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Little by little, people are realising that Europe is at war. Politicians are trying so hard not to say it because of the implications, but there’s only so long

Little by little, people are realising that Europe is at war. Politicians are trying so hard not to say it because of the implications, but there’s only so long you can keep your head buried in the sand. We’re under constant attacks from Russia… drones, sabotage, cyberattacks, propaganda campaigns derailing our elections… I’m sick of it.

embedding-shape 20d ago
Yeah, not sure why not at least being upfront about the possibility is so hard. In Spain we've had train derailments, flocks of people being directed on social media to force themselves across borders, subterfuge deluxe everywhere and what not, yet the government is mostly silent and claim it's all unrelated, but it's hard to not also see the parallels across the continent and reach your own conclusions. But then also, don't wanna fall into some conspiracy theory trap either...
- crote 20d ago
  Russia isn't the only group interested in doing terrorism in The Netherlands. Recently the Farmers Defense Force and Extinction Rebellion have caused far greater disruption. Could it be Russia? Obviously. But in my opinion the odds are less than a coin flip.
  - embedding-shape 20d ago
    > Recently the Farmers Defense Force and Extinction Rebellion Why derail trains though, especially in regards to the latter? Given it's one of the most environmental ways for transportation. Besides, groups like that tend to want to take responsibility, the whole point is to get attention to their groups.
    - maxboone 20d ago
      You're assuming rational goals instead of thinking in radical acts of terrorism. Throwing paint at a painting does not help the environment, but it does create radical flank effects. Blocking the highways does not help agriculture, but it does bring their problems in other people's home / discourse.
      - embedding-shape 20d ago
        You're misunderstanding why they do those things in the first place. You're referencing real activities here, how many of those activities you references people refused to take responsibility for doing? Look at photos from these events you refer to, people are proudly holding banners and signs here, not trying to be anonymous and flee from police and intelligence services. Have you never participated in political activism yourself, and you have no clue why you'd do those things you cite?
        toyg 20d ago
        It's a spectrum. You derail a train and nobody gets hurt? Shout it from the rooftops! You derail a train and people die? "Wasn't me, guv."
        embedding-shape 20d ago
        Please, do suggest this to any of these environmental activism groups and see how they'll laugh at you. You seriously think these people think like that??
        toyg 20d ago
        People fuck up, man. They don't plan to, but they do.
        embedding-shape 20d ago
        "Fucking up" in terms of "accidentally derailed a train more than wanted"? Sure, I used to do that too when I was a teenager...
    - crote 20d ago
      Stop, not derail. The saboteurs aren't physically damaging the railways: they are shorting the rails together, causing a fake train to be detected. But indeed, XR is the least likely subject. They have stopped trains before, but that was a human barricade, and it was a coal train.
    - Theodores 20d ago
      Groups such as Extinction Rebellion are easy to steer off course by the state into taking meaningless actions such as gluing themselves to London Underground trains. Perhaps this is just as well. If Extinction Rebellion really wanted to take down the entire transport network, they could do so by 'accidentally' touring the big stations with a leaky rucksack filled with lead paint fragments or ground up asbestos tiles, to then tip off the press. This would probably reveal an unfortunate truth, that there was plenty of aforementioned toxins already on the network, from brake pads and paint of yesteryear. Nonetheless, some closure for the guys in hazmat suits would be needed.
- MentalM 19d ago
  [flagged]
  - embedding-shape 19d ago
    [flagged]
maxboone 20d ago
We don't know whether this was Russia, it's just as likely it was the "farmers defence force" or climate activists. Edit: some context as I'm looking like a Russian shill now, which I understand. Today is the day that the budget gets announced, and the farmer terrorist organization (farmer defence force) have announced actions - and have disrupted highways by setting bales of hay on fire, and all the disruptions happened where farmer concentrations are high. Regardless, the situation is dire, and probably either the tankies or terror farmers are being helped by Russian destabilizing forces, it's too early to call this disruption an action from the FSB.
- mschuster91 20d ago
  if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck... Russia started with the hybrid war psyops shit, they don't get to complain about false accusations.
