7 ms·

As someone who shares beliefs with FSF's ideals, reading this rant makes me think that maybe there's a chance to bring up another movement with the relative sam

As someone who shares beliefs with FSF's ideals, reading this rant makes me think that maybe there's a chance to bring up another movement with the relative same ideals as Free Software but have a different type of leadership.

af3 14y ago
why bringing something up? [1] just fork, code and... maybe make profit. [2] [1] http://xkcd.com/927/ http://xkcd.com/927/ [2] http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/A_Brief_History_of_Red_Hat_Linux http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/A_Brief_History_of_Red_H...
- dalke 14y ago
  Or Ubuntu? ;)
  - dillona 14y ago
    Shuttleworth is the last person I want to leave my fate up to. He is even after RMS.
    - dalke 14y ago
      It's the UNG project - Ubuntu is Not GNU! (Has no one already made that pun?)
- dlisboa 14y ago
  Because organization is important. There's more to software distribution than coding and the legal basis of it all is unifying for most free software. Some times you cannot "just fork, code" because the underlying legal framework for your software is broken, and you're forced to reinvent the wheel.
  - af3 14y ago
    the license under which code is released is important, the rest are excuses.
algorias 14y ago
Doesn't the open source movement overlap quite heavily with the ideals of free software? I know there are also significant differences, specially the tolerance of proprietary code. I'm not trying to start a flamewar here, just honestly curious why you think a 3rd alternative would bring change in any meaningful way. We have enough fragmentation as things stand.
- marcoamorales 14y ago
  They do overlap, but Open Source Initiative doesn't care at all about users' freedoms, which I personally believe to be very important.
  - dalke 14y ago
    Agreed. It took a while for me to understand the idea that the free/open source difference is reasonably described as the difference between user freedoms and developer freedoms.
    - chimeracoder 14y ago
      I like that distinction, but to be clear, the distinction isn't strictly an "either-or". It's pretty clear that "open source" is motivated by developer freedoms, but the fact that "free software" is motivated by user freedoms doesn't make it less about developer freedoms. In other words, if you subscribe to the four tenets of software freedom as they pertain to users, "free software" also provides as much freedom to the developers as is possible without compromising on the users' freedoms.
      - dalke 14y ago
        Developers are a proper subset of users. There's no either-or here.
        chimeracoder 14y ago
        Well, that's my point. "Open source" protects only the freedoms that relate to a portion of users (developers), whereas "free software" protects the freedoms that relate to all users.

af3 14y ago

why bringing something up? [1] just fork, code and... maybe make profit. [2] [1] http://xkcd.com/927/ http://xkcd.com/927/ [2] http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/A_Brief_History_of_Red_Hat_Linux http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/A_Brief_History_of_Red_H...

dalke 14y ago
Or Ubuntu? ;)
- dillona 14y ago
  Shuttleworth is the last person I want to leave my fate up to. He is even after RMS.
  - dalke 14y ago
    It's the UNG project - Ubuntu is Not GNU! (Has no one already made that pun?)
dlisboa 14y ago
Because organization is important. There's more to software distribution than coding and the legal basis of it all is unifying for most free software. Some times you cannot "just fork, code" because the underlying legal framework for your software is broken, and you're forced to reinvent the wheel.
- af3 14y ago
  the license under which code is released is important, the rest are excuses.

algorias 14y ago

Doesn't the open source movement overlap quite heavily with the ideals of free software? I know there are also significant differences, specially the tolerance of proprietary code. I'm not trying to start a flamewar here, just honestly curious why you think a 3rd alternative would bring change in any meaningful way. We have enough fragmentation as things stand.

marcoamorales 14y ago
They do overlap, but Open Source Initiative doesn't care at all about users' freedoms, which I personally believe to be very important.
- dalke 14y ago
  Agreed. It took a while for me to understand the idea that the free/open source difference is reasonably described as the difference between user freedoms and developer freedoms.
  - chimeracoder 14y ago
    I like that distinction, but to be clear, the distinction isn't strictly an "either-or". It's pretty clear that "open source" is motivated by developer freedoms, but the fact that "free software" is motivated by user freedoms doesn't make it less about developer freedoms. In other words, if you subscribe to the four tenets of software freedom as they pertain to users, "free software" also provides as much freedom to the developers as is possible without compromising on the users' freedoms.
    - dalke 14y ago
      Developers are a proper subset of users. There's no either-or here.
      - chimeracoder 14y ago
        Well, that's my point. "Open source" protects only the freedoms that relate to a portion of users (developers), whereas "free software" protects the freedoms that relate to all users.