4 ms·

I'm a staff engineer and I haven't thought about trying to get promoted a single day in my life. Do good work and be nice the rest follows

voidfunc 16d ago
This, I dont do worry about TC or promos. If youre executing and people are happy then rewards and status usually follow. If not,you move along.
- toast0 16d ago
  You do need to worry about TC until it's enough and if it's not enough, you do need to figure out what needs to happen to get more... Whether that's chasing promos or job hopping or whatever. If you have at least enough for now, you can start by just doing a good job and see what happens and if you're rewarded, not have to specifically chase. Hopefully you'll get to enough for the future without having to focus on promos etc. It's certainly nicer that way. Then you can take on big projects when they make sense, instead of forcing them. Big projects that benefit your team/company where you're the right person to do it are more likely to work out than ones where you're a bad fit (or the project is a bad fit for the org!) but you think it will get you promoted.
Arainach 16d ago
This was never really true at most places, and even where it was sort of true, it's been false since 2023. The ladder has collapsed. No more juniors to mentor and grow (in some cases no more US hiring period), and all of the carrots have been replaced with sticks. If you're lucky, the reward for doing good work and being nice is 'not being laid off', but the promo budget is gone and it's not like your boss gets a say in who's laid off so may the odds be ever in your favor.
- hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
  Find a new job because this is absolutely not the case at any company where I know ppl in tech
  - b112 16d ago
    Maybe it's your fancy name, which gets you those promotions.
    - hluska 16d ago
      Grow up.
      - b112 16d ago
        The guy's handle is literally 20 random characters, it's hardly harmful to joke about it. Why the anger?
        Arainach 16d ago
        In general, joking that people's promotions are due to their names is thinly veiled racism, especially considering it's a very real phenomenon[0]. Jokes in general are, if not explicitly against site norms, discouraged: "Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive." [1] [0]: https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/news/employee-relations/viewpoint-how-persons-name-can-prompt-hiring-discrimination https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/news/employee-relations/vi... [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
        b112 16d ago
        I have no idea what the person's real name is, their ethnicity, where they come from. How on earth could you make a racist statement about someone, if you don't know any of those things? What a ridiculous presumption.
        Arainach 16d ago
        If you have no idea what their real name, and their user name doesn't seem to be related to their real name, then the "joke" doesn't make any sense and would fall flat. So either you made a joke that isn't funny or one that is offensive. Either way, there's your answer to why people didn't react positively.
- hluska 16d ago
  It’s been very true at many places. It may not be your experience but that’s about your career.
  - Arainach 16d ago
    I have no doubt every organization is different, and to some degree different teams in organizations are different, but I've been fortunate enough to work at several employers where "staff" or "principal" truly mean things, and still have friends at all the FAANGs and many of the other companies of similar tier. They all report what I've said - the idea of just doing good work and getting promoted is basically dead. Perhaps if you work literally on a frontier AI product it's different, but what I said is the norm.
- cafebabbe 15d ago
  Well I disagree, at least in Europe - i don't know the state of the US market. Sure, promotions are harder to get, but the "ladder hasn't collapsed" and many companies I know (at least in tech) will reward above-average dedication (that average being quite low...).
billsly 16d ago
In my experience, this only works at some companies. At others you have to play the promotion game (or have your manager play it for you).
- donbox 16d ago
  Absolutely agree, I had my manager play it for me in my first company. And since I did not learn how to play it effectively or the importance of it, I think I suffered/suffering in my subsequent job(s).
- hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
  Don't disagree with that. If you have the luxury seek out the companies that aren't like that. Obviously easier said than done but they are out there
pfogain 16d ago
I've seen people who don't follow this become emotional wrecks, which as a manager makes me feel like Dr. Phil.
theli0nheart 16d ago
You're pretty lucky. Most people I know who've gotten to this point have had to think about it a lot.
- hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
  I think the senior -> staff certainly could require a concentrated effort to mke that leap in a lot of situations so don't doubt I was luckier there. But again I never took on work with the thought "this will help me reach staff" it was always "this will help the company" or "this will help my team" which is the distinction I was trying to make
Betelbuddy 16d ago
You are confusing your rating in the profession, with your rating within your company...
sajithdilshan 16d ago
You got really lucky. That was my exact thought as well when I started my career and looking back that was so naive.
- hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
  I don't think I got lucky I think you got unlucky. My experience at all 5 bay area tech companies I have worked at has been the same in this regard
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ytoawwhra92 16d ago
> Do good work and be nice the rest follows Nice little soundbite but for this to work your personal interpretation of "good work" and "be nice" needs to align with the people around you and the broader organisation.
StevePrefontain 15d ago
I don’t think this is universal advice. I’m also a staff engineer and had to ask to get promoted to senior and staff level. Yes, you have to actually be doing good work and operating at that level as you say, but promotion culture has enormous variance. Sometimes you have to advocate for yourself. A mentor of mine was a VP of Engineering at mid-size companies for ~20 years and told me that he never got a promotion he didn’t ask for.

