5 ms·

Pixel 10 was so bad I had to trade it in after using for a month. The version I got was 128GB for a whopping $600. This was my first Google device after Nexus d

by esalman 1mo ago

Pixel 10 was so bad I had to trade it in after using for a month. The version I got was 128GB for a whopping $600. This was my first Google device after Nexus days and I was bitterly disappointed with weird performance bugs and battery drain issues. The software does little to make up for the issues. The replacement I got is a Motorola razr ultra folding phone.. similar perf point with 16G RAM and 512G storage. This phone is legit.

port11 1mo ago
Ahm… phones have as much memory as my laptop? Man, here was I thinking a Pixel 7 would make a good Graphene device.
- jmaksv 1mo ago
  I have multiple Pixel 7 phones GrapheneOS in my family with close to zero issues. It's a good choice for GrapheneOS IMO, except that support ends in Oct 2027. The Pixel 8 is still great also but has a more fragile screen. I haven't used any newer devices with it yet.
  - port11 1mo ago
    Sounds good, thank you. The Pixel 8 is way outside my budget, it’ll mostly be a testing device for my mobile apps (gotta make them work on GOS).
    - grapheneos 1mo ago
      Get a used Pixel 8a instead of a Pixel 7. Pixel 8 and later have 7 years of support from launch instead of 5 along with MTE. The 'a' series devices are cheaper but have a variant of the same SoC for 6th through 9th gen. A used Pixel 8a or a new Pixel 10a are both very good value.
  - deleted 1mo ago
    [deleted]
  - joshspankit 1mo ago
    If you’re using Graphene as the OS, does it matter if support ends?
    - port11 1mo ago
      GOS has their own support policy, they can’t keep updating old(er) devices. So yeah, it matters, as some vulnerabilities wouldn’t be patched on some devices.
      - joshspankit 1mo ago
        Aha, sorry, I hadn’t realized that GOS had their own EOL timeline. What I meant to ask was “If you use GOS, does it matter if Google ends support” and after your comment I read deeper to find the answer “yes, because GOS relies on Google to maintain the firmware”. Thanks for the push
- nine_k 1mo ago
  With a BT keyboard, and a decent USB-C/HDMI screen, such a phone may be an acceptable laptop. Both Samsung and Google support desktop mode now.
  - tacomagick 1mo ago
    Do they allow Dex on Samsung flagships but without a exernal screen yet? Samsung Tab A10 FE had this and it could turn into a desktop in seconds without needing a second screen. However when I thought this would be a killer feature of the Galaxy Fold it was completely missing and just like the flagships of the time it needed a wireless or a wired monitor to run Dex
  - esalman 1mo ago
    Actually, because it's a fold and the external screen is very good, I end up checking notifications and stuff without having to open the phone, which results in less distraction and screen time.
  - grapheneos 1mo ago
    Pixel 8 or later is required for DisplayPort alternate mode. Pixel 8 through Pixel 10a are also the recommended devices for GrapheneOS due to 7 years of support from launch and providing the full set of our security requirements. We don't recommend buying a 7th gen Pixel anymore and definitely not 6th gen.
  - ryukafalz 1mo ago
    Or a lapdock for an all-in-one equivalent. The latest NexDock finally has a decent touchpad.
  - deleted 1mo ago
    [deleted]
- esalman 1mo ago
  Definitely. This is great considering our family Google One plan has 100GB storage which is more than 60% full, but I don't really need to sweat it because I can back up most things on this phone and ignore Google photos backup alerts.
  - kuschku 1mo ago
    And that's why I refuse to buy phones without microSD slot. I've got 2TB of storage in a $300 phone, for all my music and photos.
- Grombobulous 1mo ago
  32GB is pretty common for new laptops, especially if you’re looking to utilize your integrated graphics (shared memory). Also keep in mind that modern integrated graphics can be really good, and therefore play games that demand more memory (e.g., Panther Lake X7). The 24GB MacBook Air is the sweet spot of that model lineup in my opinion. Even if you’re a true “web browsing only” user, you can definitely find a sale or refurbished model with 24GB and that’s a much more wise purchase for long term ownership than being stuck with 16GB. Especially considering most laptops have soldered memory, I’d have a hard time recommending a new laptop purchase with 16GB if your intention is to keep it many years. Even though RAM is expensive, there are deals and sales out there.