  - maxboone 20d ago
    I'm not defending Russia, it's just that the farmers terrorist organisation has announced major disruptions today and has also set hay bales on fire to shut down highways. For context: it's "Prinsjesdag" in the Netherlands which is when the budget is announced, and there are major changes to agriculture subsidies.
  - on_the_train 20d ago
    We've had a bunch of these acts of terrorism in Germany in the recent years. Mostly power, but also train and industrial targets. They all came from the same source, which is very much not Russian.
    - mschuster91 20d ago
      lol come on, I'm German. Of course a lot of the terrorism was probably (Vulkangruppe) or proven (the DHL and airport incidents, Tiergartenmord, SUV Bauschaum) Russian. The only thing that is probably something else is that guy from the last week shooting wires over transmission lines (lone wolf ecoterrorist), and the Nord Stream explosion which likely was Ukrainian. Anyone blathering about "the far left" is probably either far right or a Russian shill.
deleted 20d ago
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- deleted 20d ago
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jeltz 20d ago
What implications? Why wouldn't they want an, in this case real, external enemy they could use to distract the people from their own failures?
- stingraycharles 20d ago
  Perhaps the external enemy being able to do these things is, in fact, their own failure in a way.
  - jeltz 20d ago
    Not really, I do not buy that. Ukrainian intelligence can sabotage train tracks deep within Belarus and Russia. And given how convient it would be to blame Russia here I wonder why they do not.
crote 20d ago
It is indeed possible Russia is behind it, but considering a domestic farmers' terror group has told its followers to cause disruption today (as it is a politically-significant day), and those are definitely disrupting highways, chances are good they are also responsible for the railway disruptions. And if this is supposed to be war, then by European standards it is incredibly mild.
dividedbyzero 20d ago
And Russia is winning, they already have neutralized if not subjugated the US, but most of Europe is also heading towards that outcome, and fast. Russia is not this near omnipotent 5D chess mastermind behind all of the scenes in all of politics all across the West, but they are terrifyingly good at exploiting existing trends and influencing trajectories just so and they have been at it with great continuity over many decades. It's starting to really pay off. At this point, it's hard to imagine how the next German federal government could be anything else than either a completely dead-on-arrival coalition of polar opposites that only barely hangs on to keep the AfD out of government but will be unable to do anything at all, or an extremely Russia-friendly government the AfD is part of if not leads that is pretty much certain to continue within the EU what Trump started within NATO. Both outcomes serve Russia well, and the establishment has pretty much handed them that opportunity without meaningful resistance.
- newAccount2025 20d ago
  NATO is certainly weaker with the USA having lost her mind. But Russia seems to have gotten herself into a total quagmire in Ukraine and she is bleeding badly with no end in sight. Nobody is winning here.
alexejb 20d ago
I think of it the other way: EU politicians want war but are not able to say it out loud and clear. Instead we get a bunch of "russian sabotage" all over the place with flimsy evidence to back it. Get the simple people into a paranoid state and use it to justify decisions which are already made. Classic FUD. And the people seem to swallow it.
- scrollaway 20d ago
  Yeah mate whatever. Instead of scrolling twitter or whatever, donate some of your actual time to Ukraine and start getting up to speed with what Russia is really doing, straight from the source. Otherwise you’re just going to continue being what is commonly called a “useful idiot”. Edit: seeing your other posts, seems like you’re well beyond useful idiot territory and either a Russian agent or plain and simply a troll. Of course it’s always the ones you most expect.
  - alexejb 20d ago
    Wont donate anything to Ukraine – hopefully the part of my family from there has managed to bring out their boys. Yes, busification is a thing over there, "mate". If the useful idiots here in Europe are strong enough to back a political decision to go to war with Russia, I'm out. But you can go and fight, "mate". Edit: Seeing you're profiteering from the war [0], case closed I guess. [0]https://sevenseed.eu/ https://sevenseed.eu/ "Seven Seed is a Brussels-based group dedicated to empowering the European startup ecosystem, focused on the technologies that matter most: Artificial Intelligence and Defence."
    - scrollaway 20d ago
      I’m not profiting from the war, I’m donating my time. Idfk what’s wrong with you. (I mean, I know exactly what’s wrong with you… but you get my drift)
      - alexejb 20d ago
        [flagged]

