5 ms·

Well can they do that in Richard Stallman's laptop ? If so we are doomed :)

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
tlrobinson 13y ago
Possibly, if they had say, a backdoor in all Intel/AMD processors. The question is what he meant by "We can plant bugs in machines."
- xefer 13y ago
  "We can plant bugs in machines" to me sounds more like a clue that this guy really doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
  - phuff 13y ago
    I think he meant bug as in: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_listening_device http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_listening_device whereas you might be understanding bug as in: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_bug http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_bug
  - cpleppert 13y ago
    Weird phrasing for starters. I mean that isn't how one would describe malware or a rootkit. I can't imagine hardware would be worth the effort if you can just as easily compromise the OS with physical access. I just don't know what to make of this guys story. He has no high school diploma, started out as a security guard and was then given a diplomat cover as a system administrator? He further claims that his job as a systems administrator gave him access to NSA analyst intercept software which I find difficult to believe. I can't imagine use of the software isn't physically locked to a machine in a secure environment. You wouldn't expect a systems administrator to have access to everything, which he claims he had, everything is compartmentalized.
    - adamnemecek 13y ago
      But unlike a rootkit, some HW listening device is resistant to OS reinstalls which I can imagine are pretty common with people that the NSA would target. And I can also imagine that it might be more 'cross-platform'.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- asveikau 13y ago
  This is the biggest problem I have with both the press and administration descriptions of what's going on. There is absolutely no technical specificity. I understand that this isn't useful to the general public but it's hard for technical people to parse what they're saying and draw conclusions.
- SilasX 13y ago
  Not even then. I remember reading about how he uses the freest (as in freedomest) setup he can get: http://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html http://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html He mentions its a Lemote machine which doesn't look like it uses an AMD/Intel processor, as it uses Longsoon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loongson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loongson "Unlike processors from Intel, Advanced Micro Devices or VIA Technologies, Loongson does not support the x86 instruction set. The processor's main operating system is Linux, while in theory any OS with MIPS support should also work."
  - BCM43 13y ago
    Actually, iirc the Chinese made that processor because they were afraid of the US putting backdoors in Intel and AMD chips
    - drdaeman 13y ago
      So they put theirs. Just kidding, obviously. But one can't be sure their hardware's all right, unless they go way beyond what we'd consider reasonable.
- rdtsc 13y ago
  Any experts firmware / low level OS hackers can chime in? I imagine this would be Windows focused, then I guess all bets are off. MS would surely cooperate. Now what about an Open Source OS. NSA and DoD loves them some RHEL (Redhat Enterprise Linux). Would they pay RHEL enough to produce binaries that have backdoors in them? Yeah, CentOS compiles the sources and that's cool. But most organizations buy RHEL for support. Well I would say they would be very stupid to do that as if it ever comes out it will immediately destroy their product. Now, just like PRISM will most likely damage US companies using or offering cloud services, any revelation of an exploit that _could_ have been developed with cooperation form manufacturer would destroy that company's business.
  - sitkack 13y ago
    The hardware would have the backdoor, independent of the software. Think magicpacket http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake-on-LAN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake-on-LAN but with a hypervisor rootkit. At least that is what I would do.
- arthulia 13y ago
  He doesn't use an Intel or AMD processor, he uses some kind of MIPS64 processor called Longsoon.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

Possibly, if they had say, a backdoor in all Intel/AMD processors. The question is what he meant by "We can plant bugs in machines."

xefer 13y ago
"We can plant bugs in machines" to me sounds more like a clue that this guy really doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
- phuff 13y ago
  I think he meant bug as in: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_listening_device http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_listening_device whereas you might be understanding bug as in: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_bug http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_bug
- cpleppert 13y ago
  Weird phrasing for starters. I mean that isn't how one would describe malware or a rootkit. I can't imagine hardware would be worth the effort if you can just as easily compromise the OS with physical access. I just don't know what to make of this guys story. He has no high school diploma, started out as a security guard and was then given a diplomat cover as a system administrator? He further claims that his job as a systems administrator gave him access to NSA analyst intercept software which I find difficult to believe. I can't imagine use of the software isn't physically locked to a machine in a secure environment. You wouldn't expect a systems administrator to have access to everything, which he claims he had, everything is compartmentalized.
  - adamnemecek 13y ago
    But unlike a rootkit, some HW listening device is resistant to OS reinstalls which I can imagine are pretty common with people that the NSA would target. And I can also imagine that it might be more 'cross-platform'.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
asveikau 13y ago
This is the biggest problem I have with both the press and administration descriptions of what's going on. There is absolutely no technical specificity. I understand that this isn't useful to the general public but it's hard for technical people to parse what they're saying and draw conclusions.
SilasX 13y ago
Not even then. I remember reading about how he uses the freest (as in freedomest) setup he can get: http://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html http://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html He mentions its a Lemote machine which doesn't look like it uses an AMD/Intel processor, as it uses Longsoon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loongson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loongson "Unlike processors from Intel, Advanced Micro Devices or VIA Technologies, Loongson does not support the x86 instruction set. The processor's main operating system is Linux, while in theory any OS with MIPS support should also work."
- BCM43 13y ago
  Actually, iirc the Chinese made that processor because they were afraid of the US putting backdoors in Intel and AMD chips
  - drdaeman 13y ago
    So they put theirs. Just kidding, obviously. But one can't be sure their hardware's all right, unless they go way beyond what we'd consider reasonable.
rdtsc 13y ago
Any experts firmware / low level OS hackers can chime in? I imagine this would be Windows focused, then I guess all bets are off. MS would surely cooperate. Now what about an Open Source OS. NSA and DoD loves them some RHEL (Redhat Enterprise Linux). Would they pay RHEL enough to produce binaries that have backdoors in them? Yeah, CentOS compiles the sources and that's cool. But most organizations buy RHEL for support. Well I would say they would be very stupid to do that as if it ever comes out it will immediately destroy their product. Now, just like PRISM will most likely damage US companies using or offering cloud services, any revelation of an exploit that _could_ have been developed with cooperation form manufacturer would destroy that company's business.
- sitkack 13y ago
  The hardware would have the backdoor, independent of the software. Think magicpacket http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake-on-LAN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake-on-LAN but with a hypervisor rootkit. At least that is what I would do.
arthulia 13y ago
He doesn't use an Intel or AMD processor, he uses some kind of MIPS64 processor called Longsoon.