16 ms·

Send money with Gmail

779 points by marcell 13y ago

jsnk 13y ago
Could this potentially hurt Paypal monopoly?
- Khao 13y ago
  As long as it's US-only (as with almost every cool thing Google does) it's not a threat at all.
  - lucb1e 13y ago
    ... it's US-only, again? It won't be long before I just proxy all of my traffic through Amazon s3 or something.
    - gingerlime 13y ago
      ... but you'll probably still have trouble setting a US bank account, S3 proxy or not. (I'm in the same little boat outside of the US territorial waters btw)
    - gph 13y ago
      I doubt a proxy will get you in on this. Google isn't that stupid. Financial transactions are seriously monitored by almost every government. You'll probably have to link to a U.S. bank acct or something.
    - IvyMike 13y ago
      Given the country-specific regulatory red tape that comes with anything involving money, there's more of an excuse than normal to roll this out country-by-country.
      - revelation 13y ago
        Google Wallet is how old now, three+ years? They didn't even bother adding any other way to pay than credit cards. Someone needs to tell them that there are countries where people simply don't use credit cards. They exist, but at cost, and the culture just isn't there. If they continue innovating in the payment space at this rate, they will maybe have a solution people here can actually use in 2020.
        lucb1e 13y ago
        Talking about credit cards, what's the difference between a credit card and just a bank account? At my bank you can get a credit card at an added cost, but it's not needed for anything in the Netherlands so I never looked into it.
        deleted 13y ago
        [deleted]
        maaku 13y ago
        Credit cards have nothing to do with bank accounts. Maybe you're thinking of debit cards?
        lucb1e 13y ago
        Uh yes I guess. With a debit card (we just call them bank cards) you withdraw money from the bank account, but from what I've heard a credit card doesn't work entirely the same.
        maaku 13y ago
        Credit cards are merely debt obligations, and therefore money printing machines. If I have a credit limit of $10k, there isn't actually a $10k account anywhere backing that limit. The bank pays the merchant, yes, but you can follow the trail of that money all the way up to the central bank which created it out of nothing for purpose of fulfilling debt obligations. The money is then destroyed when I pay the bank back at the end of the month. To the consumer they appear basically the same (“they both have the VISA logo right?”), but in understanding the mechanics of what is happening, they could not be more different.
    - TomatoTomato 13y ago
      Tell us more how you can proxy through s3
      - lucb1e 13y ago
        Oh my bad, I meant EC2. I never used AWS since they require a credit card even for the free things.
    - RachelF 13y ago
      Google has been promising non-US/UK only Google wallet since 2008, but never done it.
  - lectrick 13y ago
    Which is also why "bitcoin not affected" will continue.
- fxthea 13y ago
  Interesting that this was PayPal's original plan - to allow people to send money over email.
- jimmy_wobbles 13y ago
  I agree - US-Only is problematic, but I assume they plan to expand it worldwide..
- Jhsto 13y ago
  It is one of the reasons Checkout was introduced in the first place. However, I doubt this will have an instant effect. I'm not sure about the current status, but at some point sellers I contacted couldn't add Google Checkout as payment option as it was US exclusive.
  - agf 13y ago
    Checkout and Wallet are not the same thing.
    - natrius 13y ago
      Wallet grew from Checkout. The Checkout brand is dead, but the functionality is still there in Wallet.
    - Jhsto 13y ago
      Google Checkout was before Wallet, to which I was referring in my comment. They later rebranded to Wallet and indeed rebranded, as I've been able to use my account as it was during Checkout. I don't even own an Android phone, but I use Google's payment option to pay virtual goods from time to time. So, I don't see big difference.
lowglow 13y ago
How quickly can I get money out of google wallet? this url: http://www.google.com/wallet/how-it-works/in-store.html http://www.google.com/wallet/how-it-works/in-store.html doesn't really render properly in chrome. I guess I can spend the money pretty easily once it is in my wallet.
- i_am_good 13y ago
  "Sending money with your Google Wallet Balance is always free and usually instant. You can also send money using your bank account, which may take up to 10 business days to complete. Sending money using your credit or debit card is almost immediate, and usually takes up to a couple of minutes." http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=3122600 http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&ans...
B-Con 13y ago
How is this going to be handled, as a money exchange system ("yo, here's for covering lunch for me yesterday"), or like a payment system ("send your payment to shop@gmail.com")? It seems presented as the former: > you can securely send money to friends and family in the U.S. - without leaving your Gmail inbox but people will assuredly try to use it as the latter. When that happens, how will Google address fraud claims? Edit: Specifically, I mean, how will they investigate fraud claims? Will all transactions be final (easiest), or will they try to refund people who make mistakes (harder)? And what happens when a GMail account gets hacked?
- i_am_good 13y ago
  I just clicked "Get started" and didn't see anything new in Google Wallet page. But in Settings page, now there's a button to provide personal information (SSN, photo ID scan and etc.) They will probably require those for those who opt-in to use Google Wallet.
- NameNickHN 13y ago
  I guess they will handle it like PayPal and all the others.
- potatolicious 13y ago
  > "When that happens, how will Google address fraud claims?" Presumably the same way PayPal handles "personal" funds transfers - they don't. They've specifically flagged this as between friends and family only, which is to say it comes with no warranties. PayPal also has a lower-fee version of their service for the same use case - you get the lower rate in exchange for giving up purchase protection. This is also why when buying things online anyone who asks you to mark the payment as "PayPal gift" should be given a very stern sober second look.
- gesman 13y ago
  If I'd be Google - I'd force senders to have 2-step authentication configured before sending money.
  - rogerbinns 13y ago
axus 13y ago
It's unclear what happens to your Google Wallet balance if your account is closed: 2.4 Relation to your Google Account In order to use Google Wallet Services, you must have a Google Account which is in good standing with Google, in accordance with the Google Terms of Service. If you or Google closes your Google Account for any reason, your Google Wallet Account will also be closed and you will no longer be able to access the Google Wallet Services.
