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Waiting for the pope: http://i.imgur.com/sNTmp4s.jpg http://i.imgur.com/sNTmp4s.jpg In my opinion you miss a lot around you when you are constantly staring at

by ohwp 14y ago

Waiting for the pope: http://i.imgur.com/sNTmp4s.jpg http://i.imgur.com/sNTmp4s.jpg In my opinion you miss a lot around you when you are constantly staring at the screen of your device. Two days ago I was sitting at a birthday party. The guy next to me constantly took pictures sending them with Watsapp. I never spoke a word to him because he was busy with his phone all the time. I'm still not sure what to think about that but I don't think I like the change.

dsirijus 14y ago
Not be demeaning, but there is an alternative way out of that - become a power user. I frequently continue programming/typing, slip in an audio note to self or search the web via Google Now, while holding a normal conversation. And people with whom I interact got used to this to the level of requiring me to have the data from Wikipedia ready for the continuation of the discourse. :) This is not a comment on the externalisation, but on how gadgetry, used properly, can add to experience.
- adam-a 14y ago
  "witholding" means the opposite of what you think it does, it means "preventing" or "holding back" in this context :) Also I suspect a lot of people, certainly myself, would find this behaviour quite unsociable, and hard to bear during every conversation. The reason I think, is because it is so easy for someone doing this to slip into focussing on social media, or some news article, privately. It's also hard to tell whether you were temporarily ignoring me or just refreshing your memory on something we are talking about.
  - dsirijus 14y ago
    Edited, thank you. It was just a lapsus. Awkwardly placed one, though. :) Come to think of it, this kind of behaviour may even act as a solid social filter. After all, if you cannot comprehend that I'm actually being an active part of conversation, notwithstanding my relationship with gadgets around, I'm not sure I want to continue conversing with you in particular. Someone might call me on basic etiquette, but those are rules that are to be redefined at some point.
    - amirmc 14y ago
      > "...if you cannot comprehend that I'm actually being an active part of conversation..." All the normal methods of figuring out that someone is actively engaged are broken when you introduce devices. Eye contact, physical gestures, mini-facial expressions etc don't work anymore. How is one to tell that you're involved? Random interruptions? It's perfectly ok for someone to 'drop out' of the flow momentarily to check their little screen but they shouldn't pretend that they're still involved in the actual conversation.
      - dsirijus 14y ago
        Um, how about content as a normal method?
        ohwp 14y ago
        What about meta content? Why do you think Google likes meta content? Because that defines context. And content without context is often meaningless.
- ohwp 14y ago
  Getting used to something is not the same as liking something. Edit: When you drop what you are doing to have a conversation with someone you make them feel important. Why not make people feel good?
- skrebbel 14y ago
  > I frequently continue programming/typing, slip in an audio note to self or search the web via Google Now, while holding a normal conversation. And people with whom I interact got used to this to the level of requiring me to have the data from Wikipedia ready for the continuation of the discourse. :) If you ever do that while talking to me, I'm off. If you don't want to talk, don't, but if I'm genuinely less interesting than Google Now (of all things!) then why don't you just walk away?
  - tedks 14y ago
    I can think of several reasons: 1. It would be insulting to do that. 2. Most people understand that as long as the flow of conversation is maintained, it doesn't really matter what else you're doing. People have conversations while doing other things all the time. 3. Doing something else while conversing with someone doesn't actually mean you're less interesting than that something else. It means that temporarily, there exists reason to do that thing. 4. You have a real relationship with the person with whom you are conversing and both of you understand that taking 10 seconds to look something up on wikipedia will not damage that relationship. Could you really think of none of those things? If not, why not just signal your luddism directly by saying "If you use google now in my presence, I will hellban you from my life?"
