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I love IntelliJ for java development but I never got why I might need a big IDE for c/C++. I just use Vim for that. I mean it does omnicompletion and code corre

by Watabou 14y ago

I love IntelliJ for java development but I never got why I might need a big IDE for c/C++. I just use Vim for that. I mean it does omnicompletion and code correction with clang, has snippets, support for switching between header and source code files. It works pretty well for me. Even sublime text would do the job since it has all of those features too. What do IDEs have over Vim in terms of features that I may be missing out on? For java, I would definitely use IntelliJ because of the debugging features alone but I think it's overkill for something like C/C++/Python

swah 14y ago
Does your comment suggests that you're using Java for more complex stuff than you would ever use C++?
- Watabou 14y ago
  Not really, I just prefer using lldb/gdb or just simple printf/couts for debugging purposes. For Java, you really can't get decent code checking with vim unless you use a the eclim plugin and that just feels like a hack.
MrUnknown 14y ago
To me, it seems like a lot of these light-weight Non-IDE text editors, are basically IDEs anyway. You just said sublime and Vim have most of the features of an IDE. I personally use RubyMine, and while I don't use the debugging a whole lot, it comes in handy with some really confusing issues. Other than that, it is just a fancy text editor that I have become used to for Ruby work.
- swah 14y ago
  I love ST3, but there is no true completion, debugger, refactoring, a way to run tests, Git integration... Even the build system is quite simple...
  - Watabou 14y ago
    For ruby stuff, Vim really shines, mainly because of tpope's contribution and his excellent ruby plugins. Along with his Fugitive (https://github.com/tpope/vim-fugitive https://github.com/tpope/vim-fugitive) plugin, it's actually fun to use Vim for ruby. It's just fantastic. Check out his vim-rails and vim-ruby plugins: https://github.com/tpope https://github.com/tpope
gregschlom 14y ago
What about smart refactoring? Being able to rename just about anything (methods, classes, variables, etc...) and knowing that your IDE will do all the right stuff. What about instantly knowing who calls that method or uses that class or that variable, with much more flexibility than just grepping through the code? Those are the features I use the most in any IDE.
- azov 14y ago
  Why does it have to be lumped into IDE? Both could be written as standalone utilities that your favorite editor can call. I think IDEs hurt innovation in development tools more than almost anything else. They are like crack for your workflow - easy to get started with, but once you're on them you're stuck. Plugging in better tools into existing IDE is a big PIA if possible at all, and rewriting the whole IDE is a huge undertaking for any company who wants to make your life better.
  - wvenable 14y ago
    My IDE has more plugins installed than my web browser! Standalone utilities generally have poorer UI and require more effort to find and run.
  - joelhooks 14y ago
    The core of JetBrains tech is a well built, performant, pluggable foundation that makes them incredibly responsive when it comes to new tools, languages, features, fixes, etc
  - pjmlp 14y ago
    I have been using IDEs since the MS-DOS days and my life is way better with them than without. Using vim, emacs and similar always leaves a taste of doing a time travel to the early days of UNIX using text terminals.
  - _pmf_ 14y ago
    > Why does it have to be lumped into IDE? Both could be written as standalone utilities that your favorite editor can call. Yes. And it has been done. Over and over, each approach crappier than the next. I'm using Eclipse/CDT; it's really shitty, but sadly still more usable than Vim for large (-ish) projects.
stinos 14y ago
Have you ever used the debugger in Visual Studio? That is THE thing I miss in vim and the likes (yes there's vimgdb ect but that's peanuts in comparision). Combined with the features mentioned by others, that is why poeple want a set of tools that integrate with each other, hence the name, instead of a bunch of standalone tools that also work but don't know enough about each other to seamlessly play together.
- johncoltrane 14y ago
  Why do so many people seem to miss IDE features when they use something that is so obviously not an IDE?
  - chii 14y ago
    because other people imply that using vim/emacs with plugin/tools to fill in the gaps is equivelent to using a fullblown IDE, but one that runs faster.
    - johncoltrane 14y ago
      Which is blatantly false.
roel_v 14y ago
"For java, I would definitely use IntelliJ because of the debugging features alone but I think it's overkill for something like C/C++/Python" Not sure if you're trolling, but how much C++ do you write? If you have to ask what the difference is between VS and Vim, and are suggesting that writing C++ is more like Python than Java, you haven't used C++ and/or VS much. (context: I have 10+ years of experience with VS and 15+ with Vim, which is my everyday editor for everything except non-trivial C++ code)
zpk 14y ago
I love IntelliJ, I sound like I work for them. I don't.... If you do Python web development, specifically Django you can debug your application with that. Never tried straight Python, but probably that too.
___1___ 14y ago
100% this is my opinion, I learnt C++ using VS and eclipse; I can't remember when or why but I fairly quickly picked up Vim + compiler and it just felt better suited to native development. Further more the skills feel more real, I can apply my usage of vim and how the tool chain works to other languages.

by Watabou 14y ago

swah 14y ago

Does your comment suggests that you're using Java for more complex stuff than you would ever use C++?

