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I don't mean to be presumptuous, but are you straight? Not feeling compelled to tell people about your sexuality is a luxury afforded to people who fit into th

I don't mean to be presumptuous, but are you straight? Not feeling compelled to tell people about your sexuality is a luxury afforded to people who fit into the norm. It's what LGBT activists would call "privilege", and it's something that we as straight/white/male/other dominant group need to be aware of if we don't wish to alienate minority groups.

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- elemenohpee 14y ago
  Maybe, but the point is that he shouldn't. And besides, that's harder than it sounds. Like he said, even small talk about kids or whatever can lead to it.
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fallous 14y ago
Why would my "sexuality" be a topic for anyone other than those close to me? If my wife and I like to dress up as robotic ninjas in order to get satisfaction, well then that's between my wife and I despite how "out of mainstream" it is and is no business of anyone else. I tire of the "acceptance" desire of so many people in so many areas of their lives. Tolerance != acceptance, it merely means that someone can tolerate an alternative without resorting to an attempt to suppress it. I don't have to accept the choice of people to paint their cars in zebra stripes, but I don't reach for an orbital sander and remove the paint because I can at least tolerate such a choice.
- elemenohpee 14y ago
  If you read the blog post, you would see that it's much harder to avoid than a "robotic ninja fetish". Simple small talk can often lead to it being brought up, and it's counterproductive to the goal of an inclusive society to expect him to lie about it.
- jpxxx 14y ago
  Your sexuality doesn't come in air-quotes, and you're teetering dangerously close to the word "choice" in a topic where no such thing exists. Your sexuality informs and alters 100% of your life.
  - ams6110 14y ago
    Your sexuality informs and alters 100% of your life. No it doesn't. And choice exists in almost everything.
    - jpxxx 14y ago
      Hrm, let's perform an in situ experiment! Right now, get on the horn with the people in your world and announce that you're actually gay/straight, whichever is different than currently. Then live accordingly for a few years so we can see what changes! The stakes: one upvote.
      - TheAmazingIdiot 14y ago
        I'm bisexual.. So the opposite is bisexual? I'm fine with that. Can I have my upvote?
        jpxxx 14y ago
        Well played! Yes. :)
        faul_sname 14y ago
        I believe the "opposite," or at least the closest thing, would be asexual.
    - elemenohpee 14y ago
      Too bad you chose to be ignorant :/ The scientific evidence is not on your side, if you're interested in that sort of thing.
      - 14y ago
- mtrimpe 14y ago
  We're talking about sexuality in the sense of the physical sex of your partner; not your fetishes. Unfortunately that's a difficult topic to avoid since we can hardly start referring to our partners as 'it' when the topic comes up. Choosing to answer vaguely and switch the topic is the easiest way for gay people to get out of these issues, but it is also how you end up staying in the closet to a lot of people. This article talks about choosing, in those situations, to not closet yourself and let the conversation flow as though the sex of your partner were a normal thing, knowing full well that it isn't for many people.
- drivebyacct2 14y ago
  Because the cab driver isn't going to say "Oh, you have kids? I bet you hate dressing up as robotic ninjas" forcing you to have to correct them and explain that, no, you don't fit his presumptions. It's not the cab drivers fault necessarily, people are socialized to expect that other people are straight, often because many people hide it. Hence the circle. By pointing out that I'm gay, when NO ONE (literally, I mean no one, most people don't believe me) expects it, I break that assumption and cause that person to second guess that assumption in the future.
- lilsunnybee 14y ago
  Are you seriously trying to compare same-sex relationships to having sexual fetishes? Your fetishes will never come up in any sort of everyday conversation, and no one has ever been discriminated against for their sexual kinks. Asking someone to be private about who they're partners with is very discriminatory. It's not required of opposite-sex couples. And very simple freedoms you might take for granted, like holding your partners hand in public, or engaging in simple discussions, can be a battle sometimes. Compare to mixed race relationships in US history and the present day. It's no more fair and civilized to suggest a 'don't ask don't tell' on same-sex partners than any other type of partnership. And comparing same sex attraction to a sexual fetish is frankly insulting.
  - fallous 14y ago
