9 ms·

This is a tired argument born out of ignorance. You have no provided no evidence that the pirates would pay for it if they could, nor have you provided any evid

by chimi 14y ago

This is a tired argument born out of ignorance. You have no provided no evidence that the pirates would pay for it if they could, nor have you provided any evidence that HBO would make more money selling Game of Thrones to individuals than selling their network to the cable companies as an exclusive option for consuming their content.

rohern 14y ago
I am going to assume that you are an older person who has no real experience with "piracy" because the tone of your comment suggests a misconception about how it works. "Pirates" absolutely will pay. They pay to get the content as soon as it comes out and in high-definition. There are large and influential companies that have come to recognize the piracy is the result of failures of distribution, not pricing. The prime example would be Valve, which since it made Steam its primary distribution channel, had paid very little attention to piracy (compare to EA). The CEO, Gabe Newell, has discussed this publicly, and you can find him discussing it on YouTube. His example, which is particular to the gaming industry, but applies also to feature films, is that it is not reasonable to think that individuals who can afford $40/month internet connections and $2000 gaming rigs are pirating games because of money. They pirate games because they cannot get them legally conveniently and readily. This is particularly true in countries where English is not spoken. It takes months for a game to be released in Russia in Russian after the game is released in the United States. If a gamer can get a version in Russian faster via piracy, he's going to do it. The same rule holds for feature films, where again, release dates are not universal. As to your second point, if you cannot see the common sense in the idea that the millions of American and foreign young people who do subscribe to cable or to HBO but who enjoy Game of Thrones want to be able to watch it online in high def the same way that they watch every other show, I think you're just trying to argue for the sake of it. Even if only 10% of these people paid to watch it on HBO/iTunes/Amazon, that is money that HBO is not getting now. Being able to pay a few bucks to watch the episode the same night that it is released in high-definition is well worth it. To take just one demographic, college students living in dorms do not have cable subscriptions. They all watch the show by streaming from sites that violate copyright or via file-sharing. Perhaps you do not know this, but it is trivial to watch shows online. You can stream video from dozens of sites, with more of these appearing every month. These sites upload new episodes with hours of their original airing. That being said, Netflix has millions of subscribers, including very many young people who know how to watch shows like this. Young people also spend lots of money renting movies and television shows on iTunes that they could find for free online with a little effort. People pay for a high quality stream without the annoyance of pop-up ads and banners, and they like fast downloads and ease of use. Here's Gabe talking about piracy, so don't take my word for it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLC_zZ5fqFk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLC_zZ5fqFk
- defrost 14y ago
  Rather than running about insulting old people by assuming they have "no real experience with piracy" you might want to change your argument to "old people have a different experience of piracy than the one I am trying to replace". Last time I checked the backbone of the early release scene was still Usenet - clearly the playground of the hip, young & funky - no old people there.
  - lelandbatey 14y ago
    Usenet is very much not the backbone of releases. The majority of releases happen on [0]topsites, with a growing portion of releases happening through large private torrent communities. [0]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topsite_(warez) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topsite_(warez)
  - rohern 14y ago
    I don't see how what I wrote is any way insulting to old people. I am drawing a distinction between how young people use the internet and how older people use it. This distinction exists in reality. It also appears to account for much of the huge difference in tone one hears coming people in different generations when discussing this issue.
- corresation 14y ago
  The fact that you decided to make this into some sort of young versus old thing is rather hilarious. Piracy is older than the internet. Some of us don't have the moral flexibility -- or quite honestly the time or the inconvenience -- to pirate. If you do, good for you, but the notion that it's new is utter hubris.
  - jjkmk 14y ago
    > time or the inconvenience It took me less than two minutes to get the latest episode of the walking dead from a torrent site in 1080p quality about 20 minutes after it aired on cable tv tonight (commercial free). I think your argument really highlights your advanced age and disconnect with modern technology.
CamperBob2 14y ago
What in the world makes you think I wouldn't rather give money to HBO and Showtime instead of hidemyass.com?
smsm42 14y ago
I'm not sure about HBO making more money one way or another, but there's ample evidence at least some people would pay for movies they are now downloading if they could download them in the same convenient manner with good quality and reasonable timeframe and price. I, personally, would gladly ditch my TV subscription and pay the same - or even slightly more - say, $50/month to an internet solution that would deliver me the same dozen or so of shows I am watching in a convenient manner. I'm not using 99% of the channels I'm paying for anyway. In fact, I am regularly checking current offers from various places - Hulu, Amazon, etc. - but none can offer enough coverage and convenience for me to go with them. And if my brain-dead DVR (my punishment for being cheap and getting into Dish contract I can't wait to end) misses an episode or they decide to run a baseball game over the time and the brain-dead DVR doesn't know how to adjust, I'm pretty much out of options when online solutions won't feature it for a year or so and I can't continue watching the series since whole story arc will be messed up. That unless I do the obvious thing and just download it - because unlike what Dish or Amazon could offer, somehow those pirate guys actually can deliver convenient, easy to use and reliable way to get the content to me, and I could watch it anywhere any way I like. I'd pay money for something like that if somebody would bother to do it for me for money.