  - kuschku 1mo ago
    And then there's Apple, selling new MacBooks with 8GB RAM (e.g., the neo)
    - Grombobulous 1mo ago
      For what it is, it’s not a bad device, but you’re definitely better off grabbing an M3 MacBook Air 16GB for around the same price.
  - fc417fc802 1mo ago
    > keep in mind that modern integrated graphics can be really good Sort of but not really? Without the wider bus (and various drawbacks) of GDDR any iGPU is very severely memory bandwidth constrained compared to a dGPU from an equivalently recent generation. It's just that a 3 or 4 generation old dGPU is sufficient for an ever increasing number of titles. TBF it entirely depends on what is meant by "really good". > I’d have a hard time recommending a new laptop purchase with 16GB if your intention is to keep it many years. One of my devices still has only 8GB and I use it daily. It's really not an issue for most things.
    - Grombobulous 1mo ago
      Don’t forget that all MacBook models are “integrated graphics.” If you start doing graphical stuff or gaming you’ll need more RAM. If you’ve got a Windows laptop with an RTX 5050/5060 with its own dedicated memory, then yeah, you don’t really need more than 16GB unless you’re doing something specific. Integrated graphics are constrained but often sufficient to play AAA games. Panther Lake laptops are roughly equivalent to an RTX 4050, which is only a single generation old. Obviously not the strongest GPU to compare against but you’re also pulling a lot less wattage doing it. I’m sure your 8GB device is working great, but someone buying a brand new device really should avoid that since the implication is that they’re going to keep that device for somewhere between 3-7 years.
monksy 1mo ago
At what point do we blame google for going the route of regressive and damaging business tacitcs to earn a penny while burning a dollar?
grapheneos 1mo ago
We plan to support future versions of the Motorola Signature, Razr Fold and Razr Ultra. We'll have at least a non-folding Signature successor in 2027 but aren't yet sure if the folding devices will provide what we need. We're confident it's going to be much better hardware than Pixels and that our users will be happy with it. Our initial goal was only providing competitive security with Pixels but it's now clear we can do better in most areas. Google will likely have a significantly better secure element for a while but that can change too. What's the point of the Pixel 11 and later now that they aren't supported by AOSP and are no longer going to be best in class for security? The updates and security features are why GrapheneOS uses them. We have ~500k users on the Pixel 6 through Pixel 10a and many of those users had multiple previous Pixel and Nexus devices for GrapheneOS. Our userbase is rapidly growing at an increasing rate and was already significant for Pixels.
- kuschku 1mo ago
  Does this mean we might finally get a phone with 3.5mm jack, microSD slot and GrapheneOS support? I believe I've been asking for that for 10 years now.
  - grapheneos 1mo ago
    The last Pixel with a 3.5mm jack was the Pixel 5a launched in August 2021. The 3rd/4th/5th gen Pixel 'a' series headphone jacks had horrible audio quality far worse than using the decent USB-C DAC included with the Pixel 2 and Pixel 3. They stopped bundling that with the Pixel 4. Extendable storage is usually provided via the SIM tray. Physical SIMs are being phased out which is not good news for the feature you want. Realistically, you'll still need to use USB-C for headphones or an external drive. You can look at the Motorola Signature (2026) for an idea of the initial device which will be a successor to it. Their high end devices don't have 3.5mm audio or microSD. They have devices with those but they're nowhere near our requirements.
    - kuschku 1mo ago
      I have been using Sony Xperia's since the Pixel 1 phased out the headphone jack, and the Xperias have had better 3.5mm jacks than even many dedicated DACs. Physical SIMs being phased out seems to be primarily a US thing right now, but if that happens I'm just gonna stop using phones entirely. If you want to glue a usb hub, DAC and card reader to your phone, go ahead, but I'd consider that a little bit inconvenient. Seriously, the latency on wireless and usb-c headphones is so unpredictable that for lecture recording at hacker conferences they've now been banned for both live video/audio production and for video editing, with 3.5mm as the only option going forward.