    Actually, "fetishes" would most assuredly come up in the same kinds of meaningless conversations in everyday life. "Oh, it's your anniversary? So you're going to go out for a nice romantic meal?" The assumption being that's what "normal" people do for such occasions. I do not feel compelled to correct their mistaken assumption simply because it's none of their damned business unless I decide they are important in my life. You misunderstand the idea of "it's no one else's business" with "you must be silent!" Holding your partner's hand in public is already publicly declaring the very thing that would alter the direction of a conversation regarding the sex of your significant other, which has no bearing on the original post or my response. This is about feeling the need to actively correct the incorrect assumptions of people who have no meaningful value to you and your partner's life. As for suggesting DADT, well when I suggest such a thing feel free to argue against it.
theorique 14y ago
Privilege/oppression may be a real thing, but this isn't an example of it. No one expects absolutely literal, radical honesty from a simple inquiry like "how's it going?" Just because I'm gay doesn't mean that I go around proclaiming the fact to others unless it's relevant to the context of the conversation.
- elemenohpee 14y ago
  Your comment makes zero sense in the context of the submitted blog post. Where did you see anything approaching the exchange "Hey, how's it going." "I'm gay."?
  - theorique 14y ago
    It's not aimed at the blog post, but addressing the comment from jpwagner.
DannyBee 14y ago
I understand your point, but it seems a bit laborious in this case. If a cab driver asks me how my day was, and i'm exhausted, I say "good" and stop talking. This is true whether you are gay, straight, or whatever. In the example in the article, if he was too exhausted to tell "the truth" (as he calls it) and have a "transformative conversation", he should have just said "i'd rather not talk about it". This does not require denying anything, pretending about anything, etc. It's unlikely the cab driver cared either way, to be honest, and if you give them the hint that you'd rather just drive in silence than spend your energy , they will. Again, it just seems the author acts as if he has to educate everyone, and it's a laborious process. I agree there are plenty of cases he needs to educate people, and that is laborious. But I think it goes too far when he gets into the realm of people just trying to make small talk, who actually don't care one way or the other. The cabby is likely just trying to stave off boredom and get a good tip, not an ignorant person whose mental state about the world needs to change. In all likelihood, he's probably playing a probability game (IE i'm sure he asks young drunk looking college kids about women or partying, forlorn looking businessmen about where they are traveling from, etc). You can see this as offensive if you like, but it's really not about ignorance. As the parent said, small talk is small talk.
- elemenohpee 14y ago
  Maybe he welcomes the small talk but finds the process of correcting false assumptions laborious? I get what you're saying and I don't think you're trying to be homophobic, but realize that that attitude often comes off the same as "I don't mind people being gay, I just don't want to see it or have to hear about it". It's a subtle form of oppression, where gay people are made to feel that they are not free to engage in the same small talk as hetero people, lest they offend someone's sensibilities.
  - DannyBee 14y ago
    I didn't say anything approaching what you claim the attitude is. My point was that small talk, particular cabby small talk, almost always involves false assumptions, and this has nothing to do with being ignorant. Otherwise, they have exactly the problem you mention in the last sentence. They see people from all walks of life. If they didn't make some set of assumptions (be it about sexuality, gender, typical behavior of males, typical behavior of females), they'd never be able to engage in any small talk, lest they offend someone's sensibilities. As I said, you may find this offensive, but it's not about ignorance.
kgo 14y ago
In the particular example of a cab driver... There are plenty of other reasons you might have kids but not a wife. Maybe you're a widower. Maybe they're actually your brother's kids, but he and his wife were killed by a drunk driver, and you're the godfather. Perfectly legitimate cases where you just have no reason to get into it with the freaking cab driver, and probably don't get into a serious conversation, and probably also don't tell him to mind his own damn business. Wouldn't it also be inappropriate for the cab-driver to follow up, "Do you have kids?" with the question "Are they biologically yours?"
- elemenohpee 14y ago
  In all the examples you gave the reason is some unfortunate tragedy and not a part of his identity that we as a society are trying to become more inclusive of.
- lilsunnybee 14y ago
  You're comparing same-sex relationships to a tragedy having occurred. It's not really a fair comparison. You're also operating under the presumption that a same-sex partnership should be something hidden, or that it should be a touchy topic and only brought up sparingly, when frankly that's oppressive and discriminatory.
cdcarter 14y ago
I'm pretty gay, and fairly often I don't want to bother with it. "Tell me about your girlfriend?" can be answered to a cabbie with "Eh." and it's really not the end of the world for me.