by chimi 14y ago

rohern 14y ago

I am going to assume that you are an older person who has no real experience with "piracy" because the tone of your comment suggests a misconception about how it works. "Pirates" absolutely will pay. They pay to get the content as soon as it comes out and in high-definition. There are large and influential companies that have come to recognize the piracy is the result of failures of distribution, not pricing. The prime example would be Valve, which since it made Steam its primary distribution channel, had paid very little attention to piracy (compare to EA). The CEO, Gabe Newell, has discussed this publicly, and you can find him discussing it on YouTube. His example, which is particular to the gaming industry, but applies also to feature films, is that it is not reasonable to think that individuals who can afford $40/month internet connections and $2000 gaming rigs are pirating games because of money. They pirate games because they cannot get them legally conveniently and readily. This is particularly true in countries where English is not spoken. It takes months for a game to be released in Russia in Russian after the game is released in the United States. If a gamer can get a version in Russian faster via piracy, he's going to do it. The same rule holds for feature films, where again, release dates are not universal. As to your second point, if you cannot see the common sense in the idea that the millions of American and foreign young people who do subscribe to cable or to HBO but who enjoy Game of Thrones want to be able to watch it online in high def the same way that they watch every other show, I think you're just trying to argue for the sake of it. Even if only 10% of these people paid to watch it on HBO/iTunes/Amazon, that is money that HBO is not getting now. Being able to pay a few bucks to watch the episode the same night that it is released in high-definition is well worth it. To take just one demographic, college students living in dorms do not have cable subscriptions. They all watch the show by streaming from sites that violate copyright or via file-sharing. Perhaps you do not know this, but it is trivial to watch shows online. You can stream video from dozens of sites, with more of these appearing every month. These sites upload new episodes with hours of their original airing. That being said, Netflix has millions of subscribers, including very many young people who know how to watch shows like this. Young people also spend lots of money renting movies and television shows on iTunes that they could find for free online with a little effort. People pay for a high quality stream without the annoyance of pop-up ads and banners, and they like fast downloads and ease of use. Here's Gabe talking about piracy, so don't take my word for it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLC_zZ5fqFk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLC_zZ5fqFk

defrost 14y ago
Rather than running about insulting old people by assuming they have "no real experience with piracy" you might want to change your argument to "old people have a different experience of piracy than the one I am trying to replace". Last time I checked the backbone of the early release scene was still Usenet - clearly the playground of the hip, young & funky - no old people there.
- lelandbatey 14y ago
  Usenet is very much not the backbone of releases. The majority of releases happen on [0]topsites, with a growing portion of releases happening through large private torrent communities. [0]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topsite_(warez) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topsite_(warez)
- rohern 14y ago
  I don't see how what I wrote is any way insulting to old people. I am drawing a distinction between how young people use the internet and how older people use it. This distinction exists in reality. It also appears to account for much of the huge difference in tone one hears coming people in different generations when discussing this issue.
corresation 14y ago
The fact that you decided to make this into some sort of young versus old thing is rather hilarious. Piracy is older than the internet. Some of us don't have the moral flexibility -- or quite honestly the time or the inconvenience -- to pirate. If you do, good for you, but the notion that it's new is utter hubris.
- jjkmk 14y ago
  > time or the inconvenience It took me less than two minutes to get the latest episode of the walking dead from a torrent site in 1080p quality about 20 minutes after it aired on cable tv tonight (commercial free). I think your argument really highlights your advanced age and disconnect with modern technology.

CamperBob2 14y ago

What in the world makes you think I wouldn't rather give money to HBO and Showtime instead of hidemyass.com?

smsm42 14y ago

I'm not sure about HBO making more money one way or another, but there's ample evidence at least some people would pay for movies they are now downloading if they could download them in the same convenient manner with good quality and reasonable timeframe and price. I, personally, would gladly ditch my TV subscription and pay the same - or even slightly more - say, $50/month to an internet solution that would deliver me the same dozen or so of shows I am watching in a convenient manner. I'm not using 99% of the channels I'm paying for anyway. In fact, I am regularly checking current offers from various places - Hulu, Amazon, etc. - but none can offer enough coverage and convenience for me to go with them. And if my brain-dead DVR (my punishment for being cheap and getting into Dish contract I can't wait to end) misses an episode or they decide to run a baseball game over the time and the brain-dead DVR doesn't know how to adjust, I'm pretty much out of options when online solutions won't feature it for a year or so and I can't continue watching the series since whole story arc will be messed up. That unless I do the obvious thing and just download it - because unlike what Dish or Amazon could offer, somehow those pirate guys actually can deliver convenient, easy to use and reliable way to get the content to me, and I could watch it anywhere any way I like. I'd pay money for something like that if somebody would bother to do it for me for money.