embedding-shape 20d ago

Yeah, not sure why not at least being upfront about the possibility is so hard. In Spain we've had train derailments, flocks of people being directed on social media to force themselves across borders, subterfuge deluxe everywhere and what not, yet the government is mostly silent and claim it's all unrelated, but it's hard to not also see the parallels across the continent and reach your own conclusions. But then also, don't wanna fall into some conspiracy theory trap either...

crote 20d ago
Russia isn't the only group interested in doing terrorism in The Netherlands. Recently the Farmers Defense Force and Extinction Rebellion have caused far greater disruption. Could it be Russia? Obviously. But in my opinion the odds are less than a coin flip.
- embedding-shape 20d ago
  > Recently the Farmers Defense Force and Extinction Rebellion Why derail trains though, especially in regards to the latter? Given it's one of the most environmental ways for transportation. Besides, groups like that tend to want to take responsibility, the whole point is to get attention to their groups.
  - maxboone 20d ago
    You're assuming rational goals instead of thinking in radical acts of terrorism. Throwing paint at a painting does not help the environment, but it does create radical flank effects. Blocking the highways does not help agriculture, but it does bring their problems in other people's home / discourse.
    - embedding-shape 20d ago
      You're misunderstanding why they do those things in the first place. You're referencing real activities here, how many of those activities you references people refused to take responsibility for doing? Look at photos from these events you refer to, people are proudly holding banners and signs here, not trying to be anonymous and flee from police and intelligence services. Have you never participated in political activism yourself, and you have no clue why you'd do those things you cite?
      - toyg 20d ago
        It's a spectrum. You derail a train and nobody gets hurt? Shout it from the rooftops! You derail a train and people die? "Wasn't me, guv."
        embedding-shape 20d ago
        Please, do suggest this to any of these environmental activism groups and see how they'll laugh at you. You seriously think these people think like that??
        toyg 20d ago
        People fuck up, man. They don't plan to, but they do.
        embedding-shape 20d ago
        "Fucking up" in terms of "accidentally derailed a train more than wanted"? Sure, I used to do that too when I was a teenager...
  - crote 20d ago
    Stop, not derail. The saboteurs aren't physically damaging the railways: they are shorting the rails together, causing a fake train to be detected. But indeed, XR is the least likely subject. They have stopped trains before, but that was a human barricade, and it was a coal train.
  - Theodores 20d ago
    Groups such as Extinction Rebellion are easy to steer off course by the state into taking meaningless actions such as gluing themselves to London Underground trains. Perhaps this is just as well. If Extinction Rebellion really wanted to take down the entire transport network, they could do so by 'accidentally' touring the big stations with a leaky rucksack filled with lead paint fragments or ground up asbestos tiles, to then tip off the press. This would probably reveal an unfortunate truth, that there was plenty of aforementioned toxins already on the network, from brake pads and paint of yesteryear. Nonetheless, some closure for the guys in hazmat suits would be needed.
MentalM 19d ago
[flagged]
- embedding-shape 19d ago
  [flagged]

maxboone 20d ago

We don't know whether this was Russia, it's just as likely it was the "farmers defence force" or climate activists. Edit: some context as I'm looking like a Russian shill now, which I understand. Today is the day that the budget gets announced, and the farmer terrorist organization (farmer defence force) have announced actions - and have disrupted highways by setting bales of hay on fire, and all the disruptions happened where farmer concentrations are high. Regardless, the situation is dire, and probably either the tankies or terror farmers are being helped by Russian destabilizing forces, it's too early to call this disruption an action from the FSB.

