4 ms·

>Before we trust you again, you must undergo what we Germans had to post-1945. Literally just yesterday, Germany's public broadcaster released a 26-minute docu

>Before we trust you again, you must undergo what we Germans had to post-1945. Literally just yesterday, Germany's public broadcaster released a 26-minute documentary. "The far right's rise: Is Germany at a breaking point?" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOk01r2eoc0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOk01r2eoc0 The AfD, which became Germany's top-polling political party for the first time last year, is now the clear leader in polls. It may soon win an absolute majority in a German state election. The far-right is also widely projected to win the 2027 French presidential election: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_French_presidential_election#Second_round https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2027_F... And Switzerland seriously considered immigration restrictions much harsher than anything contemplated by the US. It's interesting to see how leftism changes as you cross the Atlantic. In the US it's usually baseless moral self-flagellation; in Europe it's usually baseless moral preening. In neither case do the facts seem to be particularly important. "we gave you not just one chance to show you're better" is such a fascinating thing for you to say. For years our leaders told you to be less dependent on us. Now you're speaking as though your dependency on us was some kind of favor you were doing for us. It's mind-blowing how out-of-touch you guys can be.

KellyCriterion 1mo ago
Please elaborate, whats so strict about Switzerlands restrictions? Why shouldnt a country be allowed to limit the people they want to have from immigration? (Exercise for you: Try to get a passport from Liechtenstein, even if you work there permanently for a Liechtenstein company, its unlikely that you can even rent an appartment there!)
- 0xDEAFBEAD 1mo ago
  >Please elaborate, whats so strict about Switzerlands restrictions? Why shouldnt a country be allowed to limit the people they want to have from immigration? Precisely. Why is it that people only clutch their pearls with horror when this principle is applied to the US?
  - jjav 1mo ago
    I suspect because we don't regularly hear of masked armed thugs in Switzerland beating up, sometimes killing or throwing into concentration camps innocent people who were looking to immigrate. Nothing wrong with making immigration laws strict, if that's what a country wants. That is totall fine. But there is no justification to beat people up, kill them or throw them into concentration camps. Just tell them no in a professional manner and politely send them back to their own country (also, not some random contry they haver never been in).
    - nikanj 1mo ago
      ICE has killed US citizens too, they don’t limit themselves to immigrants
      - jjav 1mo ago
        Yes you are absolutely correct.
  - exe34 1mo ago
    How many Swiss citizens have they detained in concentration camps and deported to places they've never been and have no connections?
ReflectedImage 1mo ago
You haven't really the addressed the point of the US not being trusted. Even if the EU becomes far right, far right governments don't work or trust each other. What you are saying is moot.
- 0xDEAFBEAD 1mo ago
  As an American, I don't necessarily want the US to be trusted. I want foreign governments to put pressure on us to stop developing omnicidal AI. The sooner the "rogue AI agents" conversation links up with the "USA is untrustworthy" conversation, the better. As long as ASML is helping to supply OpenAI with AI chips, Europe still trusts the US too much. https://pauseai.info/amsterdam-protest-2025-december https://pauseai.info/amsterdam-protest-2025-december
- Timon3 1mo ago
  I'm not as optimistic as you are, because a component of the rightward shift is the international collaboration of the respective movements' leaders. For example, US republicans closely worked together with Orbans party and Germanys AfD, exchanging strategies and such. This is also reflected across the media landscape in these countries - when new fabricated talking points pop up across US conservative spaces, it usually takes 2-4 weeks until the same talking points are repeated by many German right-wing media outlets. Of course these alliances won't survive forever, as these movements have to continually expand their definitions of "out-groups" to keep their core "in-groups" satisfied, since they keep making their countries' issues worse by attempting fixes that are easy, simple, and wrong. But when a movement is built around the rejection of any uncomfortable history or research mixed with a huge dose of anti-intellectualism, it is fundamentally incapable of ever reflecting and learning beyond what the personal gain of their leaders.
  - mschuster91 1mo ago
    Most of these alliances are held together by Russia though. When Putin falls, they all fall.
    - 1mo ago

KellyCriterion 1mo ago

Please elaborate, whats so strict about Switzerlands restrictions? Why shouldnt a country be allowed to limit the people they want to have from immigration? (Exercise for you: Try to get a passport from Liechtenstein, even if you work there permanently for a Liechtenstein company, its unlikely that you can even rent an appartment there!)

0xDEAFBEAD 1mo ago
>Please elaborate, whats so strict about Switzerlands restrictions? Why shouldnt a country be allowed to limit the people they want to have from immigration? Precisely. Why is it that people only clutch their pearls with horror when this principle is applied to the US?
- jjav 1mo ago
  I suspect because we don't regularly hear of masked armed thugs in Switzerland beating up, sometimes killing or throwing into concentration camps innocent people who were looking to immigrate. Nothing wrong with making immigration laws strict, if that's what a country wants. That is totall fine. But there is no justification to beat people up, kill them or throw them into concentration camps. Just tell them no in a professional manner and politely send them back to their own country (also, not some random contry they haver never been in).
  - nikanj 1mo ago
    ICE has killed US citizens too, they don’t limit themselves to immigrants
    - jjav 1mo ago
      Yes you are absolutely correct.
- exe34 1mo ago
  How many Swiss citizens have they detained in concentration camps and deported to places they've never been and have no connections?

ReflectedImage 1mo ago

You haven't really the addressed the point of the US not being trusted. Even if the EU becomes far right, far right governments don't work or trust each other. What you are saying is moot.

0xDEAFBEAD 1mo ago
As an American, I don't necessarily want the US to be trusted. I want foreign governments to put pressure on us to stop developing omnicidal AI. The sooner the "rogue AI agents" conversation links up with the "USA is untrustworthy" conversation, the better. As long as ASML is helping to supply OpenAI with AI chips, Europe still trusts the US too much. https://pauseai.info/amsterdam-protest-2025-december https://pauseai.info/amsterdam-protest-2025-december
Timon3 1mo ago
I'm not as optimistic as you are, because a component of the rightward shift is the international collaboration of the respective movements' leaders. For example, US republicans closely worked together with Orbans party and Germanys AfD, exchanging strategies and such. This is also reflected across the media landscape in these countries - when new fabricated talking points pop up across US conservative spaces, it usually takes 2-4 weeks until the same talking points are repeated by many German right-wing media outlets. Of course these alliances won't survive forever, as these movements have to continually expand their definitions of "out-groups" to keep their core "in-groups" satisfied, since they keep making their countries' issues worse by attempting fixes that are easy, simple, and wrong. But when a movement is built around the rejection of any uncomfortable history or research mixed with a huge dose of anti-intellectualism, it is fundamentally incapable of ever reflecting and learning beyond what the personal gain of their leaders.
- mschuster91 1mo ago
  Most of these alliances are held together by Russia though. When Putin falls, they all fall.
  - 1mo ago