    - archon 14y ago
      > 1. It would be insulting to do that. It's also insulting to not give a conversation your full attention, for some of us. If I'm trying to talk with you about something (as opposed to talking to you), I'm going to be insulted if you're checking your phone and otherwise broadcasting through body language and your inattention that "what you're saying to me right now is unimportant, and I would rather be doing other things." Whether you are capable of paying full attention to our conversation while doing other things is immaterial; it's about perception. If I feel like you're not interested in the conversation, I'm just going to shut up and move on.
      - lotharbot 14y ago
        >> "It's also insulting to not give a conversation your full attention, for some of us." There are certain mental conditions (including variants of ADHD) wherein it's actually easier for someone to focus if they're doing two things than if they're doing one thing. It's insulting to those of us with those conditions to be told to stop because you misunderstand us.
- jbattle 14y ago
  Imagine a question comes up in conversation like ... "How close did Washington come to being proclaimed the king of the USA?" Honestly I hate when people end a conversation like this by just looking up the answer on wikipedia. The point of these conversations is quite often NOT actually about getting the right answer - the point is to enjoy the conversation - explore the 'space' around some topic, each participant in the conversation sharing their own perspective & knowledge. The cool thing about conversations like this is all the stuff that comes up which would otherwise be short-circuited by the closed door an "official" answer imposes.
- epo 14y ago
  Your social skills are severely lacking. If you were 13 it might just get you the "it is rude to do that" talk. Otherwise you will find the problem of people interrupting your onanistic self absorption will sort itself out over time.
jonahx 14y ago
Wow that waiting for the pope image is incredible, and frightening.
- amirmc 14y ago
  Why frightening? People want to record memories of things that are important to them. Seeing the pope is important to a lot of people. Would you say the same about all the people at a Pop concert? People derive emotional value from their pictures and videos. Little computers-in-your-pocket just happen to make it easier. Aside: We don't really know how many of those people in the pope-pic are sharing vs just recording for posterity -- the OP is primarily talking about the former EDIT: Turns out the pics aren't really comparable. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5492146 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5492146
sqrt2 14y ago
The linked image is comparing the announcement of Bergoglio's election to Wojtyła's funeral procession: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/innovations/post/aaf1067a-8cf9-11e2-9f54-f3fdd70acad2_blog.html http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/innovations/post/aaf1067...
nano111 14y ago
Google glasses might help fix that by saving everything to your Google account (not that it is a solution, but a different problem)
unethical_ban 14y ago
I am likely preaching to the choir here, but the following is true. If you don't like this 'externalization' discussed by the author, try this: Keep your phone off of your body more often. Going to get a haircut, or go to the mall for an hour? Leave the phone in the car. It is really freeing; you do not realize the subtle impact of that phone/pager/digital watch constantly on the verge of maybe someone messaging you. Try it out once or twice, especially if it sounds like it'd be tough.
- kevinrpope 14y ago
  I've started doing this and I can't agree more. It's extremely freeing when you realize that you don't need to be at the beck and call of your phone and email all the time. It also makes those times when your phone runs out of juice much easier to handle.
stefanix 14y ago
Reminds me of houses with one antenna for each apt. A strange lack of coordination.

