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> Graphite belongs to the same category of commercial surveillance technology as Pegasus, the better-known spyware developed by NSO Group. Both are classified a

> Graphite belongs to the same category of commercial surveillance technology as Pegasus, the better-known spyware developed by NSO Group. Both are classified as mercenary spyware, meaning private companies develop and sell them to government intelligence and law enforcement agencies. This buries the lede a bit. These companies play their part in trans-national organized crime networks, spanning countries like the USA, Russia and Israel. In Russia, it is often hard to delineate between organized crime and the FSB, because these networks overlap and they are often well established within the structures of the state. The same increasingly applies to the USA. ICE is becoming a paramilitary force, "immigration control" is clearly not its only purpose. I cannot unsee this from the massive purges in the military, rooting out the most competent leadership. The parallels with Russia can't be ignored.

headsman771 1mo ago
What is ICE doing besides immigration control?
- saidnooneever 1mo ago
  causing misery
- MrWiffles 1mo ago
  Modern American version of the SS.
- wang_li 1mo ago
  I know you all are here getting ready for a circle jerk, however ICE stands for Immigration and Customs Enforcement. They monitor all goods and such coming and going from the country.
  - strictnein 1mo ago
    They are also heavily involved in stopping human trafficking, preventing child exploitation, etc.
- MSFT_Edging 1mo ago
  They're suggesting[1] they'll be attempting arrests at polling locations, which due to the statistics on fraudulent votes(statistically microscopic), equates to interference and intimidation since we know ICE isn't beyond arresting US citizens to harass them. This will have a chilling effect on citizens who are remotely non-white, who may avoid voting in person due to the risks associated with interacting with the under-trained ICE forces. Additionally, USPS's current plans[2] for purging mail-in votes will disenfranchise the other method of voting. [1]https://www.democracydocket.com/news-alerts/dhs-chief-says-ice-could-make-arrests-at-polling-places-ignoring-federal-ban/ https://www.democracydocket.com/news-alerts/dhs-chief-says-i... [2]https://www.cbsnews.com/news/whistleblower-postal-service-new-mail-ballot-system/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/whistleblower-postal-service-ne...
- strictnein 1mo ago
  They're the leading agency in the US involved in stopping human trafficking and child exploitation. Unfortunately the good work they do is being overshadowed by the other nonsensical shit.
chii 1mo ago
> ICE is becoming a paramilitary force this is how the gestapo gets established.
saidnooneever 1mo ago
there are many if these companies and toolkits. too many to mention. more than 150 countries spend over 10M a year on _offensive_ cyber. generally making use of such toolkits if they lack inhouse capabilities, which is pretty much all of those countries because the people creating the capabilities will refuse to work for them, so they can sell their tools.
- exceptione 1mo ago
  Yup, but here is the rub: you and me can't buy the real stuff. You have to be a professional law breaker, which means you are in organized crime (don't forget the white collar guys), or you are working for Intelligence, in whatever capacity, in whatever oversight. The problem is that for offensive surveillance organizations the line between crime and work gets blurred quickly. That is why I am not too enthusiastic that our Dutch intelligence agency will receive offensive capabilities as well. Information is power, and you will soon end up with an organization that feels limited by oversight, but that also can easily accumulate means to evade such oversight. Bonus points if people from those kinds of organizations find their way in legislative branches or overseeing powers. This has been a process of decades. Also surveillance, cybercrime and business do connect. If you look at the history of capital flows in the US, you will see a massive shift of capital from military has been redirected to the surveillance industry. If you would cut out surveillance from the USA economy, things would look quite different. The stock market is heavily skewed towards companies with this business model. As food for thought, think about what the GDP looks like without Apple, Google, Anthropic, OpenAI etc. To give an example of just one facet, Meta alone makes billions on crime each year [1] and will fight toot and nail anyone who dares to threaten their business model of addiction and privacy violation. To continue down this path against the interests of the public, these companies feel confident enough to try their hands at dangerous games [2], of which history teaches us that will always end in tears, because zero-sum is in the end a hunger game. [1] https://www.reuters.com/investigations/meta-is-earning-fortune-deluge-fraudulent-ads-documents-show-2025-11-06/ https://www.reuters.com/investigations/meta-is-earning-fortu... [2] https://abc45.com/news/nation-world/big-tech-ceos-attend-trumps-inauguration-jeff-bezos-mark-zuckerberg-elon-musk-sundar-pichai-spacex-amazon-meta-tesla-google-facebook https://abc45.com/news/nation-world/big-tech-ceos-attend-tru...
jason-phillips 1mo ago
> I cannot unsee this from the massive purges in the military, rooting out the most competent leadership. Structural coherence issues aside, is this some sort of a joke, or just thinly veiled personal bias presented as fact?
- catlover76 1mo ago
  [dead]
thesuitonym 1mo ago
Becoming?
MisterTea 1mo ago
> In Russia, it is often hard to delineate between organized crime and the FSB, because these networks overlap and they are often well established within the structures of the state. This already applies to the USA where Trump was very likely involved with the mob who were deeply embedded in the fabric of NYC. All of his NYC construction projects were pushed through and built by mobbed up companies. It's obvious he's in bed with anyone who will get him what he wants, criminal or not.