- tommi 13y ago
  It seems pretty clear from that: you loose it.
  - yebyen 13y ago
    That's not clear at all. When you close a bank account, they give you cash. You can't close the account without bringing the balance to $0 (unless it's done by executive fiat / government closed and froze your account with a warrant)
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
jpdoctor 13y ago
I can't wait to send money to Mt Gox.
vinhboy 13y ago
Amazon Payments allows you to send up to $1000 from your credit card for free. Step it up Google.
- VikingCoder 13y ago
  EDIT: It's not Amazon Payments, it's Amazon WebPay.
  - TallGuyShort 13y ago
    Looking for some citations right now, but I think personal usage of Amazon Payments to send money to individuals is much cheaper. I'm familiar with Amazon Checkout which is what you describe above, but longer ago, I did use Amazon Payments to do a personal transfer and it was free. Citation or retraction coming soon... edit: Found it - GP may be referring to this - I have not yet looked at Google's new offering enough to see if this is truly comparable for personal payments, however: Is there a fee for using Amazon WebPay? No, there is no charge to send money using Amazon WebPay. https://payments.amazon.com/sdui/sdui/personal/webpay/faq#wpFee https://payments.amazon.com/sdui/sdui/personal/webpay/faq#wp...
    - VikingCoder 13y ago
      Ah, the main drawback I see about WebPay: "Note: You cannot add funds to your Amazon Payments account by using a credit card."
  - vinhboy 13y ago
    I honestly don't know where they state it, but it's free. It's been a known gift among the dealsites circle for a long time now. Here is an example: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1024148/ http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1024148/ And I know because I use it every month to pay rent with my credit card. For FREE!
decauth 13y ago
While this obviously reduces friction in sending money, it's not clear that this is entirely a good thing. This would definitely make classic social-engineering tricks like Nigerian scams easier to pull off. http://techcrunch.com/2009/01/20/latest-facebook-scam-phishers-hit-up-friends-for-cash/ http://techcrunch.com/2009/01/20/latest-facebook-scam-phishe...
marknutter 13y ago
What's not clear is how a person without a google wallet account claims the money. Is it the same tedious process of having to verify a bank account, give a social security number, promise a first born child, etc.
- gesman 13y ago
  Likely, in paypal-ish way the receiver will be force to Gmail-ize his existence.
- cookiecaper 13y ago
  It should be noted that much of this process is federally mandated across a multitude of regulations. Since 9/11, it has been illegal to open bank accounts without a valid SSN, so that the government can track money more easily. AFAIK, IANAL, IIRC, etc etc etc etc
  - timothya 13y ago
    I've known plenty of people who have opened bank accounts in the US without an SSN. I don't think it's strictly required.
    - dlhavema 13y ago
      yup, bank of america took a lot of heat for doing that, mainly catering to immigrants that come into the US and want a bank account but don't always have an SSN...
    - foobarqux 13y ago
      Which bank? USAA refuses to do it.
    - jordanthoms 13y ago
      I did this with Chase last year. Had to sign a mountain of paperwork though.
    - chx 13y ago
jweir 13y ago
At last the true reason for the Pixel becomes clear: lovely product shots of Google's apps.
codereflection 13y ago
I wonder if this is a re-thinking on what they want to do with Google Checkout, as it hasn't really been taking off in the commerce realm since it's initial release.
droopyEyelids 13y ago
In case there was any ambiguity about whether Google knew the 'real you' from their logging of IPs and search terms, this should remove all of it. In a way I think we're seeing Google striking against Facebook in what I call the "identity wars" where each service is struggling to be an identity and information service about people.
- beagle3 13y ago
  I'm sure google knows the "real you" if they care to look, but at least in the past, they didn't care to look unless there was a court order. Maybe they care now - In what way does this announcement make this more or less evident?
- dragonwriter 13y ago
  > In case there was any ambiguity about whether Google knew the 'real you' from their logging of IPs and search terms, this should remove all of it. How? I mean, obviously, if you use this service (either as a sender or receiver) Google will know more about your real identity as part of conducting the transaction, but how does this say anything about what Google knows "from their logging of IPs and search terms"?
  - VLM 13y ago
    The part I can't figure out is I did "verify my identity" using my legal name, addrs, last4ssn and bday. And it responded back in about 1 second "verified". So how does that work? (Other than perhaps they already have a detailed file on me LOL)
    - drivebyacct2 13y ago
      Better yet, mine failed. I'm presented with this page: http://i.imgur.com/hPqLd58.png http://i.imgur.com/hPqLd58.png On the phone, I'm told roughly: "I'm going to ask you four questions to verify your identity. The questions are based on publicly available data." [hold] (He just asked me the last four of my social and the year of my birth. And my address. And is now preparing four questions. - Where was my SSN issued? Multiple choice. - Which month was I born? Multiple choice. - Which name are you associated with (weird list of names? None of the Above.) - Which county have you lived in? Multiple choice. I answered them correctly, obviously. Now being redirected to a survey.
resu 13y ago
I hope they improved their phishing/scam detection as well. If it only takes a few clicks to 'reply with money', and if the scammer only asks for a small amount, this method seems to have a much lower 'barrier' than wire transfers.
pwenzel 13y ago
Does anyone know what fees are incurred for using this service, and if there is a maximum limit on the transaction amount? I had trouble finding this on the Wallet site. (edit: The FAQ page just says it's free, but doesn't isn't clear about limits)
- jeffasinger 13y ago
  It seems like they charge fees for the sender, if they fund via credit card. Otherwise it's free.
clarkm 13y ago
