3 ms·

It's very important to remember that government research money is taken from the citizens, who otherwise would allocate it in accordance with their preferences.

by javert 14y ago

It's very important to remember that government research money is taken from the citizens, who otherwise would allocate it in accordance with their preferences. Taxes in the US are actually very high, plus the government takes a lot of money via inflation of the money supply. It seems likely to me that government-funded research is a "local maximum." If we were to massively shift the backbone of the economy from consumption to production (i.e., letting people and companies keep more of their money), we would certainly see much more private research. In fact, we could potentially have a "research economy," if the intellectual property issues were sorted out. In this system, research institutes would take over a lot of functionality from academic departments (including training new researchers). Such an institute my employ tenured academicians who make lower, fixed wages (as with current academicians) but are free to do basic research, plus applied people try to market the results and are paid competitively (as with current industry people). There is also a high level of regulatory capture in most industries that punishes any attempt to transition research results into a marketable product.

macspoofing 14y ago
>It seems likely to me that government-funded research is a "local maximum." So is private research.
twmb 14y ago
Taxes are not very high in the US. We have about 26.9% total tax revenue (which I will abbreviate TTR. TTR is measured as a percentage of GDP)[0][1]. I hate seeing this statement thrown out as if it is fact. We have very low taxes comparatively, especially given our status as a highly developed and competitive economy. We are #7 on the Global Competitive Index, behind Switzerland (29.4% TTR), Singapore (14.2% TTR), Finland (43.6% TTR), Sweden (47.9% TTR), Netherlands (39.8% TTR), and Germany (40.6% TTR) [3]. Sweden, the Netherlands, Finland and other countries that are close below the US have socialist governments. As much as hip, intellectual go-getters who read Ayn Rand would love there to be no government, it's simply not feasible. It may be great in theory, but it's not great in practice. However, I do not know much about the Ayn Rand's entire philosophy, so I wont comment on it further. I do know that most people who blindly latch on to some of her ideas don't truly understand her philosophy. Half of that 'regulatory capture' you refer to is because of private interests lobbying for government restrictions. The will of the free market may drive such anti-competitive practices by private interests out of business eventually, but humans do not operate on the long term. Regardless, the point of this post is that even if you thought you opened up your eyes before to the realities of the world and exactly how it should work, I invite you to take a step back every now and then and reevaluate your philosophies. [0]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenue_as_percentage_of_GDP http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenu... [1]http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/numbers/international.cfm http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/numb... [3]http://www3.weforum.org/docs/WEF_GlobalCompetitivenessReport_2012-13.pdf http://www3.weforum.org/docs/WEF_GlobalCompetitivenessReport...
- javert 14y ago
  > Taxes are not very high in the US. We have about 26.9% total tax revenue (which I will abbreviate TTR. TTR is measured as a percentage of GDP)[0][1]. So, 27% of the economy is shifted towards government, which is almost entirely consumption, not production... that's a massive amount of waste. I mean, it's 27% of the entire US economy! Of course, you probably interpret the utility of this shift differently than I do. No need to argue ideology here. > As much as hip, intellectual go-getters who read Ayn Rand would love there to be no government, it's simply not feasible. As an Objectivist (i.e. I agree with Ayn Rand's formal philosophy), it is not "hip." It's incredibly painful to be a small minority that is treated with disgust by people who can't even state what they actually disagree with. This is my experience living in a college town in the US. It's a perfect way to be ostracized. Even, say, Paul Ryan Republicans who claim to like Ayn Rand will tend to personally reject me, since I'm an atheist. > read Ayn Rand would love there to be no government This is just technically incorrect. Ayn Rand was actually a very strong defender of government over anarchy. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. > I do know that most people who blindly latch on to some of her ideas don't truly understand her philosophy. It's true that this is a problem. But it's a problem with those people, not with her philosophy. > Half of that 'regulatory capture' you refer to is because of private interests lobbying for government restrictions. Yes, there are lots of evil businessmen who seek regulatory capture. In fact, a main character of Atlas Shrugged was one such. That's why we need to keep government out of the business of business. > I invite you to take a step back every now and then and reevaluate your philosophies. This is an intellectually irrelevant pretension on your part. I've spent ten years actively obsessed with figuring out philosophy.
- twmb 14y ago
  Also, my numbering got a little off because it's late, and I can't edit. Looks funnier this way.
- seanmcdirmid 14y ago
  Those who think taxes are high in the states have simply never lived outside of the states.
  - 14y ago

by javert 14y ago

macspoofing 14y ago

>It seems likely to me that government-funded research is a "local maximum." So is private research.