headsman771 1mo ago

What is ICE doing besides immigration control?

saidnooneever 1mo ago
causing misery
MrWiffles 1mo ago
Modern American version of the SS.
wang_li 1mo ago
I know you all are here getting ready for a circle jerk, however ICE stands for Immigration and Customs Enforcement. They monitor all goods and such coming and going from the country.
- strictnein 1mo ago
  They are also heavily involved in stopping human trafficking, preventing child exploitation, etc.
MSFT_Edging 1mo ago
They're suggesting[1] they'll be attempting arrests at polling locations, which due to the statistics on fraudulent votes(statistically microscopic), equates to interference and intimidation since we know ICE isn't beyond arresting US citizens to harass them. This will have a chilling effect on citizens who are remotely non-white, who may avoid voting in person due to the risks associated with interacting with the under-trained ICE forces. Additionally, USPS's current plans[2] for purging mail-in votes will disenfranchise the other method of voting. [1]https://www.democracydocket.com/news-alerts/dhs-chief-says-ice-could-make-arrests-at-polling-places-ignoring-federal-ban/ https://www.democracydocket.com/news-alerts/dhs-chief-says-i... [2]https://www.cbsnews.com/news/whistleblower-postal-service-new-mail-ballot-system/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/whistleblower-postal-service-ne...
strictnein 1mo ago
They're the leading agency in the US involved in stopping human trafficking and child exploitation. Unfortunately the good work they do is being overshadowed by the other nonsensical shit.

chii 1mo ago

> ICE is becoming a paramilitary force this is how the gestapo gets established.

saidnooneever 1mo ago

there are many if these companies and toolkits. too many to mention. more than 150 countries spend over 10M a year on _offensive_ cyber. generally making use of such toolkits if they lack inhouse capabilities, which is pretty much all of those countries because the people creating the capabilities will refuse to work for them, so they can sell their tools.

exceptione 1mo ago
Yup, but here is the rub: you and me can't buy the real stuff. You have to be a professional law breaker, which means you are in organized crime (don't forget the white collar guys), or you are working for Intelligence, in whatever capacity, in whatever oversight. The problem is that for offensive surveillance organizations the line between crime and work gets blurred quickly. That is why I am not too enthusiastic that our Dutch intelligence agency will receive offensive capabilities as well. Information is power, and you will soon end up with an organization that feels limited by oversight, but that also can easily accumulate means to evade such oversight. Bonus points if people from those kinds of organizations find their way in legislative branches or overseeing powers. This has been a process of decades. Also surveillance, cybercrime and business do connect. If you look at the history of capital flows in the US, you will see a massive shift of capital from military has been redirected to the surveillance industry. If you would cut out surveillance from the USA economy, things would look quite different. The stock market is heavily skewed towards companies with this business model. As food for thought, think about what the GDP looks like without Apple, Google, Anthropic, OpenAI etc. To give an example of just one facet, Meta alone makes billions on crime each year [1] and will fight toot and nail anyone who dares to threaten their business model of addiction and privacy violation. To continue down this path against the interests of the public, these companies feel confident enough to try their hands at dangerous games [2], of which history teaches us that will always end in tears, because zero-sum is in the end a hunger game. [1] https://www.reuters.com/investigations/meta-is-earning-fortune-deluge-fraudulent-ads-documents-show-2025-11-06/ https://www.reuters.com/investigations/meta-is-earning-fortu... [2] https://abc45.com/news/nation-world/big-tech-ceos-attend-trumps-inauguration-jeff-bezos-mark-zuckerberg-elon-musk-sundar-pichai-spacex-amazon-meta-tesla-google-facebook https://abc45.com/news/nation-world/big-tech-ceos-attend-tru...

jason-phillips 1mo ago

> I cannot unsee this from the massive purges in the military, rooting out the most competent leadership. Structural coherence issues aside, is this some sort of a joke, or just thinly veiled personal bias presented as fact?

catlover76 1mo ago
[dead]

thesuitonym 1mo ago

Becoming?

MisterTea 1mo ago

> In Russia, it is often hard to delineate between organized crime and the FSB, because these networks overlap and they are often well established within the structures of the state. This already applies to the USA where Trump was very likely involved with the mob who were deeply embedded in the fabric of NYC. All of his NYC construction projects were pushed through and built by mobbed up companies. It's obvious he's in bed with anyone who will get him what he wants, criminal or not.