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Apologies in advance, but this reads like someone who hasn't actually had kids. Keep in mind that people who have kids still only have a small number, and there

Apologies in advance, but this reads like someone who hasn't actually had kids. Keep in mind that people who have kids still only have a small number, and there is luck involved. You can't decide that they will eat their vegetables. You can't decide that they are going to be diligent in doing their homework. And you can't decide whether they take an interest in what society shows them. Yes, you can open your mouth, spilling out your years of experience, and you can make incentives like offering dessert when they eat their meals. But that's all you can really do. If there are posters everywhere telling kids to jump off bridges, what are you to do? Stop your kids from looking at them? Just try to talk to them, explaining how big bridge is just there to get your money? Anyone who has kids knows that they can't control them. You are very dependent on the rest of society behaving.

abc123abc123 2mo ago
[flagged]
- program_whiz 2mo ago
  Interesting, so this was effective when you were a child and you only listened and never did anything your parents told you not to? Sounds like if that was effective it might be your personality, but most people aren't like that. The vast majority of kids will require borderline abuse to force them to do things on a regular they don't want to. If they are forced, it tends to breed rebellion behind their parents back (there's a reason that the stereotype of the naughty "preachers kid" exists). https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5193236/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5193236/ """ Similar to findings regarding smoking and alcohol use, harsh parenting is considered to be one of the most important predictors of adolescent involvement in risky sexual behaviors """
  - dennis_jeeves2 2mo ago
    > If they are forced, it tends to breed rebellion behind their parents back (there's a reason that the stereotype of the naughty "preachers kid" exists). That's part of parenting - i.e not being agreeable, correct?
    - abc123abc123 2mo ago
      This is the truth. You are a parent, not a friend. Yes, there will be attempts at circumvention, these will be detected and punished. Modern parenting is not science, it is woke b.s. and has led to young people today with multiple psychological illnesses, apathy and the Peter Pan syndrome.
- lordnacho 2mo ago
  > Yes, you can decide that the child will eat vegetable and do their homework. You literally cannot. When I was 5, I was told I couldn't go out and play until I'd eaten my lunch. I didn't go out and play. But I also didn't eat my lunch. > Grow a spine, set rules, and enforce them. That is how responsible adults are made. If not, your children will still be children when they grow up, and you will be responsible for it. Despite your best efforts, your kids will not turn out the way you wanted.
  - abc123abc123 2mo ago
    Clearly you ate lunch eventually, or you would not be here to write this message.
    - lordnacho 2mo ago
      I didn't, I had dinner.
program_whiz 2mo ago
Well said, it also reads like someone who greatly overestimates their own control in what they think and "decide" to do. We are products of society unless we are truly living completely alone in the wilderness. Someone above said it better, if most students in class had easy access to heroine and were using heroine talking about how great it is, its up to luck whether your kid listens to you or friends, ads, influencers, etc. The numbers are in, and parents aren't winning. Did people do exactly what their parents said? If so it sounds like they would just jump off a bridge if their parents told them to. Oh wait, you didn't listen to your parents? Ok, so you just did what you wanted, so your parents didn't have control of you? In that case, we can't really say "parents just control your kids" can we? I'd also be curious how well these same proponents would think "abstinance only" works (e.g. tell your kids just don't have sex). The same types usually say "you can't stop it, so we need to have robust education and safety measures". A 5-16 year old has an undeveloped brain, and they badly want to fit in and have fun, and they have no concept of what long term even means. They are facing a deluge of influences that are spending billions with the brightest minds to influence them. They are surrounded by peers with full uncensored internet access for ~8 hours a day. Like all children they are curious and a bit rebellious against their parents at times. Its just realistic to say "just tell your kids not to do it".
tstrimple 2mo ago
Honestly this really just reflects on you and what you're capable of doing. All of my children eat vegetables. My middle daughter decided to become a vegetarian at 14. I can absolutely make sure that they do their homework. Otherwise there will be consequences. It's not been an issue. They are smart and get excellent grades. I can absolutely influence their ability and desire to take interests in things. It starts with taking interest yourself. My wife and I read books like they are going to disappear and my children have followed suit. We required our children to do some sort of extra-curricular activities and if they didn't choose them then we would. They learned pretty quickly to pick out things they are actually interested in doing. All of these things that are somehow "impossible" for you are just facts about how my children were raised. And no, their success or failure is not up to the lowest common denominator in society. It's up to us as parents to raise them and equip them for the world. Not complain about how the world should change so you don't have to tell your kids "no".
- lordnacho 2mo ago
  This is a simple n=low issue. You get a kid, and they are not extreme. Most kids will indeed respond to parenting. Don't you ever think about what would happen if your kid was born with a handicap? You talk like I'm somehow not reading to my kids, or not telling them to do things that are good for them? Have you ever considered that some people will do what you say, and others will not? Do you really think that given any kid, just parenting will get you the outcome you want? If you are happy with how your kids are, you are not skilled, you are just lucky. You are even so lucky that you can have the satisfaction of thinking you are skilled.