voidfunc 16d ago

This, I dont do worry about TC or promos. If youre executing and people are happy then rewards and status usually follow. If not,you move along.

toast0 16d ago
You do need to worry about TC until it's enough and if it's not enough, you do need to figure out what needs to happen to get more... Whether that's chasing promos or job hopping or whatever. If you have at least enough for now, you can start by just doing a good job and see what happens and if you're rewarded, not have to specifically chase. Hopefully you'll get to enough for the future without having to focus on promos etc. It's certainly nicer that way. Then you can take on big projects when they make sense, instead of forcing them. Big projects that benefit your team/company where you're the right person to do it are more likely to work out than ones where you're a bad fit (or the project is a bad fit for the org!) but you think it will get you promoted.

Arainach 16d ago

This was never really true at most places, and even where it was sort of true, it's been false since 2023. The ladder has collapsed. No more juniors to mentor and grow (in some cases no more US hiring period), and all of the carrots have been replaced with sticks. If you're lucky, the reward for doing good work and being nice is 'not being laid off', but the promo budget is gone and it's not like your boss gets a say in who's laid off so may the odds be ever in your favor.

hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
Find a new job because this is absolutely not the case at any company where I know ppl in tech
- b112 16d ago
  Maybe it's your fancy name, which gets you those promotions.
  - hluska 16d ago
    Grow up.
    - b112 16d ago
      The guy's handle is literally 20 random characters, it's hardly harmful to joke about it. Why the anger?
      - Arainach 16d ago
        In general, joking that people's promotions are due to their names is thinly veiled racism, especially considering it's a very real phenomenon[0]. Jokes in general are, if not explicitly against site norms, discouraged: "Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive." [1] [0]: https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/news/employee-relations/viewpoint-how-persons-name-can-prompt-hiring-discrimination https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/news/employee-relations/vi... [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
        b112 16d ago
        I have no idea what the person's real name is, their ethnicity, where they come from. How on earth could you make a racist statement about someone, if you don't know any of those things? What a ridiculous presumption.
        Arainach 16d ago
        If you have no idea what their real name, and their user name doesn't seem to be related to their real name, then the "joke" doesn't make any sense and would fall flat. So either you made a joke that isn't funny or one that is offensive. Either way, there's your answer to why people didn't react positively.
hluska 16d ago
It’s been very true at many places. It may not be your experience but that’s about your career.
- Arainach 16d ago
  I have no doubt every organization is different, and to some degree different teams in organizations are different, but I've been fortunate enough to work at several employers where "staff" or "principal" truly mean things, and still have friends at all the FAANGs and many of the other companies of similar tier. They all report what I've said - the idea of just doing good work and getting promoted is basically dead. Perhaps if you work literally on a frontier AI product it's different, but what I said is the norm.
cafebabbe 15d ago
Well I disagree, at least in Europe - i don't know the state of the US market. Sure, promotions are harder to get, but the "ladder hasn't collapsed" and many companies I know (at least in tech) will reward above-average dedication (that average being quite low...).

billsly 16d ago

In my experience, this only works at some companies. At others you have to play the promotion game (or have your manager play it for you).

donbox 16d ago
Absolutely agree, I had my manager play it for me in my first company. And since I did not learn how to play it effectively or the importance of it, I think I suffered/suffering in my subsequent job(s).
hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
Don't disagree with that. If you have the luxury seek out the companies that aren't like that. Obviously easier said than done but they are out there

pfogain 16d ago

I've seen people who don't follow this become emotional wrecks, which as a manager makes me feel like Dr. Phil.

theli0nheart 16d ago

You're pretty lucky. Most people I know who've gotten to this point have had to think about it a lot.

hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
I think the senior -> staff certainly could require a concentrated effort to mke that leap in a lot of situations so don't doubt I was luckier there. But again I never took on work with the thought "this will help me reach staff" it was always "this will help the company" or "this will help my team" which is the distinction I was trying to make

Betelbuddy 16d ago

You are confusing your rating in the profession, with your rating within your company...

sajithdilshan 16d ago

You got really lucky. That was my exact thought as well when I started my career and looking back that was so naive.

hsbalanxvxjsmab 16d ago
I don't think I got lucky I think you got unlucky. My experience at all 5 bay area tech companies I have worked at has been the same in this regard

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ytoawwhra92 16d ago

> Do good work and be nice the rest follows Nice little soundbite but for this to work your personal interpretation of "good work" and "be nice" needs to align with the people around you and the broader organisation.

StevePrefontain 15d ago

I don’t think this is universal advice. I’m also a staff engineer and had to ask to get promoted to senior and staff level. Yes, you have to actually be doing good work and operating at that level as you say, but promotion culture has enormous variance. Sometimes you have to advocate for yourself. A mentor of mine was a VP of Engineering at mid-size companies for ~20 years and told me that he never got a promotion he didn’t ask for.