws. Its California so... yea physical force may not be legal.
kirillzubovsky 13y ago
Did you say that even public beaches require a key, which I assume only residents of the 'allowed' neighborhoods are able to attain?
- waterside81 13y ago
  Yup, Broad Beach at one location has a gate requiring a key.
- ChuckMcM 13y ago
  Of course keys aren't the only things that open locks. Back in the early 80's the "locks" on these gates were pretty basic 3 pin convenience locks and you could pick them very easily.
waitwhatwhoa 13y ago
"some beaches are private" is actually incorrect - all beaches in California are public from the water to the high tide line.
- awm 13y ago
  I believe the only exception to this rule is Military property. Coronado (off of San Diego) beach is an example. Eventually you hit the navy base...
  - dfc 13y ago
    You were concerned a lot of people were going to read this and then try to have a picnic on the beach and watch the newest BUDS class? I don't know about Coronado but at Dam Neck there is a fence that extends at least 150+ feet into the water clearly delineating the base. If the fence is not a dead give away there are signs every 20 feet on the fence that make it crystal clear that the other side of the fence is not a public beach.
    - mbreese 13y ago
      Right, but it's good to point out the exceptions to the general rule that all beaches are accessible to the public. Especially in the context of Malibu where there are often wrong or misleading signs.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- waterside81 13y ago
  Yeah you're probably right - I've probably been conditioned to think some are private because the access is restricted.
  - beachstartup 13y ago
    he's not probably right, he's right. california beaches are public and protected. anyone can use them as long as they follow state law (regarding alcohol, fires, dogs, trash, etc.) the state takes it very seriously and that's why there's thousands of miles of clean shoreline for everyone to enjoy.
dmckeon 13y ago
For large values of "remarkably wealthy" - http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/05/mapping_15_of_tech_billionaire_larry_ellisons_malibu_properties_1.php http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/05/mapping_15_of_tech_bil...
- fakeer 13y ago
  House 1:: Ellison bought his first house on Carbon Beach back in 2002 for $11.750117[1], according to PropertyShark. House 2: He bought Carbon house number two in 2003 for $11.500115[2] [1] & [2] Typo, right?
- joonix 13y ago
  These properties seem undervalued. We're talking about absolute beachfront property a half hour from the #2 population center of the largest economy in the world in a beautiful area (that's on the US coast that faces Asia) with one of the best and rarest climates in the world. $10 million is chump change to a billionaire; consider the number of billionaires in the world and that the number rises yearly as more and more economies around the world develop and emerge. There are only 70 homes on Carbon Beach. Considering new Manhattan penthouses are selling for $90 million cash, it seems Ellison has spotted a bargain and dived straight in.
  - mturmon 13y ago
    I hate the implications, but you're right. I reached this enlightenment a few years ago after visiting the coastline around Nice and Cannes. It was clear where Malibu was going, eventually. I'm not saying it will be the same, but close enough.
  - dylangs1030 13y ago
    Small nitpick - Manhattan "penthouse" is a very vague term. You can buy penthouses with 10-30k square feet for $10 million or less in Manhattan. This is dependent on location and marketability, but they are still very high class locales. Unless you mean a penthouse literally less than a year old. Just wanted to share this info as a New Yorker.
algorias 13y ago
Hiring private security for that purpose is basically vigilantism, this should be illegal in any sane jurisdiction. Has anybody prosecuted this? Being a "Malibu problem" doesn't really make this matter any less relevant. It's precisely this kind of being above the law feeling of the wealthy that's at the root of many much larger problems.
- 3pt14159 13y ago
  It depends on authority and proof. It is not vigiantism if the area is private and the guard is given authority by the neighbourhood association (or whoever owns/is in charge of the land). While the wealthy being above the law is a problem, the larger problem is the arbitrary nature of the law and the arbitrary nature of its enforcement. People wouldn't have to hire private guards if the law wasn't enforced. The police would enforce the law if there was less of it wasted on things that moral people do (like smoking pot).
  - algorias 13y ago
    I agree with your sentiment regarding arbitrary law enforcement and the huge waste of times it is to chase people smoking pot and similarly harmless things. However, you seem to imply (please correct me if I'm wrong) that this justifies the vigilantism. I find that idea to be very problematic on many fronts.
    - 3pt14159 13y ago
      Is it vigilantism for you to stop me from walking into your house? That is the crux of my argument. If you, or a group of people, rightfully own land then you should be free to pay guards to stop people to enter it.
      - brewdad 13y ago
        But they don't rightfully own the land. This is hiring guards to keep people off the sidewalk in front of your house.
  - 13y ago
Steko 13y ago
There are also a lot of public walking paths[1] and unexpected stairways[2] in the Hollywood Hills that homeowners will put gates over or post signs claiming no public access, because, you know, fuck you got mine. - Bunny Ultramod on Metafilter (http://www.metafilter.com/129367/Hiding-Public-Land http://www.metafilter.com/129367/Hiding-Public-Land) http://www.discoverlosangeles.com/blog/hiking-los-angeles-las-best-trails http://www.discoverlosangeles.com/blog/hiking-los-angeles-la... http://www.secretstairs-la.com/welcome.html http://www.secretstairs-la.com/welcome.html
comrade1 13y ago
There are no private beaches in California.