Ok, so it's 2.9% fee for credit / debit card payments. And I'm assuming the "connect directly to your bank account" is just using ACH transfers, which take a couple days. Anyways, a while ago I heard a rumor that they had a team working on adding some, um... alternative, payment methods. Does anyone know where Google Wallet is headed with this? Edit And here's some clues from the ToS[1]: > 6. Google Wallet Balance & Peer to Peer Payments > 6.1 The P2P Service is currently available only to Senders and Recipients who are U.S. residents and who otherwise meet the requirements of these Terms of Service. The P2P Service may not be used for business, commercial or charitable transactions. > 6.2.a.iii For a Funding Account that is an ACH-enabled checking or savings account, initiate a debit through the ACH Network in the P2P Payment amount. > 6.6 GPC may charge fees in accordance with the then-current fee schedule, as stated herein. Google Wallet may assess a fee of 2.9%, with a minimum fee of $0.30, per P2P Payment charged to the Sender for P2P Payments processed through the Service. Such fee shall be waived where your Google Wallet Balance is used for the P2P Payment, or an ACH-enabled checking or savings account is the Funding Account for the P2P Payment. Looks like they've beat out Dwolla here. Ouch. I'm also really interested in what forbidding "charitable transactions" actually entails. Is it just donations to 501(c)(3)s or is it gifts of other types? How about political donations? And what's its primary purpose? My first thought was that it must be for tax reasons, but then I remembered that people who want to prevent PayPal charge backs often request that payments be marked as "gifts", so it can't be disputed. [1] https://wallet.google.com/legaldocument?family=0.buyertos&gl=US# https://wallet.google.com/legaldocument?family=0.buyertos&#3...
- zrail 13y ago
  You have to go into settings and verify your account and then you can add a bank account, which will allow you to do an ACH transfer.
- dragonwriter 13y ago
  > I'm also really interested in what forbidding "charitable transactions" actually entails. Is it just donations to 501(c)(3)s or is it gifts of other types? How about political donations? And what's its primary purpose? My first thought was that it must be for tax reasons I think its either liability reasons or just market segmentation (so that receivers of the transactions need a merchant account of some kind); note that they don't ever single out "charitable transactions" alone, its always an exclusion of "business, commercial, or charitable transactions" (in several different places in the agreement), so I would assume that the reason for "charitable transactions" is linked to the reason for business and commercial transactions.
jrockway 13y ago
Hi everyone. I've been working on this at Google for a while and would be happy to answer any questions you might have. If you don't want to ask here, feel free to email me at <my username> AT google.com. There might be a delay in responding if I get a lot of messages or if you have a particularly challenging question.
- iheart2code 13y ago
  How can Google Wallet be truly successful if it is only allowed to exist on a (relatively) small subset of mobile devices?
  - jrockway 13y ago
    "Google Wallet" is actually the name for most of the payments-related stuff at Google; visit https://wallet.google.com/ https://wallet.google.com/ for the main interface and http://support.google.com/wallet/?hl=en http://support.google.com/wallet/?hl=en for various articles explaining what you can do in more detail. Pay-by-Gmail, which is what we launched today, is actually used through Gmail on your desktop.
- lectrick 13y ago
  So when will you be integrating with the Bitcoin network? /obligatory
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- Cowen 13y ago
  Will this ever allow for international transfers? If so, is there an ETA?
  - jfoster 13y ago
    It's odd that it's US only because Google Wallet for Digital Goods has been international for quite some time.
godisdad 13y ago
s/Send/Lose
yuvadam 13y ago
> "... and our customer service team will help resolve any questions you might have" Yeah. Right.
prsutherland 13y ago
http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=3026245&ctx=go http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&ans... (linked to from the main article) > Google properties such as Google Play, Google Drive, YouTube etc. are not covered under the Google Wallet Purchase Protection. Please reach out to those products directly through their help centers. Is gmail lumped under the "etc." above?
ereckers 13y ago
Awesome video. The music got me kind of perked up for the day. It almost made me forget that nobody uses Google Wallet. We've run an ecommerce store with a decent amount of throughput for about 5 years now and I think we had 1 person try and pay with Google Wallet (and she was a Google employee and friend at the time). I'm probably off on the whole thing here, because the examples in the vid show it as sort of a way to make good with your pals and not so much for ecommerce, but being an old timer, I sort of like to leave my money transfers to people that specialize in it and not as an add-on to my email client.
- JoeKM 13y ago
  Uh, given the mega conglomerate Google is making themselves out to be, I think it's safe to say Google knows how to deal with money transferring (at least in the U.S.). You are right though, this service reads and is purposely marketed as a way to exchange money between close circles, and not service your eCommerce store.
ernestipark 13y ago
This could be a huge dagger to apps like Venmo. This is so much more convenient than using Bank of America. Also note you need to verify your identity before you hook up your bank acct.
tzz 13y ago
jrockway, You said to ask you any questions, so far you only answered one single question for the last hour. Why would you say ask me anything and don't respond to the questions?
- rogerbinns 13y ago
  All the questions are pretty much the same - given Google's track record of avoiding human interaction and examples of being arbitrary, why should we trust them this time?
- jrockway 13y ago
  I'm not sure what you're talking about. I've answered all the questions that have an answer. The rest just seem to be rants.
pg 13y ago
I think this is going to be really big. But it might require actual customer service; that must have made them think twice.
- wtallis 13y ago
  They've already started to bite the bullet and provide real customer service with Google Fiber. We could be witnessing a huge change in their institutional attitude toward customer service.
  - OJKoukaz 13y ago
    Will better service from Google Fiber, and other large providers, push Comcast to provide a better customer service/support experience?
    - Laremere 13y ago
      No, those who care about service will switch to google fiber. Then Comcast will see that the number of complaints about their service is decreasing, and go on to praise their employees. For now companies which should be scared of Google Fiber aren't. It took the US years and lot of tax money to build the infrastructure which current ISPs own. Google has done parts of one city with only 2 more on the way. It will take a long time until their business practices cause them failure against fiber competitors. ISPs aren't interested in improving their networks, only in making money off of the money they've invested into at this point.
      - mellotron 13y ago
