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You could literally develop a hyper-intelligent advisor on how to kill people or perform dangerous hacks using ablated 'open source' AI. You can do this right n

You could literally develop a hyper-intelligent advisor on how to kill people or perform dangerous hacks using ablated 'open source' AI. You can do this right now, this very moment, and have an extremely adept advisor on how to do really, really bad things.

trollbridge 3mo ago
My level of trust in Anthropic/Google/OAI/Microsoft/Meta not to do bad things is about zero, so why should I trust them with this?
- catigula 3mo ago
  “We clearly can’t “trust” these companies not incentivized to randomly kill lots of people, so we might as well give everyone the ability to randomly kill lots of people”.
- quantum_state 3mo ago
  These companies are using anything at hand to trick people out of their money … be very careful…
wizzwizz4 3mo ago
I already know how to kill thousands of people. It's not conceptually difficult: more than a day's effort, sure, but what stops people from doing this kind of thing is not the lack of knowing how. https://xkcd.com/1958/ https://xkcd.com/1958/
- catigula 3mo ago
  No, you don't. What stops people is actually access to knowledge. There are killers of varying levels of efficacy; making killing easier means more people die. It's 1-1.
  - wizzwizz4 3mo ago
    A bold assertion. How many deaths can you attribute to this xkcd comic?
    - catigula 3mo ago
      The ideas are dumb. They wouldn't kill anyone, the barrier to entry is too high and you'd trivially be caught and punished.
  - esseph 3mo ago
    > What stops people is actually access to knowledge. Very untrue. I'm a combat vet. I spent years fighting an insurgency and therefore pretty good at that very task. I have the knowledge, so what stops me?
    - catigula 3mo ago
      FYI combat vets are a counter example. They frequently kill a lot of people effectively. See: the DC sniper.
      - esseph 3mo ago
        There are around 16 million living veterans. Between 4.5-6 million living US combat veterans. 5-8% of all mass casualty perpetrators are a combat veteran, between 92-95% of all mass casualty perpetrators are not combat veterans By far, there are more veteran suicides than there are mass casualties caused by combat veterans. Veterans are more likely to kill themselves than to kill you. DC sniper was 24 YEARS ago, prior to the invasion of Iraq during the GWOT. Not only that, John Allen Muhammad didn't even see combat, his job was to dismantle old rockets! He was a mechanic and truck driver! The point of discussion is: "What stops people is actually access to knowledge." Statistics show this to be clearly false: Knowledge is not required to be effective in causing a mass casualty event, in fact, lack of formal training is a higher predictor!
  - mrguyorama 3mo ago
    How many people have shot up electrical substations, a fairly trivial way to causing widespread harm that was popularized in the news just a few years ago. But it's only happened a couple times. Because most people just can't be assed to harm a hundred thousand others.
OkayPhysicist 3mo ago
So? The primary thing stopping people from doing really really bad things is, and always has been, most people not wanting to do bad things. It's never been difficult. Literally, right this second, you could grab a pen off your desk and pretty easy ram it into the neck of your nearest coworker. Killing's easy. You don't need some hyperintellect to tell you how to do it. The reason you haven't rammed a pen into your coworker's neck is the same reason why most possible really bad things don't happen: People don't want to do them.
- catigula 3mo ago
  It’s interesting that most of the examples people making this argument give are high consequence, high difficulty (could you actually murder your coworker with a pen? I’m skeptical.) low kill count methodologies of violence. We’re specifically talking about low difficulty, highly effective, high kill count methodologies of violence. And yes, being able to kill a lot of people trivially, even with huge consequences is something people do. Most countries don’t let you run around with an armory as a result of that.
  - iamnothere 3mo ago
    > Most countries don’t let you run around with an armory as a result of that. My country allows it!
  - OkayPhysicist 3mo ago
    I live in one of the exceptions to that, and still have zero concern that someone's going to shoot up my workplace. Again, civilization works because the vast majority of people are utterly repulsed by the idea of harming another person. Most of the hypotheticals that people come up with are things that could pretty trivially done by a mad scientist today. But that doesn't happen, because this isn't a comic book, there is nobody hell-bent on turning everyone into dinosaurs.