joonix 13y ago

This is great. One day I was exploring Malibu and found one of these small narrow entranceways. They had a "guard" (guy in a yellow t-shirt) sitting on a foldable chair telling people it was a private beach. Pay these people no regard. Walk on to any beach you want. If the sand really belongs to the homeowner, they would have a fence surrounding it. Even if it happens to be private, the public should still have an easement to pass through. Remember, if they want to kick you out of their private beach, they need to call the police. They can't eject you with force.

gknoy 13y ago
I imagine they CAN eject you with force, but if they do you will be able to sue them and probably also call the police. Recent events should help us remain mindful of the fact that ability and legality do not always go hand in hand -- be mindful of what can happen, not just what is legal, and you'll be safer. The same goes for being a pedestrian near cars. Physics trumps right of way.
- jdmichal 13y ago
  I always phrase this as, 3000 pounds of steel always has right of way over 200 pounds of flesh.
  - jlarocco 13y ago
    I always keep this in mind when riding my bike. Just because I may legally have the right of way, it's not worth getting hit by a car to prove the point.
    - anakha 13y ago
      Bein' right is not a bulletproof vest, Freddy. - Cop Land
adrr 13y ago
Some of the private communities have fences that extend into the water line. I just walk past them. Fished surf in Malibu for 10 years, never had issues with people telling me i couldn't be there. Don't know why people want to hangout on Malibu beaches, the water smell like sewage since they lack a sewer system so everything is on septic tanks that overflow every time it rains. Also all the home owners let their dogs run free and they defecate everywhere without picking it up.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
grumps 13y ago
That's completely dependent on state a local laws. Its California so... yea physical force may not be legal.

kirillzubovsky 13y ago

Did you say that even public beaches require a key, which I assume only residents of the 'allowed' neighborhoods are able to attain?

waterside81 13y ago
Yup, Broad Beach at one location has a gate requiring a key.
ChuckMcM 13y ago
Of course keys aren't the only things that open locks. Back in the early 80's the "locks" on these gates were pretty basic 3 pin convenience locks and you could pick them very easily.

waitwhatwhoa 13y ago

"some beaches are private" is actually incorrect - all beaches in California are public from the water to the high tide line.

awm 13y ago
I believe the only exception to this rule is Military property. Coronado (off of San Diego) beach is an example. Eventually you hit the navy base...
- dfc 13y ago
  You were concerned a lot of people were going to read this and then try to have a picnic on the beach and watch the newest BUDS class? I don't know about Coronado but at Dam Neck there is a fence that extends at least 150+ feet into the water clearly delineating the base. If the fence is not a dead give away there are signs every 20 feet on the fence that make it crystal clear that the other side of the fence is not a public beach.
  - mbreese 13y ago
    Right, but it's good to point out the exceptions to the general rule that all beaches are accessible to the public. Especially in the context of Malibu where there are often wrong or misleading signs.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
waterside81 13y ago
Yeah you're probably right - I've probably been conditioned to think some are private because the access is restricted.
- beachstartup 13y ago
  he's not probably right, he's right. california beaches are public and protected. anyone can use them as long as they follow state law (regarding alcohol, fires, dogs, trash, etc.) the state takes it very seriously and that's why there's thousands of miles of clean shoreline for everyone to enjoy.