        Didn't Google already buy up a ton of dark fiber backbone? GFiber may be closer to disrupting the national ISP market than we think
- joosters 13y ago
  That didn't stop them from rolling out Google Checkout with any (human) customer service, as I painfully discovered :( Google seem allergic to phone or email contact with users.
wilfra 13y ago
Very interesting how they structured the fees. Instead of how PayPal, Square, Stripe and just about everybody else in the World does it, where it is free to send money but merchants must pay a fee to receive it - they are making it always free for merchants and free for users who pay from a bank account or G Wallet balance - and users who want to pay by debit or CC have to pay a fee. I'm not sure how the market will react to that but it's clearly deliberate and could turn into a great way to drive adoption, as merchants will clearly prefer to use G Wallet with no fees and will push their users toward that whenever possible. (I realize this is being marketed as P2P but if they intend to take down PayPal et al, it will surely evolve into a way to pay merchants for things).
- encoderer 13y ago
  Seems almost like their wish would be free for everybody, but of course Google has to pay to process your credit card so they can't very well give you that for free. And if they charged you anything less than 1% for CC transactions, even if it cost them less than that, they'd have people gaming it for the purpose of accumulating CC rewards like cashback and airline miles.
brohoolio 13y ago
Will users need to have 2 step turned on for this service? I work at a large place, about 100k people, and we have at least 10 compromised accounts a week.
ziko 13y ago
I can't believe how Paypal isn't out of business. With their poor service, dire fees and all. It's become a very poor service. It's a massive market. Google has hit a jackpot there. I salute then.
- JoeKM 13y ago
  PayPal is global, for one, and they have reputable foundation. They have brand recognition too. You and me know about Stripe/Google Wallet/Amazon Payments/Dwolla/etc. but does John Doe from Craigslist/Ebay/"Mom & Pop shop" know about them?
  - ziko 13y ago
    No but if he uses Gmail (and it's a pretty good chance) he will. If not, he will find out sooner or later. Paypal's era is coming to an end, it was just a matter of time who would have claimed it. Luckily, it was Google rather than Facebook.
- BoyWizard 13y ago
  Until a new payment provider can match Paypal for non-US payments (https://www.paypal.com/worldwide/ https://www.paypal.com/worldwide/) then Paypal will be the leader.
ChuckMcM 13y ago
Interesting move on Google's part. Clearly the payments space is a getting a lot of investment from both big and small players each with their own take on it. It is also the first time that it felt like Google was stepping where it might not belong. And its a weird thing since I believe anyone should be able to do anything and let the market decide. For some reason this gave me the same vibe I used to get when a Microsoft would announce they were going to enter some hot new market in order to chill any investment/work in that market. I don't think that is their plan, but perhaps its a happy side effect they get? I'd much rather see Google create an actual bank and then integrate with that banks services than do it this way.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
jiggy2011 13y ago
Hmm, if they were devious they could use this to get people to sign up for G+ and by allowing micropayments to G+ accounts (they can be sent from anywhere). People will just through hoops to receive money.
r00fus 13y ago
A few years ago, this would've been the equivalent of an April Fools google gag. It's pretty amazing that it's possible now and so easy.
beat 13y ago
I don't see why this is such a big deal. I've been able to send money via gmail for a long time now! My penis is bigger, I can get drugs from Canada, my hair has grown back, and I've discovered long-lost wealthy relatives in Nigeria!
clavalle 13y ago
Hmm. Can I filter by amount of cash attached? That will make things easier to organize.
kin 13y ago
I use Venmo to send money between friends. It is the ideal way to deal with dinner bills. "Everyone just Venmo me $11". $ is sent immediately to my Venmo balance and I can cash out at any point. The biggest problem with Venmo was users. Only my close group of friends has Venmo but with co-workers or strangers we have to resort to cash and bill splits. Pretty much everyone I know has Gmail. Google just made Venmo obsolete.
deleted 13y ago
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brokentone 13y ago
Interesting timing. Amazon coin also popping up as well, and Mt. Gox going down.
luke_s 13y ago
I know this will just get burred under the 428 comments this story already has - but can we _please_ change the title to include "Within the US" Not all of the worlds 7 billion people live in the united states you know ...
blantonl 13y ago
If I was a betting man, I'd say this is almost certainly a preemptive strike against something that Apple plans to release.
bthomas 13y ago
This seems like such an obvious thing for Facebook to do - any guesses as to why they haven't?
droopyEyelids 13y ago
I wonder about the morality of this move. They basically replicating venmo exactly. I know it's legal if there isn't a patent, but it sure feels bullyish to me.
rsankar 13y ago
How is this different than paypal?
ardiyu07 13y ago
How secure is this?
whoisthemachine 13y ago
Wow!
bogrollben 13y ago
Dwolla killa?
fianchetto 13y ago
I'd trust Google with my money just like I'd trust them with my real world information. /s
espeed 13y ago
Google Wallet is using Bancorp Bank (https://wallet.google.com/termsOfService?type=BUYER&gl=US https://wallet.google.com/termsOfService?type=BUYER&gl=U...), the same as Simple.com -- so it's possible bank-account transactions could be made fast if you use Simple for your bank.
dschiptsov 13y ago
US only.
tyang 13y ago
Now might be a good time to activate two-step verification to login to Gmail.
anuraj 13y ago
Thanks, but no thanks! Don't trust you with my money. kudos for the service though.
fizzbar 13y ago
Wow. Leverage all those reams of data about us to freeze out fraudsters... Impressive/scary if they pull it off. Hopefully they don't make too many false-positives that result in innocent bystanders being banished from the Kingdom of the Google.
josephagoss 13y ago
Imagine if Google set this up for Bitcoin? Every Google user gets a Bitcoin wallet stored in their profile, and they can use this as a web wallet to send and receive Bitcoins.
digitalengineer 13y ago
Finally. Let's hope they can hook it up with the Play Store and Adsense (so they can add money to that account automatically). I think that will make a dent in PayPal's universe.
quattrofan 13y ago
No thanks, I'll use bitcoin.
contingencies 13y ago
Massive centralisation: information habits, social circles, spending patterns. Globally. Where does the "not evil" part come in? It doesn't.

