5 ms·

"For men, the outlook was radically different. If you go along with the crowd and play it safe, the odds are you won’t have children. Most men who ever lived di

by jmtame 18y ago

"For men, the outlook was radically different. If you go along with the crowd and play it safe, the odds are you won’t have children. Most men who ever lived did not have descendants who are alive today. Their lines were dead ends. Hence it was necessary to take chances, try new things, be creative, explore other possibilities. Sailing off into the unknown may be risky, and you might drown or be killed or whatever, but then again if you stay home you won’t reproduce anyway. We’re most descended from the type of men who made the risky voyage and managed to come back rich. In that case he would finally get a good chance to pass on his genes. We’re descended from men who took chances (and were lucky)."

amichail 18y ago
In recent times, if you want to maximize your chances of finding a wife, it's better to have a safe career as an employee with a stable income. The only risk involved is in aiming for a career for which you have insufficient ability. Maybe it wasn't like that a long time ago. Maybe having an average job then did not generate enough wealth for the survival of a family.
- Retric 18y ago
  Having one wife a 2-3 kids is still not the "best" genetic outcome. Many men have 10+ children from several women over there lives. I suspect that on average men who have one wife and no outside children average less than 2 children and because those children only get 1/2 their DNA it's not really success.
- webwright 18y ago
  I think what you're saying is that ambition is not rewarded in the dating/mating game, which is decidedly not the case (today or a long time ago). If you took birth control out of the equation, which men do you think would father the most babies today in the US, men with high ambition or men who chose a "safe career" and "stable income"?
  - amichail 18y ago
    Nowadays, many couples don't want any children and this trend will just increase over time. As for long ago, it may be true that richer men had fathered more children. But you must also take into count the number of children fathered by the much larger number of men with average salaries.
  - gaius 18y ago
    men with high ambition or men who chose a "safe career" and "stable income"? Neither! People on the dole who have never worked and never intend to.
  - rsheridan6 18y ago
    >If you took birth control out of the equation And if pigs could fly... Birth control changes everything. The number of children a man has is inversely (and counterintuitively) related to the number of sexual partners he's had. http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2008/10/fewer-sexual-partners-means-more-babies.html http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2008/10/fewer-sexual-partners-... You can have all the sex you want, but if it doesn't result in babies it doesn't count (at least not in this context).
- orangecat 18y ago
  "If you want to maximize your chances of finding a wife, it's better to have a safe career as an employee with a stable income." Even if that's true today, the argument that it wasn't true in the environment in which we evolved. We're adaptation-executers, not fitness-maximizers: http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/11/adaptation-exec.html http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/11/adaptation-exec.html. Our genes "tell" us to take risks because that's how they evolved, regardless of whether it's the best strategy today.
  - visitor4rmindia 18y ago
    And (from purely anecdotal experience) it isn't true today either. I did not have a safe career with a stable income when I met and married my wife. One of my best friends dropped out of college and married his sweetheart (they started off living in a single room). Recently, another friend of mine was laid off. He's just got engaged. IMHO The safe, stable, incomes make it easier to get married only if it is an "arranged" marriage where you are scrutinized by the parent and relatives of your wife-to-be. Otherwise it really doesn't matter.
    - tjic 18y ago
      anecdote != data
      - visitor4rmindia 18y ago
        The original comment is simply an opinion so I replied with mine. EDIT: Grammar
    - skinnymuch 18y ago
      Yeah but is your wife hot or smart? Does she have good genes? I wonder the same about the other wives in your anecdotal experiences.
      - visitor4rmindia 18y ago
        I think she's insanely hot! As for smart, she worked as an IT consultant in the UK for over three years. And her IQ is 131 (higher than mine).
- russell 18y ago
  Safe career is better? Not really. Given that a male is reasonably unlikely to be killed, most men will have wives, but the more competitive, higher paid ones, will get the more desirable women. Remember the company Christmas party? The executives didn't have dogs. The men who dont get wives are those at the bottom of the heap: in jail, on drugs, homeless.

by jmtame 18y ago

amichail 18y ago

In recent times, if you want to maximize your chances of finding a wife, it's better to have a safe career as an employee with a stable income. The only risk involved is in aiming for a career for which you have insufficient ability. Maybe it wasn't like that a long time ago. Maybe having an average job then did not generate enough wealth for the survival of a family.

Retric 18y ago
Having one wife a 2-3 kids is still not the "best" genetic outcome. Many men have 10+ children from several women over there lives. I suspect that on average men who have one wife and no outside children average less than 2 children and because those children only get 1/2 their DNA it's not really success.
webwright 18y ago
I think what you're saying is that ambition is not rewarded in the dating/mating game, which is decidedly not the case (today or a long time ago). If you took birth control out of the equation, which men do you think would father the most babies today in the US, men with high ambition or men who chose a "safe career" and "stable income"?
- amichail 18y ago
  Nowadays, many couples don't want any children and this trend will just increase over time. As for long ago, it may be true that richer men had fathered more children. But you must also take into count the number of children fathered by the much larger number of men with average salaries.
- gaius 18y ago
  men with high ambition or men who chose a "safe career" and "stable income"? Neither! People on the dole who have never worked and never intend to.
- rsheridan6 18y ago
  >If you took birth control out of the equation And if pigs could fly... Birth control changes everything. The number of children a man has is inversely (and counterintuitively) related to the number of sexual partners he's had. http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2008/10/fewer-sexual-partners-means-more-babies.html http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2008/10/fewer-sexual-partners-... You can have all the sex you want, but if it doesn't result in babies it doesn't count (at least not in this context).
orangecat 18y ago
"If you want to maximize your chances of finding a wife, it's better to have a safe career as an employee with a stable income." Even if that's true today, the argument that it wasn't true in the environment in which we evolved. We're adaptation-executers, not fitness-maximizers: http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/11/adaptation-exec.html http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/11/adaptation-exec.html. Our genes "tell" us to take risks because that's how they evolved, regardless of whether it's the best strategy today.
- visitor4rmindia 18y ago
  And (from purely anecdotal experience) it isn't true today either. I did not have a safe career with a stable income when I met and married my wife. One of my best friends dropped out of college and married his sweetheart (they started off living in a single room). Recently, another friend of mine was laid off. He's just got engaged. IMHO The safe, stable, incomes make it easier to get married only if it is an "arranged" marriage where you are scrutinized by the parent and relatives of your wife-to-be. Otherwise it really doesn't matter.
  - tjic 18y ago
    anecdote != data
    - visitor4rmindia 18y ago
      The original comment is simply an opinion so I replied with mine. EDIT: Grammar
  - skinnymuch 18y ago
    Yeah but is your wife hot or smart? Does she have good genes? I wonder the same about the other wives in your anecdotal experiences.
    - visitor4rmindia 18y ago
      I think she's insanely hot! As for smart, she worked as an IT consultant in the UK for over three years. And her IQ is 131 (higher than mine).
russell 18y ago
Safe career is better? Not really. Given that a male is reasonably unlikely to be killed, most men will have wives, but the more competitive, higher paid ones, will get the more desirable women. Remember the company Christmas party? The executives didn't have dogs. The men who dont get wives are those at the bottom of the heap: in jail, on drugs, homeless.