4 ms·

Isn't there likely a large epigenetic component?

DoctorOetker 1mo ago
For single celled organisms "epigenetic" effects carry non-basepair state from a single-cell parent cell individual to its single-cell children cell individuals after cell division, For multi-cellular organisms "epigenetic" effects carry cell type state from lesser differentiated cell type parent to identical or higher differentiated cell type children cells in the same individual. For example A->B+C where A,B,C are distinct cell types, or A->A+B, etc. You can't just copy paste the "individual level" concept of "epigenetic effects" from single-celled organisms to multicellular organisms. Yes epigenetic state transfer exists in multicellular organisms but it still carries it from parent cell to child cell, not from multicellular parent individual to multicellular child individual thats just brainfart.
- foolswisdom 1mo ago
  I'm not sure if I understand, you're saying that there is no such thing as epigenetic inheritance? In other words you disagree with the phenomenon discussed in this wiki page? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenerational_epigenetic_inheritance?wprov=sfla1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenerational_epigenetic_i...
  - wahern 1mo ago
    There absolutely is such a thing as epigenetic inheritance. E.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genomic_imprinting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genomic_imprinting Epigenetics is a pretty broad term. Transgenerational epigenetic inheritance of environmentally-induced expressions, however, has never been firmly demonstrated in mammals, let alone humans. There's a bunch of needles that need to be threaded to achieve it, for example modifying gametes, then sneaking past the epigenetic resetting that occurs during meiosis, etc. Repeat the feat to cross more than one generation. There's a ton of extravagant claims and overly credulous reception driven in part by powerful cultural narratives. AFAIU, epigenetics in the popular discourse has different connotations then for most scientists. And when a scientist says epigentic processes are beyond dispute--because many of them are clearly established as key to some basic developmental processes--the lay person takes this as validation of, e.g., epigenetically inherited intergenerational trauma. But there's tremendous distance between those two extremes, both semantically and physically.

For single celled organisms "epigenetic" effects carry non-basepair state from a single-cell parent cell individual to its single-cell children cell individuals after cell division, For multi-cellular organisms "epigenetic" effects carry cell type state from lesser differentiated cell type parent to identical or higher differentiated cell type children cells in the same individual. For example A->B+C where A,B,C are distinct cell types, or A->A+B, etc. You can't just copy paste the "individual level" concept of "epigenetic effects" from single-celled organisms to multicellular organisms. Yes epigenetic state transfer exists in multicellular organisms but it still carries it from parent cell to child cell, not from multicellular parent individual to multicellular child individual thats just brainfart.

foolswisdom 1mo ago
I'm not sure if I understand, you're saying that there is no such thing as epigenetic inheritance? In other words you disagree with the phenomenon discussed in this wiki page? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenerational_epigenetic_inheritance?wprov=sfla1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenerational_epigenetic_i...
- wahern 1mo ago
  There absolutely is such a thing as epigenetic inheritance. E.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genomic_imprinting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genomic_imprinting Epigenetics is a pretty broad term. Transgenerational epigenetic inheritance of environmentally-induced expressions, however, has never been firmly demonstrated in mammals, let alone humans. There's a bunch of needles that need to be threaded to achieve it, for example modifying gametes, then sneaking past the epigenetic resetting that occurs during meiosis, etc. Repeat the feat to cross more than one generation. There's a ton of extravagant claims and overly credulous reception driven in part by powerful cultural narratives. AFAIU, epigenetics in the popular discourse has different connotations then for most scientists. And when a scientist says epigentic processes are beyond dispute--because many of them are clearly established as key to some basic developmental processes--the lay person takes this as validation of, e.g., epigenetically inherited intergenerational trauma. But there's tremendous distance between those two extremes, both semantically and physically.