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I am not sure how it is in USA but in my country golf courses are abuse of public resources for (almost) private use. For a very few who can lobby enough for re

I am not sure how it is in USA but in my country golf courses are abuse of public resources for (almost) private use. For a very few who can lobby enough for renewal of these leases and these are kept out of reach of the normal public, either by rule or by cost, sometimes both. Golf courses are lungs of many of the growing cities, across the world, but I do believe they should not be kept exclusive. Also, this comes directly from feudal/colonial times here. Those also require too much of other natural and public resources to be maintained.

rickmf 2mo ago
US is a mixed bag. Where i am from, Michigan, we have over 600 courses and 87% of them are open to the public.
topato 2mo ago
Yeah, I could imagine golf being a sore spot for Indians. I never imagined India would even be a hotspot for golf, but given the amount of corruption going on, it would make sense that golf courses would be foisted upon the public. It’s always discouraging to see the amount of upper class Indians who, despite colonial times being long gone, are still very willing to sell out their countrymen to appease whites or to fit a British/white ideal. I hope I’m wrong about this impression, and I’m just seeing cherry picked news articles, but your reaction makes me think otherwise….
trollbridge 2mo ago
In the USA they are overwhelmingly public and are desperate for customers. The handful of private ones near me are also desperate for new members, and several country clubs have ended up closing. Considering some of the golf courses that have closed around me ended up being converted into Amazon distribution facilities, I am not terribly excited about the idea of more golf courses closing.
- crossroadsguy 2mo ago
  Were those private lands/properties? Because in my country a lot (if I can't say 'most') are actually on public land with weird and disgustingly cheap leases which can be closed at a finger snap but somehow very few Govts have tried it because every Govt have ministers (and of course bureaucrats) who are members there or made members there, and then there are their kids and families etc. So no they can't be turned into building constructions really, I mean assuming the limits of corruption in my country. Because technically anything can be sold if we go down that way. Also, my city is reclaiming lakes, demolishing illegal constructions and parks are also being reclaimed and cleaned up etc. Not perfect, far from it, but it's a start and no, that Amazon Warehouse thing I am not expecting to see here. People are divided strongly on religious and ideological lines here but everyone's tempers run high whenever Govt tries touching a public land, green patch, and now we just take matters into our hands whenever that happens.
  - trollbridge 2mo ago
    It’s private land. There are a handful of government owned golf courses (sort of like parks that have tennis courts), but they are not common.
  - matkoniecz 2mo ago
    > Were those private lands/properties? In my city (Kraków, Poland) there was attempted to waste enormous amount of public land and turn it into private golf course, funded from public money. It seems it was stopped after protests from citizens.
- contubernio 2mo ago
  In the USA as elsewhere golf courses are incredible wastes of water and false green spaces that would function better as green spaces were they actually parks open to the public they serve the wealthy. What is different is that in the US there is very little real (operational) worry about waste of water (or other resources) - at least compared to other places - and there is lots of space compared to other places.
  - trollbridge 2mo ago