779 points by marcell 13y ago

jsnk 13y ago

Could this potentially hurt Paypal monopoly?

Khao 13y ago
As long as it's US-only (as with almost every cool thing Google does) it's not a threat at all.
- lucb1e 13y ago
  ... it's US-only, again? It won't be long before I just proxy all of my traffic through Amazon s3 or something.
  - gingerlime 13y ago
    ... but you'll probably still have trouble setting a US bank account, S3 proxy or not. (I'm in the same little boat outside of the US territorial waters btw)
  - gph 13y ago
    I doubt a proxy will get you in on this. Google isn't that stupid. Financial transactions are seriously monitored by almost every government. You'll probably have to link to a U.S. bank acct or something.
  - IvyMike 13y ago
    Given the country-specific regulatory red tape that comes with anything involving money, there's more of an excuse than normal to roll this out country-by-country.
    - revelation 13y ago
      Google Wallet is how old now, three+ years? They didn't even bother adding any other way to pay than credit cards. Someone needs to tell them that there are countries where people simply don't use credit cards. They exist, but at cost, and the culture just isn't there. If they continue innovating in the payment space at this rate, they will maybe have a solution people here can actually use in 2020.
      - lucb1e 13y ago
        Talking about credit cards, what's the difference between a credit card and just a bank account? At my bank you can get a credit card at an added cost, but it's not needed for anything in the Netherlands so I never looked into it.
        deleted 13y ago
        [deleted]
        maaku 13y ago
        Credit cards have nothing to do with bank accounts. Maybe you're thinking of debit cards?
        lucb1e 13y ago
        Uh yes I guess. With a debit card (we just call them bank cards) you withdraw money from the bank account, but from what I've heard a credit card doesn't work entirely the same.
        maaku 13y ago
        Credit cards are merely debt obligations, and therefore money printing machines. If I have a credit limit of $10k, there isn't actually a $10k account anywhere backing that limit. The bank pays the merchant, yes, but you can follow the trail of that money all the way up to the central bank which created it out of nothing for purpose of fulfilling debt obligations. The money is then destroyed when I pay the bank back at the end of the month. To the consumer they appear basically the same (“they both have the VISA logo right?”), but in understanding the mechanics of what is happening, they could not be more different.
  - TomatoTomato 13y ago
    Tell us more how you can proxy through s3
    - lucb1e 13y ago
      Oh my bad, I meant EC2. I never used AWS since they require a credit card even for the free things.
  - RachelF 13y ago
    Google has been promising non-US/UK only Google wallet since 2008, but never done it.
- lectrick 13y ago
  Which is also why "bitcoin not affected" will continue.
fxthea 13y ago
Interesting that this was PayPal's original plan - to allow people to send money over email.
jimmy_wobbles 13y ago
I agree - US-Only is problematic, but I assume they plan to expand it worldwide..
Jhsto 13y ago
It is one of the reasons Checkout was introduced in the first place. However, I doubt this will have an instant effect. I'm not sure about the current status, but at some point sellers I contacted couldn't add Google Checkout as payment option as it was US exclusive.
- agf 13y ago
  Checkout and Wallet are not the same thing.
  - natrius 13y ago
    Wallet grew from Checkout. The Checkout brand is dead, but the functionality is still there in Wallet.
  - Jhsto 13y ago
    Google Checkout was before Wallet, to which I was referring in my comment. They later rebranded to Wallet and indeed rebranded, as I've been able to use my account as it was during Checkout. I don't even own an Android phone, but I use Google's payment option to pay virtual goods from time to time. So, I don't see big difference.

lowglow 13y ago

How quickly can I get money out of google wallet? this url: http://www.google.com/wallet/how-it-works/in-store.html http://www.google.com/wallet/how-it-works/in-store.html doesn't really render properly in chrome. I guess I can spend the money pretty easily once it is in my wallet.

i_am_good 13y ago
"Sending money with your Google Wallet Balance is always free and usually instant. You can also send money using your bank account, which may take up to 10 business days to complete. Sending money using your credit or debit card is almost immediate, and usually takes up to a couple of minutes." http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=3122600 http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&ans...

B-Con 13y ago

How is this going to be handled, as a money exchange system ("yo, here's for covering lunch for me yesterday"), or like a payment system ("send your payment to shop@gmail.com")? It seems presented as the former: > you can securely send money to friends and family in the U.S. - without leaving your Gmail inbox but people will assuredly try to use it as the latter. When that happens, how will Google address fraud claims? Edit: Specifically, I mean, how will they investigate fraud claims? Will all transactions be final (easiest), or will they try to refund people who make mistakes (harder)? And what happens when a GMail account gets hacked?

i_am_good 13y ago
I just clicked "Get started" and didn't see anything new in Google Wallet page. But in Settings page, now there's a button to provide personal information (SSN, photo ID scan and etc.) They will probably require those for those who opt-in to use Google Wallet.
NameNickHN 13y ago
I guess they will handle it like PayPal and all the others.
potatolicious 13y ago
> "When that happens, how will Google address fraud claims?" Presumably the same way PayPal handles "personal" funds transfers - they don't. They've specifically flagged this as between friends and family only, which is to say it comes with no warranties. PayPal also has a lower-fee version of their service for the same use case - you get the lower rate in exchange for giving up purchase protection. This is also why when buying things online anyone who asks you to mark the payment as "PayPal gift" should be given a very stern sober second look.
gesman 13y ago
If I'd be Google - I'd force senders to have 2-step authentication configured before sending money.
- rogerbinns 13y ago

axus 13y ago

It's unclear what happens to your Google Wallet balance if your account is closed: 2.4 Relation to your Google Account In order to use Google Wallet Services, you must have a Google Account which is in good standing with Google, in accordance with the Google Terms of Service. If you or Google closes your Google Account for any reason, your Google Wallet Account will also be closed and you will no longer be able to access the Google Wallet Services.

tommi 13y ago
It seems pretty clear from that: you loose it.
- yebyen 13y ago
  That's not clear at all. When you close a bank account, they give you cash. You can't close the account without bringing the balance to $0 (unless it's done by executive fiat / government closed and froze your account with a warrant)

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

jpdoctor 13y ago

I can't wait to send money to Mt Gox.

vinhboy 13y ago

Amazon Payments allows you to send up to $1000 from your credit card for free. Step it up Google.