trollbridge 3mo ago

My level of trust in Anthropic/Google/OAI/Microsoft/Meta not to do bad things is about zero, so why should I trust them with this?

catigula 3mo ago
“We clearly can’t “trust” these companies not incentivized to randomly kill lots of people, so we might as well give everyone the ability to randomly kill lots of people”.
quantum_state 3mo ago
These companies are using anything at hand to trick people out of their money … be very careful…

wizzwizz4 3mo ago

I already know how to kill thousands of people. It's not conceptually difficult: more than a day's effort, sure, but what stops people from doing this kind of thing is not the lack of knowing how. https://xkcd.com/1958/ https://xkcd.com/1958/

catigula 3mo ago
No, you don't. What stops people is actually access to knowledge. There are killers of varying levels of efficacy; making killing easier means more people die. It's 1-1.
- wizzwizz4 3mo ago
  A bold assertion. How many deaths can you attribute to this xkcd comic?
  - catigula 3mo ago
    The ideas are dumb. They wouldn't kill anyone, the barrier to entry is too high and you'd trivially be caught and punished.
- esseph 3mo ago
  > What stops people is actually access to knowledge. Very untrue. I'm a combat vet. I spent years fighting an insurgency and therefore pretty good at that very task. I have the knowledge, so what stops me?
  - catigula 3mo ago
    FYI combat vets are a counter example. They frequently kill a lot of people effectively. See: the DC sniper.
    - esseph 3mo ago
      There are around 16 million living veterans. Between 4.5-6 million living US combat veterans. 5-8% of all mass casualty perpetrators are a combat veteran, between 92-95% of all mass casualty perpetrators are not combat veterans By far, there are more veteran suicides than there are mass casualties caused by combat veterans. Veterans are more likely to kill themselves than to kill you. DC sniper was 24 YEARS ago, prior to the invasion of Iraq during the GWOT. Not only that, John Allen Muhammad didn't even see combat, his job was to dismantle old rockets! He was a mechanic and truck driver! The point of discussion is: "What stops people is actually access to knowledge." Statistics show this to be clearly false: Knowledge is not required to be effective in causing a mass casualty event, in fact, lack of formal training is a higher predictor!
- mrguyorama 3mo ago
  How many people have shot up electrical substations, a fairly trivial way to causing widespread harm that was popularized in the news just a few years ago. But it's only happened a couple times. Because most people just can't be assed to harm a hundred thousand others.

OkayPhysicist 3mo ago

So? The primary thing stopping people from doing really really bad things is, and always has been, most people not wanting to do bad things. It's never been difficult. Literally, right this second, you could grab a pen off your desk and pretty easy ram it into the neck of your nearest coworker. Killing's easy. You don't need some hyperintellect to tell you how to do it. The reason you haven't rammed a pen into your coworker's neck is the same reason why most possible really bad things don't happen: People don't want to do them.

catigula 3mo ago
It’s interesting that most of the examples people making this argument give are high consequence, high difficulty (could you actually murder your coworker with a pen? I’m skeptical.) low kill count methodologies of violence. We’re specifically talking about low difficulty, highly effective, high kill count methodologies of violence. And yes, being able to kill a lot of people trivially, even with huge consequences is something people do. Most countries don’t let you run around with an armory as a result of that.
- iamnothere 3mo ago
  > Most countries don’t let you run around with an armory as a result of that. My country allows it!
- OkayPhysicist 3mo ago
  I live in one of the exceptions to that, and still have zero concern that someone's going to shoot up my workplace. Again, civilization works because the vast majority of people are utterly repulsed by the idea of harming another person. Most of the hypotheticals that people come up with are things that could pretty trivially done by a mad scientist today. But that doesn't happen, because this isn't a comic book, there is nobody hell-bent on turning everyone into dinosaurs.