4 ms·

Do you have the same concerns about water or food? Why does it matter that it stops benefitting you if you stop taking it?

dd8601fn 3mo ago
Oh god… if only I could quit food, too.
- estearum 3mo ago
  No but like... why is it a concern? Money? The health problems that GLPs produce help people avoid are way more costly than the drugs will ever be. Especially now that the market is so competitive and will only get moreso.
  - treis 3mo ago
    For me, historically drugs like this for ADHD or depression or gastric bypass or whatever tend to lose effectiveness over time as the body adjusts. Not for everyone but for enough where you've got a short term gain that ultimately compounds the original problem. Medication can be a slippery slope into side effects and rotating dosages/medicines. Especially for behavioral medicines.
    - astrange 3mo ago
      ADHD medications do not lose effectiveness over time. That's magnesium deficiency.
      - disgruntledphd2 3mo ago
        > ADHD medications do not lose effectiveness over time. I mean, they're mostly stimulants, which definitely lose effectiveness over time. It would be really weird if they didn't as that's basically how our bodies work in general. Note: I have been prescribed said medication, but have not started taking them yet so I might be entirely wrong in the practicalities (and how would one disentangle the psychological impact of medication from the physiological impact?).
        estearum 3mo ago
        I had the same intuition as you but I looked it up in light of GP's comment and it actually seems not so clear that's how it works. Apparently the physiological effects of prescription ADHD meds will tend to still be ~same intensity for years and years. Patients often report weakened cognitive/psychological effectiveness, but obviously that's very hard to compare...
        disgruntledphd2 3mo ago
        > Apparently the physiological effects of prescription ADHD meds will tend to still be ~same intensity for years and years. I'm not sure how one would even measure this. Like, back in the halcyon days of my youth I took a bunch of stimulants, and experentially there was definitely less impact over time (habituation is a thing). And given that ADHD is predominantly a psychological issue, then the only measure that matters is that of the patients themselves. Do you have some of the sources you mentioned available, I'd be interested to understand the details?
        astrange 2mo ago
        > Like, back in the halcyon days of my youth I took a bunch of stimulants, and experentially there was definitely less impact over time (habituation is a thing). That's magnesium deficiency. Promise. (Or side effects from getting worse sleep.)
        disgruntledphd2 2mo ago
        > That's magnesium deficiency. Promise. I find that incredibly hard to believe (although my doctor did mention that magnesium supplements were worth taking). Can you point me to some research that support this claim please?
        aw3glp1app 2mo ago
        [flagged]
  - dd8601fn 3mo ago
    Yeah, money, and just signing up to regularly inject a thing forever. Anything that’s “starting tomorrow and until the day you die” just seems like a thing I shouldn’t take lightly. Also I’m not badly, badly overweight. So it’s not like “it’s this or cardiac arrest in a year or two”, for me. I should probably be dealing with my issues the old timey way. The stakes look very different for other people, obviously.
logicchains 3mo ago
Water and food have a milder risk profile. The FDA (https://glp-1.health/blog/glp1-obesity-eligibility-bmi-chart/ https://glp-1.health/blog/glp1-obesity-eligibility-bmi-chart...) recommends "GLP-1 weight loss medications (Wegovy, Zepbound) if your BMI is 30 or higher, or if your BMI is 27 or higher with at least one weight-related health condition such as high blood pressure, type 2 diabetes, or sleep apnea". This is because there are side effects such that GLP-1 meds have not been shown to produce a net positive benefit-to-risk ratio for people who are only mildly overweight.
- estearum 3mo ago
  > This is because there are side effects such that GLP-1 meds have not been shown to produce a net positive benefit-to-risk ratio for people who are only mildly overweight. Importantly, this is different from "GLP-1 meds have been shown not to produce a net positive benefit-to-risk ratio" Anyway nearly all of the side effects for these drugs are just discomfort. Not even really obvious they should be called "risks." Meanwhile, the vast majority of Americans who are not already diabetic or have HTN will soon, and it would be quite a surprise to learn these drugs don't have protective effect.
jollyllama 3mo ago
It's possible to secure those independently in a wide variety of scenarios. It's harder to DIY your own GLPs.