VikingCoder 13y ago
EDIT: It's not Amazon Payments, it's Amazon WebPay.
- TallGuyShort 13y ago
  Looking for some citations right now, but I think personal usage of Amazon Payments to send money to individuals is much cheaper. I'm familiar with Amazon Checkout which is what you describe above, but longer ago, I did use Amazon Payments to do a personal transfer and it was free. Citation or retraction coming soon... edit: Found it - GP may be referring to this - I have not yet looked at Google's new offering enough to see if this is truly comparable for personal payments, however: Is there a fee for using Amazon WebPay? No, there is no charge to send money using Amazon WebPay. https://payments.amazon.com/sdui/sdui/personal/webpay/faq#wpFee https://payments.amazon.com/sdui/sdui/personal/webpay/faq#wp...
  - VikingCoder 13y ago
    Ah, the main drawback I see about WebPay: "Note: You cannot add funds to your Amazon Payments account by using a credit card."
- vinhboy 13y ago
  I honestly don't know where they state it, but it's free. It's been a known gift among the dealsites circle for a long time now. Here is an example: http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1024148/ http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1024148/ And I know because I use it every month to pay rent with my credit card. For FREE!

decauth 13y ago

While this obviously reduces friction in sending money, it's not clear that this is entirely a good thing. This would definitely make classic social-engineering tricks like Nigerian scams easier to pull off. http://techcrunch.com/2009/01/20/latest-facebook-scam-phishers-hit-up-friends-for-cash/ http://techcrunch.com/2009/01/20/latest-facebook-scam-phishe...

marknutter 13y ago

What's not clear is how a person without a google wallet account claims the money. Is it the same tedious process of having to verify a bank account, give a social security number, promise a first born child, etc.

gesman 13y ago
Likely, in paypal-ish way the receiver will be force to Gmail-ize his existence.
cookiecaper 13y ago
It should be noted that much of this process is federally mandated across a multitude of regulations. Since 9/11, it has been illegal to open bank accounts without a valid SSN, so that the government can track money more easily. AFAIK, IANAL, IIRC, etc etc etc etc
- timothya 13y ago
  I've known plenty of people who have opened bank accounts in the US without an SSN. I don't think it's strictly required.
  - dlhavema 13y ago
    yup, bank of america took a lot of heat for doing that, mainly catering to immigrants that come into the US and want a bank account but don't always have an SSN...
  - foobarqux 13y ago
    Which bank? USAA refuses to do it.
  - jordanthoms 13y ago
    I did this with Chase last year. Had to sign a mountain of paperwork though.
  - chx 13y ago

jweir 13y ago

At last the true reason for the Pixel becomes clear: lovely product shots of Google's apps.

codereflection 13y ago

I wonder if this is a re-thinking on what they want to do with Google Checkout, as it hasn't really been taking off in the commerce realm since it's initial release.

droopyEyelids 13y ago

In case there was any ambiguity about whether Google knew the 'real you' from their logging of IPs and search terms, this should remove all of it. In a way I think we're seeing Google striking against Facebook in what I call the "identity wars" where each service is struggling to be an identity and information service about people.

beagle3 13y ago
I'm sure google knows the "real you" if they care to look, but at least in the past, they didn't care to look unless there was a court order. Maybe they care now - In what way does this announcement make this more or less evident?
dragonwriter 13y ago
> In case there was any ambiguity about whether Google knew the 'real you' from their logging of IPs and search terms, this should remove all of it. How? I mean, obviously, if you use this service (either as a sender or receiver) Google will know more about your real identity as part of conducting the transaction, but how does this say anything about what Google knows "from their logging of IPs and search terms"?
- VLM 13y ago
  The part I can't figure out is I did "verify my identity" using my legal name, addrs, last4ssn and bday. And it responded back in about 1 second "verified". So how does that work? (Other than perhaps they already have a detailed file on me LOL)
  - drivebyacct2 13y ago
    Better yet, mine failed. I'm presented with this page: http://i.imgur.com/hPqLd58.png http://i.imgur.com/hPqLd58.png On the phone, I'm told roughly: "I'm going to ask you four questions to verify your identity. The questions are based on publicly available data." [hold] (He just asked me the last four of my social and the year of my birth. And my address. And is now preparing four questions. - Where was my SSN issued? Multiple choice. - Which month was I born? Multiple choice. - Which name are you associated with (weird list of names? None of the Above.) - Which county have you lived in? Multiple choice. I answered them correctly, obviously. Now being redirected to a survey.

resu 13y ago

I hope they improved their phishing/scam detection as well. If it only takes a few clicks to 'reply with money', and if the scammer only asks for a small amount, this method seems to have a much lower 'barrier' than wire transfers.

pwenzel 13y ago

Does anyone know what fees are incurred for using this service, and if there is a maximum limit on the transaction amount? I had trouble finding this on the Wallet site. (edit: The FAQ page just says it's free, but doesn't isn't clear about limits)

jeffasinger 13y ago
It seems like they charge fees for the sender, if they fund via credit card. Otherwise it's free.