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elemenohpee 14y ago
Maybe, but the point is that he shouldn't. And besides, that's harder than it sounds. Like he said, even small talk about kids or whatever can lead to it.

deleted 14y ago

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fallous 14y ago

Why would my "sexuality" be a topic for anyone other than those close to me? If my wife and I like to dress up as robotic ninjas in order to get satisfaction, well then that's between my wife and I despite how "out of mainstream" it is and is no business of anyone else. I tire of the "acceptance" desire of so many people in so many areas of their lives. Tolerance != acceptance, it merely means that someone can tolerate an alternative without resorting to an attempt to suppress it. I don't have to accept the choice of people to paint their cars in zebra stripes, but I don't reach for an orbital sander and remove the paint because I can at least tolerate such a choice.

elemenohpee 14y ago
If you read the blog post, you would see that it's much harder to avoid than a "robotic ninja fetish". Simple small talk can often lead to it being brought up, and it's counterproductive to the goal of an inclusive society to expect him to lie about it.
jpxxx 14y ago
Your sexuality doesn't come in air-quotes, and you're teetering dangerously close to the word "choice" in a topic where no such thing exists. Your sexuality informs and alters 100% of your life.
- ams6110 14y ago
  Your sexuality informs and alters 100% of your life. No it doesn't. And choice exists in almost everything.
  - jpxxx 14y ago
    Hrm, let's perform an in situ experiment! Right now, get on the horn with the people in your world and announce that you're actually gay/straight, whichever is different than currently. Then live accordingly for a few years so we can see what changes! The stakes: one upvote.
    - TheAmazingIdiot 14y ago
      I'm bisexual.. So the opposite is bisexual? I'm fine with that. Can I have my upvote?
      - jpxxx 14y ago
        Well played! Yes. :)
      - faul_sname 14y ago
        I believe the "opposite," or at least the closest thing, would be asexual.
  - elemenohpee 14y ago
    Too bad you chose to be ignorant :/ The scientific evidence is not on your side, if you're interested in that sort of thing.
    - 14y ago
mtrimpe 14y ago
We're talking about sexuality in the sense of the physical sex of your partner; not your fetishes. Unfortunately that's a difficult topic to avoid since we can hardly start referring to our partners as 'it' when the topic comes up. Choosing to answer vaguely and switch the topic is the easiest way for gay people to get out of these issues, but it is also how you end up staying in the closet to a lot of people. This article talks about choosing, in those situations, to not closet yourself and let the conversation flow as though the sex of your partner were a normal thing, knowing full well that it isn't for many people.
drivebyacct2 14y ago
Because the cab driver isn't going to say "Oh, you have kids? I bet you hate dressing up as robotic ninjas" forcing you to have to correct them and explain that, no, you don't fit his presumptions. It's not the cab drivers fault necessarily, people are socialized to expect that other people are straight, often because many people hide it. Hence the circle. By pointing out that I'm gay, when NO ONE (literally, I mean no one, most people don't believe me) expects it, I break that assumption and cause that person to second guess that assumption in the future.
lilsunnybee 14y ago
Are you seriously trying to compare same-sex relationships to having sexual fetishes? Your fetishes will never come up in any sort of everyday conversation, and no one has ever been discriminated against for their sexual kinks. Asking someone to be private about who they're partners with is very discriminatory. It's not required of opposite-sex couples. And very simple freedoms you might take for granted, like holding your partners hand in public, or engaging in simple discussions, can be a battle sometimes. Compare to mixed race relationships in US history and the present day. It's no more fair and civilized to suggest a 'don't ask don't tell' on same-sex partners than any other type of partnership. And comparing same sex attraction to a sexual fetish is frankly insulting.
- fallous 14y ago
  Actually, "fetishes" would most assuredly come up in the same kinds of meaningless conversations in everyday life. "Oh, it's your anniversary? So you're going to go out for a nice romantic meal?" The assumption being that's what "normal" people do for such occasions. I do not feel compelled to correct their mistaken assumption simply because it's none of their damned business unless I decide they are important in my life. You misunderstand the idea of "it's no one else's business" with "you must be silent!" Holding your partner's hand in public is already publicly declaring the very thing that would alter the direction of a conversation regarding the sex of your significant other, which has no bearing on the original post or my response. This is about feeling the need to actively correct the incorrect assumptions of people who have no meaningful value to you and your partner's life. As for suggesting DADT, well when I suggest such a thing feel free to argue against it.