    That is an overly broad generalisation. Where I live, golf courses aren’t irrigated at all - they just rely on rainwater, like every other farm does. One of the golf courses near me has tee times for $10. I do not consider that something that only “serves the wealthy”. They also periodically close the course and open it up for RC plane enthusiasts. Another one you can easily go for a walk in - I often do. It is effectively a public space.
    - gnz11 2mo ago
      Irrigation isn’t the only concern but also the loads of herbicides and pesticides that get dumped on them.
      - trollbridge 2mo ago
        … which also happens if the land were people’s lawns, were farmland, or commercial space with lawns.
        deleted 2mo ago
        [deleted]
        gnz11 2mo ago
        Yes, that’s also a problem too.
    - scotty79 2mo ago
      The spot you live in might be an outlier. Golf courses in US use half a trillion gallons of fresh water annually.
navaed01 2mo ago
Malcolm Gladwell did a great podcast on golf courses in prime urban spaces https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/revisionist-history/a-good-walk-spoiled https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/revisionist-history/a-good-w... In some parts of the US it is certainly the case that golf courses are private and as a citizen you notice there are v. Few parks but lots of good courses. Many of the courses pay little in taxes so they’re also feels that there is a disparity between how the rest of society functions and golf courses. Los Angeles is a v. Good example - huge urban sprawl - poor urban planning - few green spaces - amazing golf courses - as a runner I personally noticed I would be running around golf courses and not have any parks near me
- 0ldblu3 2mo ago
  Malcolm is not much more than a pop physicologist who is a very good writer. It looks like he is going to get his way with that golf course in LA that has some sort of vote happinging soon. Here is what will happen.. "the public interest" will win, and for a while it will be a park of some sort, then there will be a slow but inexorable push by the city council to reduce the size of the park by selling the land to developers. 15 years down the road it will be luxury homes for the ultra wealthy and nobody will be recreating there.
  - crossroadsguy 2mo ago
    So vote better. Fight harder. Make sure it stays green and opens to public at reasonable rates (so that all can access) if not free.
scotty79 2mo ago
> Golf courses are lungs of many of the growing cities, across the world What? Why and how? And why wouldn't leaving a patch of forest there be way more efficient?
philip-b 2mo ago
Are you saying your country's government, for some reason, spends its money on private golf courses?
- matkoniecz 2mo ago
  Kraków, Poland tried but it was cancelled after protests.
cmiles8 2mo ago
In the US many golf courses are owned by local governments as part of public parks. Many new courses in the US are also built on non-developable land like former landfills. Not trying to defend all courses, but at least in the US it’s not just uniformly bad.
- mark-r 2mo ago
  Within 5 miles of my house are 5 golf courses. I believe only 1 is government owned, by the city.
aaron695 2mo ago
[dead]
nayuki 2mo ago
In Toronto, I think golf courses are built on flood plains along rivers (Don, Humber, etc.). Some other flood plains are public parks. Houses are generally not built on flood plains.
- rickmf 2mo ago
  this is true in a lot of cases. its land that otherwise isn't great for any kind of development.
fluorinerocket 2mo ago
Why don't the "In my country" posters ever name the country
- crossroadsguy 2mo ago
  Because it doesn’t matter in certain cases and the needy may just click on the profile and kinda figure out if they are so inclined. Or someone can ask and they can reply.

