3 ms·

Everything else aside, > "people without work visas" is not the same legal category as > "they're not supposed to be here"

mdp2021 2mo ago
People with tourist visas I expect fully entitled and able to get car loans... (Edit: maybe I am misunderstanding the whole thing: is it "loaning cars" or is it "loaning the money to buy cars"?)
- BugsJustFindMe 2mo ago
  A car loan is usually loaning money for the purpose of buying a car, not loaning a car.
- InitialLastName 2mo ago
  In the US, we usually refer to "paying someone to borrow a car" as a car "rental" and "borrowing money to finance a car purchase" as a car "loan".
- Nicook 2mo ago
  getting a long term loan to buy a car sounds like it would signal intention to be more than a tourist.
  - mdp2021 2mo ago
    As the edit in the post tells you, I initially interpreted «auto loans» as "car rentals" - "lending an auto".
gruez 2mo ago
1. So you'd agree that AI datecenter with 100 (or whatever) jet turbines merely "lacks a permit" rather than "not supposed to be there"? 2. Practically speaking, how many people lack a work visa (or similar documentation), but are supposed to be here?
- BugsJustFindMe 2mo ago
  Anecdotally speaking, I've personally lived in multiple countries on multi-year-long temporary resident visas without the right to work, because getting the right to work is a separate process from being allowed to be somewhere. So have family members. And in case it makes a difference, which it might, one of those countries was the US. In fact, did you know, in Canada it doesn't count as work for visa purposes if you work over the internet for a foreign company and get paid into a foreign bank account and don't compete professionally with local interests? (This is a free hot tip for anyone wanting to live in Canada. It might be true in some other places too, but I don't know.)
  - gruez 2mo ago
    >Anecdotally speaking, I've personally lived in multiple countries on multi-year-long temporary resident visas without the right to work, because getting the right to work is a separate process from being allowed to be somewhere. So have family members. And in case it makes a difference, which it might, one of those countries was the US. Usually those long term visas (eg. student visas, I guess) require some sort of extra vetting to acquire (ie. they're not the tourist visas that get auto-issued at the border), and therefore are unlikely to be possessed by "people who aren't supposed to be here", so as a practical matter I agree they should be accepted in place of a "work visa".
  - triceratops 2mo ago
    > in Canada it doesn't count as work for visa purposes if you work over the internet for a foreign company and get paid into a foreign bank account and don't compete professionally with local interests? Source? If you can do that, a Canadian could too. So you're directly competing with "local interests".
    - BugsJustFindMe 2mo ago
      > Source? See e.g. https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/operational-bulletins-manuals/temporary-residents/foreign-workers/what-is-work.html https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/co... What kind of activities are not considered to be “work”? ... long distance (by telephone or Internet) work done by a temporary resident whose employer is outside Canada and who is remunerated from outside Canada; Also: https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/section-186.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227... A foreign national may work in Canada without a work permit (a) as a business visitor to Canada within the meaning of section 187; Which directs us to https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/section-187.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227... 187 (1) For the purposes of paragraph 186(a), a business visitor to Canada is a foreign national who ... seeks to engage in international business activities in Canada without directly entering the Canadian labour market. ... (3) For the purpose of subsection (1), a foreign national seeks to engage in international business activities in Canada without directly entering the Canadian labour market only if (a) the primary source of remuneration for the business activities is outside Canada; and (b) the principal place of business and actual place of accrual of profits remain predominately outside Canada. > If you can do that, a Canadian could too. So you're directly competing with "local interests". You may send your letter of complaint to the Government of Canada's department of Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship. I'm kidding. :) I guess the interests to which you're referring are just tautologically not the interests I meant. Apologies for the confusion.

mdp2021 2mo ago

People with tourist visas I expect fully entitled and able to get car loans... (Edit: maybe I am misunderstanding the whole thing: is it "loaning cars" or is it "loaning the money to buy cars"?)

BugsJustFindMe 2mo ago
A car loan is usually loaning money for the purpose of buying a car, not loaning a car.
InitialLastName 2mo ago
In the US, we usually refer to "paying someone to borrow a car" as a car "rental" and "borrowing money to finance a car purchase" as a car "loan".
Nicook 2mo ago
getting a long term loan to buy a car sounds like it would signal intention to be more than a tourist.
- mdp2021 2mo ago
  As the edit in the post tells you, I initially interpreted «auto loans» as "car rentals" - "lending an auto".

gruez 2mo ago

1. So you'd agree that AI datecenter with 100 (or whatever) jet turbines merely "lacks a permit" rather than "not supposed to be there"? 2. Practically speaking, how many people lack a work visa (or similar documentation), but are supposed to be here?

BugsJustFindMe 2mo ago
Anecdotally speaking, I've personally lived in multiple countries on multi-year-long temporary resident visas without the right to work, because getting the right to work is a separate process from being allowed to be somewhere. So have family members. And in case it makes a difference, which it might, one of those countries was the US. In fact, did you know, in Canada it doesn't count as work for visa purposes if you work over the internet for a foreign company and get paid into a foreign bank account and don't compete professionally with local interests? (This is a free hot tip for anyone wanting to live in Canada. It might be true in some other places too, but I don't know.)
- gruez 2mo ago
  >Anecdotally speaking, I've personally lived in multiple countries on multi-year-long temporary resident visas without the right to work, because getting the right to work is a separate process from being allowed to be somewhere. So have family members. And in case it makes a difference, which it might, one of those countries was the US. Usually those long term visas (eg. student visas, I guess) require some sort of extra vetting to acquire (ie. they're not the tourist visas that get auto-issued at the border), and therefore are unlikely to be possessed by "people who aren't supposed to be here", so as a practical matter I agree they should be accepted in place of a "work visa".
- triceratops 2mo ago
  > in Canada it doesn't count as work for visa purposes if you work over the internet for a foreign company and get paid into a foreign bank account and don't compete professionally with local interests? Source? If you can do that, a Canadian could too. So you're directly competing with "local interests".
  - BugsJustFindMe 2mo ago
    > Source? See e.g. https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/operational-bulletins-manuals/temporary-residents/foreign-workers/what-is-work.html https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/co... What kind of activities are not considered to be “work”? ... long distance (by telephone or Internet) work done by a temporary resident whose employer is outside Canada and who is remunerated from outside Canada; Also: https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/section-186.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227... A foreign national may work in Canada without a work permit (a) as a business visitor to Canada within the meaning of section 187; Which directs us to https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/section-187.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227... 187 (1) For the purposes of paragraph 186(a), a business visitor to Canada is a foreign national who ... seeks to engage in international business activities in Canada without directly entering the Canadian labour market. ... (3) For the purpose of subsection (1), a foreign national seeks to engage in international business activities in Canada without directly entering the Canadian labour market only if (a) the primary source of remuneration for the business activities is outside Canada; and (b) the principal place of business and actual place of accrual of profits remain predominately outside Canada. > If you can do that, a Canadian could too. So you're directly competing with "local interests". You may send your letter of complaint to the Government of Canada's department of Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship. I'm kidding. :) I guess the interests to which you're referring are just tautologically not the interests I meant. Apologies for the confusion.