dd8601fn 3mo ago

Oh god… if only I could quit food, too.

estearum 3mo ago
No but like... why is it a concern? Money? The health problems that GLPs produce help people avoid are way more costly than the drugs will ever be. Especially now that the market is so competitive and will only get moreso.
- treis 3mo ago
  For me, historically drugs like this for ADHD or depression or gastric bypass or whatever tend to lose effectiveness over time as the body adjusts. Not for everyone but for enough where you've got a short term gain that ultimately compounds the original problem. Medication can be a slippery slope into side effects and rotating dosages/medicines. Especially for behavioral medicines.
  - astrange 3mo ago
    ADHD medications do not lose effectiveness over time. That's magnesium deficiency.
    - disgruntledphd2 3mo ago
      > ADHD medications do not lose effectiveness over time. I mean, they're mostly stimulants, which definitely lose effectiveness over time. It would be really weird if they didn't as that's basically how our bodies work in general. Note: I have been prescribed said medication, but have not started taking them yet so I might be entirely wrong in the practicalities (and how would one disentangle the psychological impact of medication from the physiological impact?).
      - estearum 3mo ago
        I had the same intuition as you but I looked it up in light of GP's comment and it actually seems not so clear that's how it works. Apparently the physiological effects of prescription ADHD meds will tend to still be ~same intensity for years and years. Patients often report weakened cognitive/psychological effectiveness, but obviously that's very hard to compare...
        disgruntledphd2 3mo ago
        > Apparently the physiological effects of prescription ADHD meds will tend to still be ~same intensity for years and years. I'm not sure how one would even measure this. Like, back in the halcyon days of my youth I took a bunch of stimulants, and experentially there was definitely less impact over time (habituation is a thing). And given that ADHD is predominantly a psychological issue, then the only measure that matters is that of the patients themselves. Do you have some of the sources you mentioned available, I'd be interested to understand the details?
        astrange 2mo ago
        > Like, back in the halcyon days of my youth I took a bunch of stimulants, and experentially there was definitely less impact over time (habituation is a thing). That's magnesium deficiency. Promise. (Or side effects from getting worse sleep.)
        disgruntledphd2 2mo ago
        > That's magnesium deficiency. Promise. I find that incredibly hard to believe (although my doctor did mention that magnesium supplements were worth taking). Can you point me to some research that support this claim please?
        aw3glp1app 2mo ago
        [flagged]
- dd8601fn 3mo ago
  Yeah, money, and just signing up to regularly inject a thing forever. Anything that’s “starting tomorrow and until the day you die” just seems like a thing I shouldn’t take lightly. Also I’m not badly, badly overweight. So it’s not like “it’s this or cardiac arrest in a year or two”, for me. I should probably be dealing with my issues the old timey way. The stakes look very different for other people, obviously.

logicchains 3mo ago

Water and food have a milder risk profile. The FDA (https://glp-1.health/blog/glp1-obesity-eligibility-bmi-chart/ https://glp-1.health/blog/glp1-obesity-eligibility-bmi-chart...) recommends "GLP-1 weight loss medications (Wegovy, Zepbound) if your BMI is 30 or higher, or if your BMI is 27 or higher with at least one weight-related health condition such as high blood pressure, type 2 diabetes, or sleep apnea". This is because there are side effects such that GLP-1 meds have not been shown to produce a net positive benefit-to-risk ratio for people who are only mildly overweight.

estearum 3mo ago
> This is because there are side effects such that GLP-1 meds have not been shown to produce a net positive benefit-to-risk ratio for people who are only mildly overweight. Importantly, this is different from "GLP-1 meds have been shown not to produce a net positive benefit-to-risk ratio" Anyway nearly all of the side effects for these drugs are just discomfort. Not even really obvious they should be called "risks." Meanwhile, the vast majority of Americans who are not already diabetic or have HTN will soon, and it would be quite a surprise to learn these drugs don't have protective effect.

jollyllama 3mo ago

It's possible to secure those independently in a wide variety of scenarios. It's harder to DIY your own GLPs.