abc123abc123 2mo ago

[flagged]

program_whiz 2mo ago
Interesting, so this was effective when you were a child and you only listened and never did anything your parents told you not to? Sounds like if that was effective it might be your personality, but most people aren't like that. The vast majority of kids will require borderline abuse to force them to do things on a regular they don't want to. If they are forced, it tends to breed rebellion behind their parents back (there's a reason that the stereotype of the naughty "preachers kid" exists). https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5193236/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5193236/ """ Similar to findings regarding smoking and alcohol use, harsh parenting is considered to be one of the most important predictors of adolescent involvement in risky sexual behaviors """
- dennis_jeeves2 2mo ago
  > If they are forced, it tends to breed rebellion behind their parents back (there's a reason that the stereotype of the naughty "preachers kid" exists). That's part of parenting - i.e not being agreeable, correct?
  - abc123abc123 2mo ago
    This is the truth. You are a parent, not a friend. Yes, there will be attempts at circumvention, these will be detected and punished. Modern parenting is not science, it is woke b.s. and has led to young people today with multiple psychological illnesses, apathy and the Peter Pan syndrome.
lordnacho 2mo ago
> Yes, you can decide that the child will eat vegetable and do their homework. You literally cannot. When I was 5, I was told I couldn't go out and play until I'd eaten my lunch. I didn't go out and play. But I also didn't eat my lunch. > Grow a spine, set rules, and enforce them. That is how responsible adults are made. If not, your children will still be children when they grow up, and you will be responsible for it. Despite your best efforts, your kids will not turn out the way you wanted.
- abc123abc123 2mo ago
  Clearly you ate lunch eventually, or you would not be here to write this message.
  - lordnacho 2mo ago
    I didn't, I had dinner.

program_whiz 2mo ago

Well said, it also reads like someone who greatly overestimates their own control in what they think and "decide" to do. We are products of society unless we are truly living completely alone in the wilderness. Someone above said it better, if most students in class had easy access to heroine and were using heroine talking about how great it is, its up to luck whether your kid listens to you or friends, ads, influencers, etc. The numbers are in, and parents aren't winning. Did people do exactly what their parents said? If so it sounds like they would just jump off a bridge if their parents told them to. Oh wait, you didn't listen to your parents? Ok, so you just did what you wanted, so your parents didn't have control of you? In that case, we can't really say "parents just control your kids" can we? I'd also be curious how well these same proponents would think "abstinance only" works (e.g. tell your kids just don't have sex). The same types usually say "you can't stop it, so we need to have robust education and safety measures". A 5-16 year old has an undeveloped brain, and they badly want to fit in and have fun, and they have no concept of what long term even means. They are facing a deluge of influences that are spending billions with the brightest minds to influence them. They are surrounded by peers with full uncensored internet access for ~8 hours a day. Like all children they are curious and a bit rebellious against their parents at times. Its just realistic to say "just tell your kids not to do it".

tstrimple 2mo ago

Honestly this really just reflects on you and what you're capable of doing. All of my children eat vegetables. My middle daughter decided to become a vegetarian at 14. I can absolutely make sure that they do their homework. Otherwise there will be consequences. It's not been an issue. They are smart and get excellent grades. I can absolutely influence their ability and desire to take interests in things. It starts with taking interest yourself. My wife and I read books like they are going to disappear and my children have followed suit. We required our children to do some sort of extra-curricular activities and if they didn't choose them then we would. They learned pretty quickly to pick out things they are actually interested in doing. All of these things that are somehow "impossible" for you are just facts about how my children were raised. And no, their success or failure is not up to the lowest common denominator in society. It's up to us as parents to raise them and equip them for the world. Not complain about how the world should change so you don't have to tell your kids "no".

lordnacho 2mo ago
This is a simple n=low issue. You get a kid, and they are not extreme. Most kids will indeed respond to parenting. Don't you ever think about what would happen if your kid was born with a handicap? You talk like I'm somehow not reading to my kids, or not telling them to do things that are good for them? Have you ever considered that some people will do what you say, and others will not? Do you really think that given any kid, just parenting will get you the outcome you want? If you are happy with how your kids are, you are not skilled, you are just lucky. You are even so lucky that you can have the satisfaction of thinking you are skilled.