theorique 14y ago

Privilege/oppression may be a real thing, but this isn't an example of it. No one expects absolutely literal, radical honesty from a simple inquiry like "how's it going?" Just because I'm gay doesn't mean that I go around proclaiming the fact to others unless it's relevant to the context of the conversation.

elemenohpee 14y ago
Your comment makes zero sense in the context of the submitted blog post. Where did you see anything approaching the exchange "Hey, how's it going." "I'm gay."?
- theorique 14y ago
  It's not aimed at the blog post, but addressing the comment from jpwagner.

DannyBee 14y ago

I understand your point, but it seems a bit laborious in this case. If a cab driver asks me how my day was, and i'm exhausted, I say "good" and stop talking. This is true whether you are gay, straight, or whatever. In the example in the article, if he was too exhausted to tell "the truth" (as he calls it) and have a "transformative conversation", he should have just said "i'd rather not talk about it". This does not require denying anything, pretending about anything, etc. It's unlikely the cab driver cared either way, to be honest, and if you give them the hint that you'd rather just drive in silence than spend your energy , they will. Again, it just seems the author acts as if he has to educate everyone, and it's a laborious process. I agree there are plenty of cases he needs to educate people, and that is laborious. But I think it goes too far when he gets into the realm of people just trying to make small talk, who actually don't care one way or the other. The cabby is likely just trying to stave off boredom and get a good tip, not an ignorant person whose mental state about the world needs to change. In all likelihood, he's probably playing a probability game (IE i'm sure he asks young drunk looking college kids about women or partying, forlorn looking businessmen about where they are traveling from, etc). You can see this as offensive if you like, but it's really not about ignorance. As the parent said, small talk is small talk.

elemenohpee 14y ago
Maybe he welcomes the small talk but finds the process of correcting false assumptions laborious? I get what you're saying and I don't think you're trying to be homophobic, but realize that that attitude often comes off the same as "I don't mind people being gay, I just don't want to see it or have to hear about it". It's a subtle form of oppression, where gay people are made to feel that they are not free to engage in the same small talk as hetero people, lest they offend someone's sensibilities.
- DannyBee 14y ago
  I didn't say anything approaching what you claim the attitude is. My point was that small talk, particular cabby small talk, almost always involves false assumptions, and this has nothing to do with being ignorant. Otherwise, they have exactly the problem you mention in the last sentence. They see people from all walks of life. If they didn't make some set of assumptions (be it about sexuality, gender, typical behavior of males, typical behavior of females), they'd never be able to engage in any small talk, lest they offend someone's sensibilities. As I said, you may find this offensive, but it's not about ignorance.

kgo 14y ago

In the particular example of a cab driver... There are plenty of other reasons you might have kids but not a wife. Maybe you're a widower. Maybe they're actually your brother's kids, but he and his wife were killed by a drunk driver, and you're the godfather. Perfectly legitimate cases where you just have no reason to get into it with the freaking cab driver, and probably don't get into a serious conversation, and probably also don't tell him to mind his own damn business. Wouldn't it also be inappropriate for the cab-driver to follow up, "Do you have kids?" with the question "Are they biologically yours?"

elemenohpee 14y ago
In all the examples you gave the reason is some unfortunate tragedy and not a part of his identity that we as a society are trying to become more inclusive of.
lilsunnybee 14y ago
You're comparing same-sex relationships to a tragedy having occurred. It's not really a fair comparison. You're also operating under the presumption that a same-sex partnership should be something hidden, or that it should be a touchy topic and only brought up sparingly, when frankly that's oppressive and discriminatory.

cdcarter 14y ago

I'm pretty gay, and fairly often I don't want to bother with it. "Tell me about your girlfriend?" can be answered to a cabbie with "Eh." and it's really not the end of the world for me.