twmb 14y ago

Taxes are not very high in the US. We have about 26.9% total tax revenue (which I will abbreviate TTR. TTR is measured as a percentage of GDP)[0][1]. I hate seeing this statement thrown out as if it is fact. We have very low taxes comparatively, especially given our status as a highly developed and competitive economy. We are #7 on the Global Competitive Index, behind Switzerland (29.4% TTR), Singapore (14.2% TTR), Finland (43.6% TTR), Sweden (47.9% TTR), Netherlands (39.8% TTR), and Germany (40.6% TTR) [3]. Sweden, the Netherlands, Finland and other countries that are close below the US have socialist governments. As much as hip, intellectual go-getters who read Ayn Rand would love there to be no government, it's simply not feasible. It may be great in theory, but it's not great in practice. However, I do not know much about the Ayn Rand's entire philosophy, so I wont comment on it further. I do know that most people who blindly latch on to some of her ideas don't truly understand her philosophy. Half of that 'regulatory capture' you refer to is because of private interests lobbying for government restrictions. The will of the free market may drive such anti-competitive practices by private interests out of business eventually, but humans do not operate on the long term. Regardless, the point of this post is that even if you thought you opened up your eyes before to the realities of the world and exactly how it should work, I invite you to take a step back every now and then and reevaluate your philosophies. [0]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenue_as_percentage_of_GDP http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenu... [1]http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/numbers/international.cfm http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/numb... [3]http://www3.weforum.org/docs/WEF_GlobalCompetitivenessReport_2012-13.pdf http://www3.weforum.org/docs/WEF_GlobalCompetitivenessReport...

javert 14y ago
> Taxes are not very high in the US. We have about 26.9% total tax revenue (which I will abbreviate TTR. TTR is measured as a percentage of GDP)[0][1]. So, 27% of the economy is shifted towards government, which is almost entirely consumption, not production... that's a massive amount of waste. I mean, it's 27% of the entire US economy! Of course, you probably interpret the utility of this shift differently than I do. No need to argue ideology here. > As much as hip, intellectual go-getters who read Ayn Rand would love there to be no government, it's simply not feasible. As an Objectivist (i.e. I agree with Ayn Rand's formal philosophy), it is not "hip." It's incredibly painful to be a small minority that is treated with disgust by people who can't even state what they actually disagree with. This is my experience living in a college town in the US. It's a perfect way to be ostracized. Even, say, Paul Ryan Republicans who claim to like Ayn Rand will tend to personally reject me, since I'm an atheist. > read Ayn Rand would love there to be no government This is just technically incorrect. Ayn Rand was actually a very strong defender of government over anarchy. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. > I do know that most people who blindly latch on to some of her ideas don't truly understand her philosophy. It's true that this is a problem. But it's a problem with those people, not with her philosophy. > Half of that 'regulatory capture' you refer to is because of private interests lobbying for government restrictions. Yes, there are lots of evil businessmen who seek regulatory capture. In fact, a main character of Atlas Shrugged was one such. That's why we need to keep government out of the business of business. > I invite you to take a step back every now and then and reevaluate your philosophies. This is an intellectually irrelevant pretension on your part. I've spent ten years actively obsessed with figuring out philosophy.
twmb 14y ago
Also, my numbering got a little off because it's late, and I can't edit. Looks funnier this way.
seanmcdirmid 14y ago
Those who think taxes are high in the states have simply never lived outside of the states.
- 14y ago