by esalman 1mo ago

port11 1mo ago

Ahm… phones have as much memory as my laptop? Man, here was I thinking a Pixel 7 would make a good Graphene device.

jmaksv 1mo ago
I have multiple Pixel 7 phones GrapheneOS in my family with close to zero issues. It's a good choice for GrapheneOS IMO, except that support ends in Oct 2027. The Pixel 8 is still great also but has a more fragile screen. I haven't used any newer devices with it yet.
- port11 1mo ago
  Sounds good, thank you. The Pixel 8 is way outside my budget, it’ll mostly be a testing device for my mobile apps (gotta make them work on GOS).
  - grapheneos 1mo ago
    Get a used Pixel 8a instead of a Pixel 7. Pixel 8 and later have 7 years of support from launch instead of 5 along with MTE. The 'a' series devices are cheaper but have a variant of the same SoC for 6th through 9th gen. A used Pixel 8a or a new Pixel 10a are both very good value.
- deleted 1mo ago
  [deleted]
- joshspankit 1mo ago
  If you’re using Graphene as the OS, does it matter if support ends?
  - port11 1mo ago
    GOS has their own support policy, they can’t keep updating old(er) devices. So yeah, it matters, as some vulnerabilities wouldn’t be patched on some devices.
    - joshspankit 1mo ago
      Aha, sorry, I hadn’t realized that GOS had their own EOL timeline. What I meant to ask was “If you use GOS, does it matter if Google ends support” and after your comment I read deeper to find the answer “yes, because GOS relies on Google to maintain the firmware”. Thanks for the push
nine_k 1mo ago
With a BT keyboard, and a decent USB-C/HDMI screen, such a phone may be an acceptable laptop. Both Samsung and Google support desktop mode now.
- tacomagick 1mo ago
  Do they allow Dex on Samsung flagships but without a exernal screen yet? Samsung Tab A10 FE had this and it could turn into a desktop in seconds without needing a second screen. However when I thought this would be a killer feature of the Galaxy Fold it was completely missing and just like the flagships of the time it needed a wireless or a wired monitor to run Dex
- esalman 1mo ago
  Actually, because it's a fold and the external screen is very good, I end up checking notifications and stuff without having to open the phone, which results in less distraction and screen time.
- grapheneos 1mo ago
  Pixel 8 or later is required for DisplayPort alternate mode. Pixel 8 through Pixel 10a are also the recommended devices for GrapheneOS due to 7 years of support from launch and providing the full set of our security requirements. We don't recommend buying a 7th gen Pixel anymore and definitely not 6th gen.
- ryukafalz 1mo ago
  Or a lapdock for an all-in-one equivalent. The latest NexDock finally has a decent touchpad.
- deleted 1mo ago
  [deleted]
esalman 1mo ago
Definitely. This is great considering our family Google One plan has 100GB storage which is more than 60% full, but I don't really need to sweat it because I can back up most things on this phone and ignore Google photos backup alerts.
- kuschku 1mo ago
  And that's why I refuse to buy phones without microSD slot. I've got 2TB of storage in a $300 phone, for all my music and photos.
Grombobulous 1mo ago
32GB is pretty common for new laptops, especially if you’re looking to utilize your integrated graphics (shared memory). Also keep in mind that modern integrated graphics can be really good, and therefore play games that demand more memory (e.g., Panther Lake X7). The 24GB MacBook Air is the sweet spot of that model lineup in my opinion. Even if you’re a true “web browsing only” user, you can definitely find a sale or refurbished model with 24GB and that’s a much more wise purchase for long term ownership than being stuck with 16GB. Especially considering most laptops have soldered memory, I’d have a hard time recommending a new laptop purchase with 16GB if your intention is to keep it many years. Even though RAM is expensive, there are deals and sales out there.
- kuschku 1mo ago
  And then there's Apple, selling new MacBooks with 8GB RAM (e.g., the neo)
  - Grombobulous 1mo ago
    For what it is, it’s not a bad device, but you’re definitely better off grabbing an M3 MacBook Air 16GB for around the same price.
- fc417fc802 1mo ago
  > keep in mind that modern integrated graphics can be really good Sort of but not really? Without the wider bus (and various drawbacks) of GDDR any iGPU is very severely memory bandwidth constrained compared to a dGPU from an equivalently recent generation. It's just that a 3 or 4 generation old dGPU is sufficient for an ever increasing number of titles. TBF it entirely depends on what is meant by "really good". > I’d have a hard time recommending a new laptop purchase with 16GB if your intention is to keep it many years. One of my devices still has only 8GB and I use it daily. It's really not an issue for most things.
  - Grombobulous 1mo ago
    Don’t forget that all MacBook models are “integrated graphics.” If you start doing graphical stuff or gaming you’ll need more RAM. If you’ve got a Windows laptop with an RTX 5050/5060 with its own dedicated memory, then yeah, you don’t really need more than 16GB unless you’re doing something specific. Integrated graphics are constrained but often sufficient to play AAA games. Panther Lake laptops are roughly equivalent to an RTX 4050, which is only a single generation old. Obviously not the strongest GPU to compare against but you’re also pulling a lot less wattage doing it. I’m sure your 8GB device is working great, but someone buying a brand new device really should avoid that since the implication is that they’re going to keep that device for somewhere between 3-7 years.