mschuster91 20d ago
if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck... Russia started with the hybrid war psyops shit, they don't get to complain about false accusations.
- maxboone 20d ago
  I'm not defending Russia, it's just that the farmers terrorist organisation has announced major disruptions today and has also set hay bales on fire to shut down highways. For context: it's "Prinsjesdag" in the Netherlands which is when the budget is announced, and there are major changes to agriculture subsidies.
- on_the_train 20d ago
  We've had a bunch of these acts of terrorism in Germany in the recent years. Mostly power, but also train and industrial targets. They all came from the same source, which is very much not Russian.
  - mschuster91 20d ago
    lol come on, I'm German. Of course a lot of the terrorism was probably (Vulkangruppe) or proven (the DHL and airport incidents, Tiergartenmord, SUV Bauschaum) Russian. The only thing that is probably something else is that guy from the last week shooting wires over transmission lines (lone wolf ecoterrorist), and the Nord Stream explosion which likely was Ukrainian. Anyone blathering about "the far left" is probably either far right or a Russian shill.

deleted 20d ago

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deleted 20d ago
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jeltz 20d ago

What implications? Why wouldn't they want an, in this case real, external enemy they could use to distract the people from their own failures?

stingraycharles 20d ago
Perhaps the external enemy being able to do these things is, in fact, their own failure in a way.
- jeltz 20d ago
  Not really, I do not buy that. Ukrainian intelligence can sabotage train tracks deep within Belarus and Russia. And given how convient it would be to blame Russia here I wonder why they do not.

crote 20d ago

It is indeed possible Russia is behind it, but considering a domestic farmers' terror group has told its followers to cause disruption today (as it is a politically-significant day), and those are definitely disrupting highways, chances are good they are also responsible for the railway disruptions. And if this is supposed to be war, then by European standards it is incredibly mild.

dividedbyzero 20d ago

And Russia is winning, they already have neutralized if not subjugated the US, but most of Europe is also heading towards that outcome, and fast. Russia is not this near omnipotent 5D chess mastermind behind all of the scenes in all of politics all across the West, but they are terrifyingly good at exploiting existing trends and influencing trajectories just so and they have been at it with great continuity over many decades. It's starting to really pay off. At this point, it's hard to imagine how the next German federal government could be anything else than either a completely dead-on-arrival coalition of polar opposites that only barely hangs on to keep the AfD out of government but will be unable to do anything at all, or an extremely Russia-friendly government the AfD is part of if not leads that is pretty much certain to continue within the EU what Trump started within NATO. Both outcomes serve Russia well, and the establishment has pretty much handed them that opportunity without meaningful resistance.

newAccount2025 20d ago
NATO is certainly weaker with the USA having lost her mind. But Russia seems to have gotten herself into a total quagmire in Ukraine and she is bleeding badly with no end in sight. Nobody is winning here.

alexejb 20d ago

I think of it the other way: EU politicians want war but are not able to say it out loud and clear. Instead we get a bunch of "russian sabotage" all over the place with flimsy evidence to back it. Get the simple people into a paranoid state and use it to justify decisions which are already made. Classic FUD. And the people seem to swallow it.

scrollaway 20d ago
Yeah mate whatever. Instead of scrolling twitter or whatever, donate some of your actual time to Ukraine and start getting up to speed with what Russia is really doing, straight from the source. Otherwise you’re just going to continue being what is commonly called a “useful idiot”. Edit: seeing your other posts, seems like you’re well beyond useful idiot territory and either a Russian agent or plain and simply a troll. Of course it’s always the ones you most expect.
- alexejb 20d ago
  Wont donate anything to Ukraine – hopefully the part of my family from there has managed to bring out their boys. Yes, busification is a thing over there, "mate". If the useful idiots here in Europe are strong enough to back a political decision to go to war with Russia, I'm out. But you can go and fight, "mate". Edit: Seeing you're profiteering from the war [0], case closed I guess. [0]https://sevenseed.eu/ https://sevenseed.eu/ "Seven Seed is a Brussels-based group dedicated to empowering the European startup ecosystem, focused on the technologies that matter most: Artificial Intelligence and Defence."
  - scrollaway 20d ago
    I’m not profiting from the war, I’m donating my time. Idfk what’s wrong with you. (I mean, I know exactly what’s wrong with you… but you get my drift)
    - alexejb 20d ago
      [flagged]