3 ms·

I've read already 4 different explanations here for why you've invaded Ukraine, each dumber than previous (ok, maybe not each - the one with CIA fundraising whi

by azan_ 7d ago

I've read already 4 different explanations here for why you've invaded Ukraine, each dumber than previous (ok, maybe not each - the one with CIA fundraising white supremacist that performed genetic experiments and tortured children is still top). Who was pointing gun at you? Ukraine? It's just laughable. Poor russia, always the victim, even when you start unprovoked war that resulted in hundreds of thousands of deaths you are still the victim.

AnimalMuppet 7d ago
Russia earned their paranoia the hard way - Napoleon and Hitler. They remember an invader that reached Moscow, took it, and held it for weeks, then burned it on the way out. They remember another invader that came within 35 miles of Moscow. That invasion started from the middle of Poland; they don't want to face one that starts from the eastern edge of Ukraine. Of course, this is still paranoia, no matter how honestly they come by it. NATO is not Hitler, nor is it Napoleon. NATO is not going to launch an unprovoked invasion of Russia, no matter what happened in the previous two centuries. But when Ukraine talks about joining NATO, Russia feels the gun pointed at it. There is no gun, but Russia feels it.
- azan_ 7d ago
  Yes, I understand how their delusions work, though I'm sure it's not universal - it's obvious that for most of higher ups the real reason is that they feel sad they can no longer control their neighbours. What's interesting is that they don't see it the other way - in XX and XXI century it was actually russia that kept attacking their neighbours, so demilitarization when you are neighbouring russia is basically death sentence.
  - AnimalMuppet 7d ago
    I'm not sure that it's wanting to control their neighbors. I think it's fear of their own populace. A functional, prosperous democracy next door, with people of the same ethnic and cultural background, might give Russians the idea that they can govern themselves, without needing a strongman. Putin is terrified of them thinking that. He's afraid of his own color revolution.

by azan_ 7d ago

AnimalMuppet 7d ago

Russia earned their paranoia the hard way - Napoleon and Hitler. They remember an invader that reached Moscow, took it, and held it for weeks, then burned it on the way out. They remember another invader that came within 35 miles of Moscow. That invasion started from the middle of Poland; they don't want to face one that starts from the eastern edge of Ukraine. Of course, this is still paranoia, no matter how honestly they come by it. NATO is not Hitler, nor is it Napoleon. NATO is not going to launch an unprovoked invasion of Russia, no matter what happened in the previous two centuries. But when Ukraine talks about joining NATO, Russia feels the gun pointed at it. There is no gun, but Russia feels it.

azan_ 7d ago
Yes, I understand how their delusions work, though I'm sure it's not universal - it's obvious that for most of higher ups the real reason is that they feel sad they can no longer control their neighbours. What's interesting is that they don't see it the other way - in XX and XXI century it was actually russia that kept attacking their neighbours, so demilitarization when you are neighbouring russia is basically death sentence.
- AnimalMuppet 7d ago
  I'm not sure that it's wanting to control their neighbors. I think it's fear of their own populace. A functional, prosperous democracy next door, with people of the same ethnic and cultural background, might give Russians the idea that they can govern themselves, without needing a strongman. Putin is terrified of them thinking that. He's afraid of his own color revolution.