by ohwp 14y ago

dsirijus 14y ago

Not be demeaning, but there is an alternative way out of that - become a power user. I frequently continue programming/typing, slip in an audio note to self or search the web via Google Now, while holding a normal conversation. And people with whom I interact got used to this to the level of requiring me to have the data from Wikipedia ready for the continuation of the discourse. :) This is not a comment on the externalisation, but on how gadgetry, used properly, can add to experience.

adam-a 14y ago
"witholding" means the opposite of what you think it does, it means "preventing" or "holding back" in this context :) Also I suspect a lot of people, certainly myself, would find this behaviour quite unsociable, and hard to bear during every conversation. The reason I think, is because it is so easy for someone doing this to slip into focussing on social media, or some news article, privately. It's also hard to tell whether you were temporarily ignoring me or just refreshing your memory on something we are talking about.
- dsirijus 14y ago
  Edited, thank you. It was just a lapsus. Awkwardly placed one, though. :) Come to think of it, this kind of behaviour may even act as a solid social filter. After all, if you cannot comprehend that I'm actually being an active part of conversation, notwithstanding my relationship with gadgets around, I'm not sure I want to continue conversing with you in particular. Someone might call me on basic etiquette, but those are rules that are to be redefined at some point.
  - amirmc 14y ago
    > "...if you cannot comprehend that I'm actually being an active part of conversation..." All the normal methods of figuring out that someone is actively engaged are broken when you introduce devices. Eye contact, physical gestures, mini-facial expressions etc don't work anymore. How is one to tell that you're involved? Random interruptions? It's perfectly ok for someone to 'drop out' of the flow momentarily to check their little screen but they shouldn't pretend that they're still involved in the actual conversation.
    - dsirijus 14y ago
      Um, how about content as a normal method?
      - ohwp 14y ago
        What about meta content? Why do you think Google likes meta content? Because that defines context. And content without context is often meaningless.
ohwp 14y ago
Getting used to something is not the same as liking something. Edit: When you drop what you are doing to have a conversation with someone you make them feel important. Why not make people feel good?
skrebbel 14y ago
> I frequently continue programming/typing, slip in an audio note to self or search the web via Google Now, while holding a normal conversation. And people with whom I interact got used to this to the level of requiring me to have the data from Wikipedia ready for the continuation of the discourse. :) If you ever do that while talking to me, I'm off. If you don't want to talk, don't, but if I'm genuinely less interesting than Google Now (of all things!) then why don't you just walk away?
- tedks 14y ago
  I can think of several reasons: 1. It would be insulting to do that. 2. Most people understand that as long as the flow of conversation is maintained, it doesn't really matter what else you're doing. People have conversations while doing other things all the time. 3. Doing something else while conversing with someone doesn't actually mean you're less interesting than that something else. It means that temporarily, there exists reason to do that thing. 4. You have a real relationship with the person with whom you are conversing and both of you understand that taking 10 seconds to look something up on wikipedia will not damage that relationship. Could you really think of none of those things? If not, why not just signal your luddism directly by saying "If you use google now in my presence, I will hellban you from my life?"
  - archon 14y ago
    > 1. It would be insulting to do that. It's also insulting to not give a conversation your full attention, for some of us. If I'm trying to talk with you about something (as opposed to talking to you), I'm going to be insulted if you're checking your phone and otherwise broadcasting through body language and your inattention that "what you're saying to me right now is unimportant, and I would rather be doing other things." Whether you are capable of paying full attention to our conversation while doing other things is immaterial; it's about perception. If I feel like you're not interested in the conversation, I'm just going to shut up and move on.
    - lotharbot 14y ago
      >> "It's also insulting to not give a conversation your full attention, for some of us." There are certain mental conditions (including variants of ADHD) wherein it's actually easier for someone to focus if they're doing two things than if they're doing one thing. It's insulting to those of us with those conditions to be told to stop because you misunderstand us.
jbattle 14y ago
Imagine a question comes up in conversation like ... "How close did Washington come to being proclaimed the king of the USA?" Honestly I hate when people end a conversation like this by just looking up the answer on wikipedia. The point of these conversations is quite often NOT actually about getting the right answer - the point is to enjoy the conversation - explore the 'space' around some topic, each participant in the conversation sharing their own perspective & knowledge. The cool thing about conversations like this is all the stuff that comes up which would otherwise be short-circuited by the closed door an "official" answer imposes.
epo 14y ago
Your social skills are severely lacking. If you were 13 it might just get you the "it is rude to do that" talk. Otherwise you will find the problem of people interrupting your onanistic self absorption will sort itself out over time.

jonahx 14y ago

Wow that waiting for the pope image is incredible, and frightening.

amirmc 14y ago
Why frightening? People want to record memories of things that are important to them. Seeing the pope is important to a lot of people. Would you say the same about all the people at a Pop concert? People derive emotional value from their pictures and videos. Little computers-in-your-pocket just happen to make it easier. Aside: We don't really know how many of those people in the pope-pic are sharing vs just recording for posterity -- the OP is primarily talking about the former EDIT: Turns out the pics aren't really comparable. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5492146 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5492146

sqrt2 14y ago

The linked image is comparing the announcement of Bergoglio's election to Wojtyła's funeral procession: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/innovations/post/aaf1067a-8cf9-11e2-9f54-f3fdd70acad2_blog.html http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/innovations/post/aaf1067...

nano111 14y ago

Google glasses might help fix that by saving everything to your Google account (not that it is a solution, but a different problem)

unethical_ban 14y ago

I am likely preaching to the choir here, but the following is true. If you don't like this 'externalization' discussed by the author, try this: Keep your phone off of your body more often. Going to get a haircut, or go to the mall for an hour? Leave the phone in the car. It is really freeing; you do not realize the subtle impact of that phone/pager/digital watch constantly on the verge of maybe someone messaging you. Try it out once or twice, especially if it sounds like it'd be tough.

kevinrpope 14y ago
I've started doing this and I can't agree more. It's extremely freeing when you realize that you don't need to be at the beck and call of your phone and email all the time. It also makes those times when your phone runs out of juice much easier to handle.

stefanix 14y ago

Reminds me of houses with one antenna for each apt. A strange lack of coordination.