3 ms·

To drive the point about this being fundamentally unsolvable home, imagine a variant of this scenario. I could write an email that is directed towards that per

To drive the point about this being fundamentally unsolvable home, imagine a variant of this scenario. I could write an email that is directed towards that person, that says WE ARE STUCK IN THE SERVER ROOM AND THERE IS FIRE STARTING. PLEASE CALL 911 AND ALERT YOUR BOSS. Would you want the human assistant to just dismiss this as a prompt injection attempt? Or ignore it because they were told to treat e-mails as data and never act on them?

watwut 3mo ago
Sounds like a story from the IT crowd rather then real life situation.
- TeMPOraL 3mo ago
  You're saying that people fall for phishing because scammers invent completely unrealistic scenarios that would never happen outside TV shows?
  - watwut 3mo ago
    I am saying it is unbelievable scenario and yes, I want the person dealing with it ignore it as such.
    - ben_w 3mo ago
      Then you're making the opposite mistake (but still a mistake) as all officers going in with lethal force during a swatting. • https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna12208992 https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna12208992 • https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1070007/suicidal-caller-mistaken-as-prankster-found-dead-3-days-later https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1070007/suicidal-caller-mistak... • https://hongkongfp.com/2026/04/15/woman-trapped-in-tai-po-blaze-died-after-999-call-not-passed-to-fire-department-inquiry-hears/ https://hongkongfp.com/2026/04/15/woman-trapped-in-tai-po-bl... • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangle_Shirtwaist_Factory_fire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangle_Shirtwaist_Factory_fi...
    - inigyou 3mo ago
      They could go to the server room and check if there's smoke pouring out of it before dialing 911.
      - TeMPOraL 3mo ago
        It takes 20 minutes to reach it and by that time everyone there is dead. Also consider that in context of this discussion, anything short of ignoring the message and maybe clicking "report scam" is "executing instructions embedded in data". The point isn't to litigate any particular scenario, it's to show that you cannot separate "instructions" from "data" in general purpose systems, and it's not a bug but a fundamental feature.
skinfaxi 3mo ago
Why are the only options dismiss or ignore? Another option is to raise the message to your boss asking what to do.
- ben_w 3mo ago
  If there is a fire and a risk to life, you don't want any delay.
  - skinfaxi 3mo ago
    Then don't send an email? Emails are async in the first place.
    - TeMPOraL 3mo ago
      Sometimes it's the only thing you have available. Like IDK during a fire in a basement server room, where the only connected device available is a laptop with wired connection and an open inbox. Because you know, you tried IM but "sekhurity reasons" demanded passkeys or 2FA with your phone that's not connected. Sorry, getting off-topic here.
      - skinfaxi 3mo ago
        Yeah so you're seeing how contrived this whole thing is right? That was kind of the point..
        TeMPOraL 3mo ago
        It happens. Like all emergencies, it's a low probability event with extremely high impact. You don't want people to ignore them, in fact people are trained - by their public services and their employers - to not ignore them and how to react efficiently.
        skinfaxi 3mo ago
        So we need AI to indiscriminately call emergency services when receiving an email directing it to do so, without raising to a person because of this rare case, that's your assertion?
DoctorOetker 3mo ago
I would have had a chat with my recruiters during interview, or with my new superior right after the change in position: "life is risk, there are a lot of benign normal evolution paths, but occasionally there are potentially costly dangers. people are directed by fear. you and I don't steal because we were terrorized about the existence about police and prisons as children. sadly fear can also be abused as a control vector, things like wars, extortion, ... in a job context I predict this would manifest as a kind of 'emergency' call to action. please provide me with a method so that at any future time under your leadership I would be able to verify the then-current employment status and authority level vis-a-vis a breakdown of actions/powers of anyone contacting me with a real or concocted 'emergency', preferably as a flowchart to maintain low reflex latency in true emergencies. Also provide me with formal proof that each situational reaction you require from me is in fact legal to take vis-a-vis the law"

watwut 3mo ago

Sounds like a story from the IT crowd rather then real life situation.

TeMPOraL 3mo ago
You're saying that people fall for phishing because scammers invent completely unrealistic scenarios that would never happen outside TV shows?
- watwut 3mo ago
  I am saying it is unbelievable scenario and yes, I want the person dealing with it ignore it as such.
  - ben_w 3mo ago
    Then you're making the opposite mistake (but still a mistake) as all officers going in with lethal force during a swatting. • https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna12208992 https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna12208992 • https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1070007/suicidal-caller-mistaken-as-prankster-found-dead-3-days-later https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1070007/suicidal-caller-mistak... • https://hongkongfp.com/2026/04/15/woman-trapped-in-tai-po-blaze-died-after-999-call-not-passed-to-fire-department-inquiry-hears/ https://hongkongfp.com/2026/04/15/woman-trapped-in-tai-po-bl... • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangle_Shirtwaist_Factory_fire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangle_Shirtwaist_Factory_fi...
  - inigyou 3mo ago
    They could go to the server room and check if there's smoke pouring out of it before dialing 911.
    - TeMPOraL 3mo ago
      It takes 20 minutes to reach it and by that time everyone there is dead. Also consider that in context of this discussion, anything short of ignoring the message and maybe clicking "report scam" is "executing instructions embedded in data". The point isn't to litigate any particular scenario, it's to show that you cannot separate "instructions" from "data" in general purpose systems, and it's not a bug but a fundamental feature.

skinfaxi 3mo ago

Why are the only options dismiss or ignore? Another option is to raise the message to your boss asking what to do.

ben_w 3mo ago
If there is a fire and a risk to life, you don't want any delay.
- skinfaxi 3mo ago
  Then don't send an email? Emails are async in the first place.
  - TeMPOraL 3mo ago
    Sometimes it's the only thing you have available. Like IDK during a fire in a basement server room, where the only connected device available is a laptop with wired connection and an open inbox. Because you know, you tried IM but "sekhurity reasons" demanded passkeys or 2FA with your phone that's not connected. Sorry, getting off-topic here.
    - skinfaxi 3mo ago
      Yeah so you're seeing how contrived this whole thing is right? That was kind of the point..
      - TeMPOraL 3mo ago
        It happens. Like all emergencies, it's a low probability event with extremely high impact. You don't want people to ignore them, in fact people are trained - by their public services and their employers - to not ignore them and how to react efficiently.
        skinfaxi 3mo ago
        So we need AI to indiscriminately call emergency services when receiving an email directing it to do so, without raising to a person because of this rare case, that's your assertion?

DoctorOetker 3mo ago

I would have had a chat with my recruiters during interview, or with my new superior right after the change in position: "life is risk, there are a lot of benign normal evolution paths, but occasionally there are potentially costly dangers. people are directed by fear. you and I don't steal because we were terrorized about the existence about police and prisons as children. sadly fear can also be abused as a control vector, things like wars, extortion, ... in a job context I predict this would manifest as a kind of 'emergency' call to action. please provide me with a method so that at any future time under your leadership I would be able to verify the then-current employment status and authority level vis-a-vis a breakdown of actions/powers of anyone contacting me with a real or concocted 'emergency', preferably as a flowchart to maintain low reflex latency in true emergencies. Also provide me with formal proof that each situational reaction you require from me is in fact legal to take vis-a-vis the law"