4 ms·

Why do state employees enjoy the privilege of pensions and free healthcare? Why can't we force them into the real world of shitty insurance plans, financial res

Why do state employees enjoy the privilege of pensions and free healthcare? Why can't we force them into the real world of shitty insurance plans, financial responsibility for their own retirement supplemented by social security checks, you know, the life style that private sector employees are "enjoying"? By "private sector" I don't mean the tiny group of high-tech workers and other 6-figure professionals, but regular people who represent the median $61K/household income, just to be clear. Isn't this just utterly fucked up: to pay for state employees entitlements while not being eligible to receive any ourselves? I was hoping that California will simply go bankrupt and we'll be given a chance to start from scratch, but apparently a State cannot be bankrupted, so how are we supposed to get rid of Sacramento without resorting to violence? "Voting them out" is clearly not working because they're simply lying on the ballots now.

rdl 14y ago
I'd far rather move (even just within the US) than resort to violence. WA, TX, NV, etc. all seem comparatively well governed. The natural environment in CA is a plus, and it still has the best overall nexus of capital, startups, and people, but that advantage is rapidly declining vs. other states.
- seanmcdirmid 14y ago
  WA put in the same bucket as TX, that's a bit wrong. Washington has decent public schools, Texas is notorious for how bad it's schools are...
  - rdl 14y ago
    I just meant "has tech jobs, isn't insolvent". I didn't know anything about TX schools (UT-Austin is great, as is UW, but I assume the discussion is mainly about K-12).
    - seanmcdirmid 14y ago
      UTA is ok, not as good as UW. Washington K12 is in a different league from Texas, which suffers from a completely dysfunctional non government. California has much better weather than Texas. There is a reason housing prices continue to rise in CA while they are basically stagnant in TX. Don't brush off Cali because of a few gov problems, they will still continue to kick every other state's ass in the long run. Anyways, I'm happy as long as Californians move to Texas and not Washington.
      - rdl 14y ago
        It is almost as if you have a weird ulterior motive of trying to keep unproductive yet meddlesome California voters out of Washington, while at the same time reinforcing that Washington is one of the best states in the US, particularly for tech entrepreneurs. I wonder why? :)
        seanmcdirmid 14y ago
        As a PNW native, I have lots of in common with our west coast brothers and sisters, but Californians drive our housing prices up and aren't as friendly in traffic. So if you are from California and looking for some place new, please remember Seattle has LOTS OF RAIN. Texas has lots of sun in comparison, you'll be happier there instead of Seattle where it rains 49 weeks out of the year.
eli_gottlieb 14y ago
Why do state employees enjoy the privilege of pensions and free healthcare? Why can't we force them into the real world of shitty insurance plans, financial responsibility for their own retirement supplemented by social security checks, you know, the life style that private sector employees are "enjoying"? Why not broadly improve compensation packages in the private sector to keep up with productivity, which would increase the tax base and allow each individual's tax burden to take a smaller share of their income?
- yummyfajitas 14y ago
  We have. But most productivity gains (together with comp gains) are driven by the top, not the median or bottom. A burger flipper produces as much now as ever before. Productivity went up because of the computerized jit inventory infrastructure bringing mass produced frozen burgers to him, the highly optimized recipes he mindlessly follows, etc. The guys who built all that stuff are paid well.
  - FelixP 14y ago
    Actually, thanks to modern logistics and restaurant management software, I'd posit that an average burger-flipper today is substantially more productive than the average burger-flipper was 50 years ago.
    - yummyfajitas 14y ago
      The total output of a McD's with 5 burger flippers certainly did go up, but not due to anything the burger flippers are doing. There is no reason why the burger flippers wages should go up as a result.
wildgift 14y ago
It is unfair, but it would be better to focus on how to lift more people up to the level of teacher retirements than to bring teachers down. Trying to lift all boats strengthens and enlarges the middle class.

rdl 14y ago

I'd far rather move (even just within the US) than resort to violence. WA, TX, NV, etc. all seem comparatively well governed. The natural environment in CA is a plus, and it still has the best overall nexus of capital, startups, and people, but that advantage is rapidly declining vs. other states.

seanmcdirmid 14y ago
WA put in the same bucket as TX, that's a bit wrong. Washington has decent public schools, Texas is notorious for how bad it's schools are...
- rdl 14y ago
  I just meant "has tech jobs, isn't insolvent". I didn't know anything about TX schools (UT-Austin is great, as is UW, but I assume the discussion is mainly about K-12).
  - seanmcdirmid 14y ago
    UTA is ok, not as good as UW. Washington K12 is in a different league from Texas, which suffers from a completely dysfunctional non government. California has much better weather than Texas. There is a reason housing prices continue to rise in CA while they are basically stagnant in TX. Don't brush off Cali because of a few gov problems, they will still continue to kick every other state's ass in the long run. Anyways, I'm happy as long as Californians move to Texas and not Washington.
    - rdl 14y ago
      It is almost as if you have a weird ulterior motive of trying to keep unproductive yet meddlesome California voters out of Washington, while at the same time reinforcing that Washington is one of the best states in the US, particularly for tech entrepreneurs. I wonder why? :)
      - seanmcdirmid 14y ago
        As a PNW native, I have lots of in common with our west coast brothers and sisters, but Californians drive our housing prices up and aren't as friendly in traffic. So if you are from California and looking for some place new, please remember Seattle has LOTS OF RAIN. Texas has lots of sun in comparison, you'll be happier there instead of Seattle where it rains 49 weeks out of the year.

eli_gottlieb 14y ago

yummyfajitas 14y ago
We have. But most productivity gains (together with comp gains) are driven by the top, not the median or bottom. A burger flipper produces as much now as ever before. Productivity went up because of the computerized jit inventory infrastructure bringing mass produced frozen burgers to him, the highly optimized recipes he mindlessly follows, etc. The guys who built all that stuff are paid well.
- FelixP 14y ago
  Actually, thanks to modern logistics and restaurant management software, I'd posit that an average burger-flipper today is substantially more productive than the average burger-flipper was 50 years ago.
  - yummyfajitas 14y ago
    The total output of a McD's with 5 burger flippers certainly did go up, but not due to anything the burger flippers are doing. There is no reason why the burger flippers wages should go up as a result.

wildgift 14y ago

It is unfair, but it would be better to focus on how to lift more people up to the level of teacher retirements than to bring teachers down. Trying to lift all boats strengthens and enlarges the middle class.