clarkm 13y ago

Ok, so it's 2.9% fee for credit / debit card payments. And I'm assuming the "connect directly to your bank account" is just using ACH transfers, which take a couple days. Anyways, a while ago I heard a rumor that they had a team working on adding some, um... alternative, payment methods. Does anyone know where Google Wallet is headed with this? Edit And here's some clues from the ToS[1]: > 6. Google Wallet Balance & Peer to Peer Payments > 6.1 The P2P Service is currently available only to Senders and Recipients who are U.S. residents and who otherwise meet the requirements of these Terms of Service. The P2P Service may not be used for business, commercial or charitable transactions. > 6.2.a.iii For a Funding Account that is an ACH-enabled checking or savings account, initiate a debit through the ACH Network in the P2P Payment amount. > 6.6 GPC may charge fees in accordance with the then-current fee schedule, as stated herein. Google Wallet may assess a fee of 2.9%, with a minimum fee of $0.30, per P2P Payment charged to the Sender for P2P Payments processed through the Service. Such fee shall be waived where your Google Wallet Balance is used for the P2P Payment, or an ACH-enabled checking or savings account is the Funding Account for the P2P Payment. Looks like they've beat out Dwolla here. Ouch. I'm also really interested in what forbidding "charitable transactions" actually entails. Is it just donations to 501(c)(3)s or is it gifts of other types? How about political donations? And what's its primary purpose? My first thought was that it must be for tax reasons, but then I remembered that people who want to prevent PayPal charge backs often request that payments be marked as "gifts", so it can't be disputed. [1] https://wallet.google.com/legaldocument?family=0.buyertos&gl=US# https://wallet.google.com/legaldocument?family=0.buyertos&#3...

zrail 13y ago
You have to go into settings and verify your account and then you can add a bank account, which will allow you to do an ACH transfer.
dragonwriter 13y ago
> I'm also really interested in what forbidding "charitable transactions" actually entails. Is it just donations to 501(c)(3)s or is it gifts of other types? How about political donations? And what's its primary purpose? My first thought was that it must be for tax reasons I think its either liability reasons or just market segmentation (so that receivers of the transactions need a merchant account of some kind); note that they don't ever single out "charitable transactions" alone, its always an exclusion of "business, commercial, or charitable transactions" (in several different places in the agreement), so I would assume that the reason for "charitable transactions" is linked to the reason for business and commercial transactions.

jrockway 13y ago

Hi everyone. I've been working on this at Google for a while and would be happy to answer any questions you might have. If you don't want to ask here, feel free to email me at <my username> AT google.com. There might be a delay in responding if I get a lot of messages or if you have a particularly challenging question.

iheart2code 13y ago
How can Google Wallet be truly successful if it is only allowed to exist on a (relatively) small subset of mobile devices?
- jrockway 13y ago
  "Google Wallet" is actually the name for most of the payments-related stuff at Google; visit https://wallet.google.com/ https://wallet.google.com/ for the main interface and http://support.google.com/wallet/?hl=en http://support.google.com/wallet/?hl=en for various articles explaining what you can do in more detail. Pay-by-Gmail, which is what we launched today, is actually used through Gmail on your desktop.
lectrick 13y ago
So when will you be integrating with the Bitcoin network? /obligatory
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
Cowen 13y ago
Will this ever allow for international transfers? If so, is there an ETA?
- jfoster 13y ago
  It's odd that it's US only because Google Wallet for Digital Goods has been international for quite some time.

godisdad 13y ago

s/Send/Lose

yuvadam 13y ago

> "... and our customer service team will help resolve any questions you might have" Yeah. Right.

prsutherland 13y ago

http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=3026245&ctx=go http://support.google.com/wallet/bin/answer.py?hl=en&ans... (linked to from the main article) > Google properties such as Google Play, Google Drive, YouTube etc. are not covered under the Google Wallet Purchase Protection. Please reach out to those products directly through their help centers. Is gmail lumped under the "etc." above?

ereckers 13y ago

Awesome video. The music got me kind of perked up for the day. It almost made me forget that nobody uses Google Wallet. We've run an ecommerce store with a decent amount of throughput for about 5 years now and I think we had 1 person try and pay with Google Wallet (and she was a Google employee and friend at the time). I'm probably off on the whole thing here, because the examples in the vid show it as sort of a way to make good with your pals and not so much for ecommerce, but being an old timer, I sort of like to leave my money transfers to people that specialize in it and not as an add-on to my email client.

JoeKM 13y ago
Uh, given the mega conglomerate Google is making themselves out to be, I think it's safe to say Google knows how to deal with money transferring (at least in the U.S.). You are right though, this service reads and is purposely marketed as a way to exchange money between close circles, and not service your eCommerce store.

ernestipark 13y ago

This could be a huge dagger to apps like Venmo. This is so much more convenient than using Bank of America. Also note you need to verify your identity before you hook up your bank acct.

tzz 13y ago

jrockway, You said to ask you any questions, so far you only answered one single question for the last hour. Why would you say ask me anything and don't respond to the questions?

rogerbinns 13y ago
All the questions are pretty much the same - given Google's track record of avoiding human interaction and examples of being arbitrary, why should we trust them this time?
jrockway 13y ago
I'm not sure what you're talking about. I've answered all the questions that have an answer. The rest just seem to be rants.

pg 13y ago

I think this is going to be really big. But it might require actual customer service; that must have made them think twice.

wtallis 13y ago
They've already started to bite the bullet and provide real customer service with Google Fiber. We could be witnessing a huge change in their institutional attitude toward customer service.
- OJKoukaz 13y ago
  Will better service from Google Fiber, and other large providers, push Comcast to provide a better customer service/support experience?
  - Laremere 13y ago
    No, those who care about service will switch to google fiber. Then Comcast will see that the number of complaints about their service is decreasing, and go on to praise their employees. For now companies which should be scared of Google Fiber aren't. It took the US years and lot of tax money to build the infrastructure which current ISPs own. Google has done parts of one city with only 2 more on the way. It will take a long time until their business practices cause them failure against fiber competitors. ISPs aren't interested in improving their networks, only in making money off of the money they've invested into at this point.
    - mellotron 13y ago
      Didn't Google already buy up a ton of dark fiber backbone? GFiber may be closer to disrupting the national ISP market than we think
joosters 13y ago
That didn't stop them from rolling out Google Checkout with any (human) customer service, as I painfully discovered :( Google seem allergic to phone or email contact with users.