rickmf 2mo ago

US is a mixed bag. Where i am from, Michigan, we have over 600 courses and 87% of them are open to the public.

topato 2mo ago

Yeah, I could imagine golf being a sore spot for Indians. I never imagined India would even be a hotspot for golf, but given the amount of corruption going on, it would make sense that golf courses would be foisted upon the public. It’s always discouraging to see the amount of upper class Indians who, despite colonial times being long gone, are still very willing to sell out their countrymen to appease whites or to fit a British/white ideal. I hope I’m wrong about this impression, and I’m just seeing cherry picked news articles, but your reaction makes me think otherwise….

trollbridge 2mo ago

In the USA they are overwhelmingly public and are desperate for customers. The handful of private ones near me are also desperate for new members, and several country clubs have ended up closing. Considering some of the golf courses that have closed around me ended up being converted into Amazon distribution facilities, I am not terribly excited about the idea of more golf courses closing.

crossroadsguy 2mo ago
Were those private lands/properties? Because in my country a lot (if I can't say 'most') are actually on public land with weird and disgustingly cheap leases which can be closed at a finger snap but somehow very few Govts have tried it because every Govt have ministers (and of course bureaucrats) who are members there or made members there, and then there are their kids and families etc. So no they can't be turned into building constructions really, I mean assuming the limits of corruption in my country. Because technically anything can be sold if we go down that way. Also, my city is reclaiming lakes, demolishing illegal constructions and parks are also being reclaimed and cleaned up etc. Not perfect, far from it, but it's a start and no, that Amazon Warehouse thing I am not expecting to see here. People are divided strongly on religious and ideological lines here but everyone's tempers run high whenever Govt tries touching a public land, green patch, and now we just take matters into our hands whenever that happens.
- trollbridge 2mo ago
  It’s private land. There are a handful of government owned golf courses (sort of like parks that have tennis courts), but they are not common.
- matkoniecz 2mo ago
  > Were those private lands/properties? In my city (Kraków, Poland) there was attempted to waste enormous amount of public land and turn it into private golf course, funded from public money. It seems it was stopped after protests from citizens.
contubernio 2mo ago
In the USA as elsewhere golf courses are incredible wastes of water and false green spaces that would function better as green spaces were they actually parks open to the public they serve the wealthy. What is different is that in the US there is very little real (operational) worry about waste of water (or other resources) - at least compared to other places - and there is lots of space compared to other places.
- trollbridge 2mo ago
  That is an overly broad generalisation. Where I live, golf courses aren’t irrigated at all - they just rely on rainwater, like every other farm does. One of the golf courses near me has tee times for $10. I do not consider that something that only “serves the wealthy”. They also periodically close the course and open it up for RC plane enthusiasts. Another one you can easily go for a walk in - I often do. It is effectively a public space.
  - gnz11 2mo ago
    Irrigation isn’t the only concern but also the loads of herbicides and pesticides that get dumped on them.
    - trollbridge 2mo ago
      … which also happens if the land were people’s lawns, were farmland, or commercial space with lawns.
      - deleted 2mo ago
        [deleted]
      - gnz11 2mo ago
        Yes, that’s also a problem too.
  - scotty79 2mo ago
    The spot you live in might be an outlier. Golf courses in US use half a trillion gallons of fresh water annually.

navaed01 2mo ago

Malcolm Gladwell did a great podcast on golf courses in prime urban spaces https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/revisionist-history/a-good-walk-spoiled https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/revisionist-history/a-good-w... In some parts of the US it is certainly the case that golf courses are private and as a citizen you notice there are v. Few parks but lots of good courses. Many of the courses pay little in taxes so they’re also feels that there is a disparity between how the rest of society functions and golf courses. Los Angeles is a v. Good example - huge urban sprawl - poor urban planning - few green spaces - amazing golf courses - as a runner I personally noticed I would be running around golf courses and not have any parks near me

0ldblu3 2mo ago
Malcolm is not much more than a pop physicologist who is a very good writer. It looks like he is going to get his way with that golf course in LA that has some sort of vote happinging soon. Here is what will happen.. "the public interest" will win, and for a while it will be a park of some sort, then there will be a slow but inexorable push by the city council to reduce the size of the park by selling the land to developers. 15 years down the road it will be luxury homes for the ultra wealthy and nobody will be recreating there.
- crossroadsguy 2mo ago
  So vote better. Fight harder. Make sure it stays green and opens to public at reasonable rates (so that all can access) if not free.

scotty79 2mo ago

> Golf courses are lungs of many of the growing cities, across the world What? Why and how? And why wouldn't leaving a patch of forest there be way more efficient?

philip-b 2mo ago

Are you saying your country's government, for some reason, spends its money on private golf courses?

matkoniecz 2mo ago
Kraków, Poland tried but it was cancelled after protests.

cmiles8 2mo ago

In the US many golf courses are owned by local governments as part of public parks. Many new courses in the US are also built on non-developable land like former landfills. Not trying to defend all courses, but at least in the US it’s not just uniformly bad.

mark-r 2mo ago
Within 5 miles of my house are 5 golf courses. I believe only 1 is government owned, by the city.

aaron695 2mo ago

[dead]

nayuki 2mo ago

In Toronto, I think golf courses are built on flood plains along rivers (Don, Humber, etc.). Some other flood plains are public parks. Houses are generally not built on flood plains.

rickmf 2mo ago
this is true in a lot of cases. its land that otherwise isn't great for any kind of development.

fluorinerocket 2mo ago

Why don't the "In my country" posters ever name the country

crossroadsguy 2mo ago
Because it doesn’t matter in certain cases and the needy may just click on the profile and kinda figure out if they are so inclined. Or someone can ask and they can reply.