dmckeon 13y ago

For large values of "remarkably wealthy" - http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/05/mapping_15_of_tech_billionaire_larry_ellisons_malibu_properties_1.php http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/05/mapping_15_of_tech_bil...

fakeer 13y ago
House 1:: Ellison bought his first house on Carbon Beach back in 2002 for $11.750117[1], according to PropertyShark. House 2: He bought Carbon house number two in 2003 for $11.500115[2] [1] & [2] Typo, right?
joonix 13y ago
These properties seem undervalued. We're talking about absolute beachfront property a half hour from the #2 population center of the largest economy in the world in a beautiful area (that's on the US coast that faces Asia) with one of the best and rarest climates in the world. $10 million is chump change to a billionaire; consider the number of billionaires in the world and that the number rises yearly as more and more economies around the world develop and emerge. There are only 70 homes on Carbon Beach. Considering new Manhattan penthouses are selling for $90 million cash, it seems Ellison has spotted a bargain and dived straight in.
- mturmon 13y ago
  I hate the implications, but you're right. I reached this enlightenment a few years ago after visiting the coastline around Nice and Cannes. It was clear where Malibu was going, eventually. I'm not saying it will be the same, but close enough.
- dylangs1030 13y ago
  Small nitpick - Manhattan "penthouse" is a very vague term. You can buy penthouses with 10-30k square feet for $10 million or less in Manhattan. This is dependent on location and marketability, but they are still very high class locales. Unless you mean a penthouse literally less than a year old. Just wanted to share this info as a New Yorker.

algorias 13y ago

Hiring private security for that purpose is basically vigilantism, this should be illegal in any sane jurisdiction. Has anybody prosecuted this? Being a "Malibu problem" doesn't really make this matter any less relevant. It's precisely this kind of being above the law feeling of the wealthy that's at the root of many much larger problems.

3pt14159 13y ago
It depends on authority and proof. It is not vigiantism if the area is private and the guard is given authority by the neighbourhood association (or whoever owns/is in charge of the land). While the wealthy being above the law is a problem, the larger problem is the arbitrary nature of the law and the arbitrary nature of its enforcement. People wouldn't have to hire private guards if the law wasn't enforced. The police would enforce the law if there was less of it wasted on things that moral people do (like smoking pot).
- algorias 13y ago
  I agree with your sentiment regarding arbitrary law enforcement and the huge waste of times it is to chase people smoking pot and similarly harmless things. However, you seem to imply (please correct me if I'm wrong) that this justifies the vigilantism. I find that idea to be very problematic on many fronts.
  - 3pt14159 13y ago
    Is it vigilantism for you to stop me from walking into your house? That is the crux of my argument. If you, or a group of people, rightfully own land then you should be free to pay guards to stop people to enter it.
    - brewdad 13y ago
      But they don't rightfully own the land. This is hiring guards to keep people off the sidewalk in front of your house.
- 13y ago

Steko 13y ago

There are also a lot of public walking paths[1] and unexpected stairways[2] in the Hollywood Hills that homeowners will put gates over or post signs claiming no public access, because, you know, fuck you got mine. - Bunny Ultramod on Metafilter (http://www.metafilter.com/129367/Hiding-Public-Land http://www.metafilter.com/129367/Hiding-Public-Land) http://www.discoverlosangeles.com/blog/hiking-los-angeles-las-best-trails http://www.discoverlosangeles.com/blog/hiking-los-angeles-la... http://www.secretstairs-la.com/welcome.html http://www.secretstairs-la.com/welcome.html

comrade1 13y ago

There are no private beaches in California.