Watabou 14y ago
Not really, I just prefer using lldb/gdb or just simple printf/couts for debugging purposes. For Java, you really can't get decent code checking with vim unless you use a the eclim plugin and that just feels like a hack.

MrUnknown 14y ago

To me, it seems like a lot of these light-weight Non-IDE text editors, are basically IDEs anyway. You just said sublime and Vim have most of the features of an IDE. I personally use RubyMine, and while I don't use the debugging a whole lot, it comes in handy with some really confusing issues. Other than that, it is just a fancy text editor that I have become used to for Ruby work.

swah 14y ago
I love ST3, but there is no true completion, debugger, refactoring, a way to run tests, Git integration... Even the build system is quite simple...
- Watabou 14y ago
  For ruby stuff, Vim really shines, mainly because of tpope's contribution and his excellent ruby plugins. Along with his Fugitive (https://github.com/tpope/vim-fugitive https://github.com/tpope/vim-fugitive) plugin, it's actually fun to use Vim for ruby. It's just fantastic. Check out his vim-rails and vim-ruby plugins: https://github.com/tpope https://github.com/tpope

gregschlom 14y ago

What about smart refactoring? Being able to rename just about anything (methods, classes, variables, etc...) and knowing that your IDE will do all the right stuff. What about instantly knowing who calls that method or uses that class or that variable, with much more flexibility than just grepping through the code? Those are the features I use the most in any IDE.

azov 14y ago
Why does it have to be lumped into IDE? Both could be written as standalone utilities that your favorite editor can call. I think IDEs hurt innovation in development tools more than almost anything else. They are like crack for your workflow - easy to get started with, but once you're on them you're stuck. Plugging in better tools into existing IDE is a big PIA if possible at all, and rewriting the whole IDE is a huge undertaking for any company who wants to make your life better.
- wvenable 14y ago
  My IDE has more plugins installed than my web browser! Standalone utilities generally have poorer UI and require more effort to find and run.
- joelhooks 14y ago
  The core of JetBrains tech is a well built, performant, pluggable foundation that makes them incredibly responsive when it comes to new tools, languages, features, fixes, etc
- pjmlp 14y ago
  I have been using IDEs since the MS-DOS days and my life is way better with them than without. Using vim, emacs and similar always leaves a taste of doing a time travel to the early days of UNIX using text terminals.
- _pmf_ 14y ago
  > Why does it have to be lumped into IDE? Both could be written as standalone utilities that your favorite editor can call. Yes. And it has been done. Over and over, each approach crappier than the next. I'm using Eclipse/CDT; it's really shitty, but sadly still more usable than Vim for large (-ish) projects.

stinos 14y ago

Have you ever used the debugger in Visual Studio? That is THE thing I miss in vim and the likes (yes there's vimgdb ect but that's peanuts in comparision). Combined with the features mentioned by others, that is why poeple want a set of tools that integrate with each other, hence the name, instead of a bunch of standalone tools that also work but don't know enough about each other to seamlessly play together.

johncoltrane 14y ago
Why do so many people seem to miss IDE features when they use something that is so obviously not an IDE?
- chii 14y ago
  because other people imply that using vim/emacs with plugin/tools to fill in the gaps is equivelent to using a fullblown IDE, but one that runs faster.
  - johncoltrane 14y ago
    Which is blatantly false.

roel_v 14y ago

"For java, I would definitely use IntelliJ because of the debugging features alone but I think it's overkill for something like C/C++/Python" Not sure if you're trolling, but how much C++ do you write? If you have to ask what the difference is between VS and Vim, and are suggesting that writing C++ is more like Python than Java, you haven't used C++ and/or VS much. (context: I have 10+ years of experience with VS and 15+ with Vim, which is my everyday editor for everything except non-trivial C++ code)

zpk 14y ago

I love IntelliJ, I sound like I work for them. I don't.... If you do Python web development, specifically Django you can debug your application with that. Never tried straight Python, but probably that too.

___1___ 14y ago

100% this is my opinion, I learnt C++ using VS and eclipse; I can't remember when or why but I fairly quickly picked up Vim + compiler and it just felt better suited to native development. Further more the skills feel more real, I can apply my usage of vim and how the tool chain works to other languages.