wilfra 13y ago

Very interesting how they structured the fees. Instead of how PayPal, Square, Stripe and just about everybody else in the World does it, where it is free to send money but merchants must pay a fee to receive it - they are making it always free for merchants and free for users who pay from a bank account or G Wallet balance - and users who want to pay by debit or CC have to pay a fee. I'm not sure how the market will react to that but it's clearly deliberate and could turn into a great way to drive adoption, as merchants will clearly prefer to use G Wallet with no fees and will push their users toward that whenever possible. (I realize this is being marketed as P2P but if they intend to take down PayPal et al, it will surely evolve into a way to pay merchants for things).

encoderer 13y ago
Seems almost like their wish would be free for everybody, but of course Google has to pay to process your credit card so they can't very well give you that for free. And if they charged you anything less than 1% for CC transactions, even if it cost them less than that, they'd have people gaming it for the purpose of accumulating CC rewards like cashback and airline miles.

brohoolio 13y ago

Will users need to have 2 step turned on for this service? I work at a large place, about 100k people, and we have at least 10 compromised accounts a week.

ziko 13y ago

I can't believe how Paypal isn't out of business. With their poor service, dire fees and all. It's become a very poor service. It's a massive market. Google has hit a jackpot there. I salute then.

JoeKM 13y ago
PayPal is global, for one, and they have reputable foundation. They have brand recognition too. You and me know about Stripe/Google Wallet/Amazon Payments/Dwolla/etc. but does John Doe from Craigslist/Ebay/"Mom & Pop shop" know about them?
- ziko 13y ago
  No but if he uses Gmail (and it's a pretty good chance) he will. If not, he will find out sooner or later. Paypal's era is coming to an end, it was just a matter of time who would have claimed it. Luckily, it was Google rather than Facebook.
BoyWizard 13y ago
Until a new payment provider can match Paypal for non-US payments (https://www.paypal.com/worldwide/ https://www.paypal.com/worldwide/) then Paypal will be the leader.

ChuckMcM 13y ago

Interesting move on Google's part. Clearly the payments space is a getting a lot of investment from both big and small players each with their own take on it. It is also the first time that it felt like Google was stepping where it might not belong. And its a weird thing since I believe anyone should be able to do anything and let the market decide. For some reason this gave me the same vibe I used to get when a Microsoft would announce they were going to enter some hot new market in order to chill any investment/work in that market. I don't think that is their plan, but perhaps its a happy side effect they get? I'd much rather see Google create an actual bank and then integrate with that banks services than do it this way.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

jiggy2011 13y ago

Hmm, if they were devious they could use this to get people to sign up for G+ and by allowing micropayments to G+ accounts (they can be sent from anywhere). People will just through hoops to receive money.

r00fus 13y ago

A few years ago, this would've been the equivalent of an April Fools google gag. It's pretty amazing that it's possible now and so easy.

beat 13y ago

I don't see why this is such a big deal. I've been able to send money via gmail for a long time now! My penis is bigger, I can get drugs from Canada, my hair has grown back, and I've discovered long-lost wealthy relatives in Nigeria!

clavalle 13y ago

Hmm. Can I filter by amount of cash attached? That will make things easier to organize.

kin 13y ago

I use Venmo to send money between friends. It is the ideal way to deal with dinner bills. "Everyone just Venmo me $11". $ is sent immediately to my Venmo balance and I can cash out at any point. The biggest problem with Venmo was users. Only my close group of friends has Venmo but with co-workers or strangers we have to resort to cash and bill splits. Pretty much everyone I know has Gmail. Google just made Venmo obsolete.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

brokentone 13y ago

Interesting timing. Amazon coin also popping up as well, and Mt. Gox going down.

luke_s 13y ago

I know this will just get burred under the 428 comments this story already has - but can we _please_ change the title to include "Within the US" Not all of the worlds 7 billion people live in the united states you know ...

blantonl 13y ago

If I was a betting man, I'd say this is almost certainly a preemptive strike against something that Apple plans to release.

bthomas 13y ago

This seems like such an obvious thing for Facebook to do - any guesses as to why they haven't?

droopyEyelids 13y ago

I wonder about the morality of this move. They basically replicating venmo exactly. I know it's legal if there isn't a patent, but it sure feels bullyish to me.

rsankar 13y ago

How is this different than paypal?

ardiyu07 13y ago

How secure is this?

whoisthemachine 13y ago

Wow!

bogrollben 13y ago

Dwolla killa?

fianchetto 13y ago

I'd trust Google with my money just like I'd trust them with my real world information. /s

espeed 13y ago

Google Wallet is using Bancorp Bank (https://wallet.google.com/termsOfService?type=BUYER&gl=US https://wallet.google.com/termsOfService?type=BUYER&gl=U...), the same as Simple.com -- so it's possible bank-account transactions could be made fast if you use Simple for your bank.

dschiptsov 13y ago

US only.

tyang 13y ago

Now might be a good time to activate two-step verification to login to Gmail.

anuraj 13y ago

Thanks, but no thanks! Don't trust you with my money. kudos for the service though.

fizzbar 13y ago

Wow. Leverage all those reams of data about us to freeze out fraudsters... Impressive/scary if they pull it off. Hopefully they don't make too many false-positives that result in innocent bystanders being banished from the Kingdom of the Google.

josephagoss 13y ago

Imagine if Google set this up for Bitcoin? Every Google user gets a Bitcoin wallet stored in their profile, and they can use this as a web wallet to send and receive Bitcoins.

digitalengineer 13y ago

Finally. Let's hope they can hook it up with the Play Store and Adsense (so they can add money to that account automatically). I think that will make a dent in PayPal's universe.

quattrofan 13y ago

No thanks, I'll use bitcoin.

contingencies 13y ago

Massive centralisation: information habits, social circles, spending patterns. Globally. Where does the "not evil" part come in? It doesn't.