monksy 1mo ago

At what point do we blame google for going the route of regressive and damaging business tacitcs to earn a penny while burning a dollar?

grapheneos 1mo ago

We plan to support future versions of the Motorola Signature, Razr Fold and Razr Ultra. We'll have at least a non-folding Signature successor in 2027 but aren't yet sure if the folding devices will provide what we need. We're confident it's going to be much better hardware than Pixels and that our users will be happy with it. Our initial goal was only providing competitive security with Pixels but it's now clear we can do better in most areas. Google will likely have a significantly better secure element for a while but that can change too. What's the point of the Pixel 11 and later now that they aren't supported by AOSP and are no longer going to be best in class for security? The updates and security features are why GrapheneOS uses them. We have ~500k users on the Pixel 6 through Pixel 10a and many of those users had multiple previous Pixel and Nexus devices for GrapheneOS. Our userbase is rapidly growing at an increasing rate and was already significant for Pixels.

kuschku 1mo ago
Does this mean we might finally get a phone with 3.5mm jack, microSD slot and GrapheneOS support? I believe I've been asking for that for 10 years now.
- grapheneos 1mo ago
  The last Pixel with a 3.5mm jack was the Pixel 5a launched in August 2021. The 3rd/4th/5th gen Pixel 'a' series headphone jacks had horrible audio quality far worse than using the decent USB-C DAC included with the Pixel 2 and Pixel 3. They stopped bundling that with the Pixel 4. Extendable storage is usually provided via the SIM tray. Physical SIMs are being phased out which is not good news for the feature you want. Realistically, you'll still need to use USB-C for headphones or an external drive. You can look at the Motorola Signature (2026) for an idea of the initial device which will be a successor to it. Their high end devices don't have 3.5mm audio or microSD. They have devices with those but they're nowhere near our requirements.
  - kuschku 1mo ago
    I have been using Sony Xperia's since the Pixel 1 phased out the headphone jack, and the Xperias have had better 3.5mm jacks than even many dedicated DACs. Physical SIMs being phased out seems to be primarily a US thing right now, but if that happens I'm just gonna stop using phones entirely. If you want to glue a usb hub, DAC and card reader to your phone, go ahead, but I'd consider that a little bit inconvenient. Seriously, the latency on wireless and usb-c headphones is so unpredictable that for lecture recording at hacker conferences they've now been banned for both live video/audio production and for video editing, with 3.5mm as the only option going forward.